GPS lock.... from high-rise... after take off?

[CaptinCrunch]

Hello there everyone. New operator here, 1st drone, 1st post (please be kind... LOL LOL

)

Scenario:

• Launching from 10th floor blacony
• Building stands at 30 stories
• Ability to hand launch and land (practiced at ground level)
• RTH height set to 100 meters (taller than building)

Problem:

• Due to balcony location, Mini Pro 3 only gets up to 9 or 10 GPS satelite, from the 10th floor.
• This results in Mini Pro 3 never getting a GPS lock, but DJI RC reports it can still take off (with caution)
• As I am new to flying, would like to always use "Return to Home" fuction for now
  

Extra info:

• At ground level, and about 20 feet away from the building in question, GPS count goes up to 15+, and establishes lock easily

Question:

>>>>To circumvent this non-locking issue:

• As I can manual launch by hand
• can I launch, and fly 20 - 30 feet away from building (from 10th floor)
• Hover
• and wait for the GPS to lock, similar to how it is capable of doing so at the ground level?

Thanks in advance for your help, one of the main reasons for buy the drone, was to be able to do flights from balcony...

 

[Droning on and on...]

Yes, but it will set the homepoint at that location rather than the building balcony. So two things when flying from this location:

• When flying away from the balcony to get a lock, head for an are that doesn't have people, cars, etc. below where the lock occurs and the home point is set.

This is so the drone automatically lands in a safe place should calamity strike, and you lose a control (like your RC has a hardware failure).​

• After getting a lock, ascend above the building, point the camera straight down, position yourself directly over where the balcony is, and reset the HP to the drone location.

This will bring it as close a possible to you so you perform a controlled landing on the balcony. Note that the Mini 3/P does not have the Precision Landing feature, so it will usually be within 5-10m horizontally of the HP. Left to itself, it may land on top of the building, or down on the ground.​

Also be familiar with your locale's local, regional, and national drone laws and regulations, as what I describe above may not comply with required distances from buildings.

In the US, it would be illegal to make a recreational flight like this, as it would violate minimum building clearance in the FAA regs.

 

[Bob in Savannah]

Interesting.. Obviously this is all high risk.

However, it should be accomplished quite easily. Hand launch from the balcony and then fly the drone right to where you get the 15+ satellites, acquire the RTH lock and go fly.. Just know where the drone will be returning to and then take control of it manually... Maybe im not understanding your question. You'll NEVER be able to acquire that RTH lock on the balcony so you need it right there in front/below you on the street level but you just have to be there and see it returning and then manually fly it to the balcony, right?

 

[Meta4]

• Launching from 10th floor blacony
• Building stands at 30 stories
• 
  
• As I am new to flying, would like to always use "Return to Home" fuction for now

You don't want to use RTH to autoland in that location.
It would RTH to a point above the location (if you were able to reset the homepoint to your location), then descend vertically to the landing point.
The drone would try to land on the 30th floor balcony.

You would need to fly the drone back manually.

There are quite a few complications in your scenario that could make things go wrong for a beginner flyer.

 

[CaptinCrunch]

Thanks everyone!

Yes = I should have mentioned that I understand that the balcony will NOT be the RTH location.

The idea is that RTH could bring it back to the building, about 20 feet away at a high altitude (taller than building), and I would then cancel RTH while it hovers above landing location, and then MANUALLY bring it down to my floor (10th), still staying about 20+ feet away from building.

I would then do a "hand" landing, where when it is at my balcony level, and manually bring the drone towards me, until I can simply brings it to my extended hand.

.... from what you fine folks are mentioning above, this sounds possible, and perhaps the safest method when attempting a balcony take off and landing?

 

[Yorkshire_Pud]

Two questions for CaptainCrunch, what happens if, for any reason, the drone loses and can not re-establish connection? What is under the drone 20ft or so out from the balcony?

Did you take note of the comments by Labroides (DJI forum) about the possibility of yaw-errors/magnetic interference from steel work in the building's concrete?

 

[CaptinCrunch]

20 - 30 ft away from building, off of balcony = parking lot (typically empty in early A.M., when I practice).

I did notice that the Yaw-errors comment. My thought was to practice this theory from ground level, hand-launching, moving 20 ft away, and resetting RTH point (once GPS lock established), and testing this method.

 

[Yorkshire_Pud]

20 - 30 ft away from building, off of balcony = parking lot (typically empty in early A.M., when I practice).

I did notice that the Yaw-errors comment. My thought was to practice this theory from ground level, hand-launching, moving 20 ft away, and resetting RTH point (once GPS lock established), and testing this method.

No amount of practise in the car park will be of any use if steel work on the balcony/building causes a yaw error.
Do a google for "flyaway" and look for nicely curved flight paths to drone death.

 

[Felix le Chat]

Agree with comments about reinforced concrete construction (basically, the entire building is a huge source of interference). Then there's the question about the cellular repeater masts that are bolted to the roof of pretty much every high-rise on the planet. On top of that you'll have 13(?) floors of wireless internet routers blasting 24/7... all of them on the same 2.4ghz frequency your drone defaults to every time you boot it up. You might get away with it. But I honestly think you're really pushing your luck.
One last thought.... This tower block, it'll be in a residential area? If your drone does go bananas, how will you explain your hazard mitigation planning after it falls 80+ feet and twats some pedestrian on the head?

I genuinely wish you the very best of British (luck). For a proper FPV drone handled by someone with loads of experience this may well be do-able, but the mini 3 pro is a house pet compared to one of those

 

[old man mavic]

@CaptinCrunch as many others have said ,the whole scenario of flying from your balcony ,is at best foolhardy ,and you can almost guarantee .that at some point it will end up in disaster

welcome to the forum by the way

 

[Dronecation]

@CaptinCrunch as many others have said ,the whole scenario of flying from your balcony ,is at best foolhardy ,and you can almost guarantee .that at some point it will end up in disaster

welcome to the forum by the way

Oh, I don't think it is that bad, providing he practices a bit more and has confidence in his flying ability.

 

[Dronecation]

Thanks everyone!

Yes = I should have mentioned that I understand that the balcony will NOT be the RTH location.

The idea is that RTH could bring it back to the building, about 20 feet away at a high altitude (taller than building), and I would then cancel RTH while it hovers above landing location, and then MANUALLY bring it down to my floor (10th), still staying about 20+ feet away from building.

I would then do a "hand" landing, where when it is at my balcony level, and manually bring the drone towards me, until I can simply brings it to my extended hand.

.... from what you fine folks are mentioning above, this sounds possible, and perhaps the safest method when attempting a balcony take off and landing?

I've done this many a time, and should tell/warn you [depending on where you are in relation to other buildings - density] that you have to be aware of wind and the effects the wind can have on your drone whilst taking off/landing.
Have a looksee:

Urban Airflow: What Drone Pilots Need to Know

tc.canada.ca

 

[Dbez1]

I agree with Meta and several others above that this is a risky endeavor for a beginning pilot.

 

[Droning on and on...]

I understand the objective here to use to convenience of RTH to easily bring the aircraft back to the launch location (lat/long), then cancel and land manually.

 

[Steve56303]

So I know you said you want to do flights from the balcony. As others have said this adds some risks.

Just an idea - I've done one job where I flew from a high balcony, but we launched from the ground. Assistant was standing near the drone when I started it and then flew up to the balcony location where we needed footage. Maybe something like this is an option?

 

[old man mavic]

Oh, I don't think it is that bad, providing he practices a bit more and has confidence in his flying ability.

its got nothing to do with his flying ability ,just because you have done it successfully on many flights, does not change the fact that it is a risk from many different factors
in fact in your Post #12 you demonstrate one of the problems associated with such an undertaking
@CaptinCrunch can fly his drone however he pleases, others of us, regardless of our skills and air time ,would be remiss if we didnt point out the risks of flying off a balcony to a newcomer

 

[Dronecation]

its got nothing to do with his flying ability ,just because you have done it successfully on many flights, does not change the fact that it is a risk from many different factors
in fact in your Post #12 you demonstrate one of the problems associated with such an undertaking
@CaptinCrunch can fly his drone however he pleases, others of us, regardless of our skills and air time ,would be remiss if we didnt point out the risks of flying off a balcony to a newcomer

Flying anytime is a risk and even though he is a new flyer, he had the smarts to reach out and get advise beforehand. Yes, it is riskier, and whatever he decides will depend on whether he feels capable of handling that assessment. Scaremongering won't help. Remember, he chose to buy a drone mainly based that he could/would be able to conveniently fly from his balcony.

 

[Droning on and on...]

Flying anytime is a risk and even though he is a new flyer, he had the smarts to reach out and get advise beforehand. Yes, it is riskier, and whatever he decides will depend on whether he feels capable of handling that assessment. Scaremongering won't help. Remember, he chose to buy a drone mainly based that he could/would be able to conveniently fly from his balcony.

There are two different issues here, risk and compliance, only risk being discussed.

What the aviation authority where @CaptinCrunch lives requires is quite important too. His profile says he's in Canada, so this article may be helpful, which includes this paragraph:

​

"So you have to make sure that the owner or whoever has an interest in the structure (whomever primarily leases the building) has granted you permission to fly within the 50 metres of the building but, but also, any and all occupants of the structure are under control of the remote pilot"​

The article does reference specific parts of the CAA regs, which should be followed-up on, I didn't bother as I'm not in Canada.

Judging by the above paragraph, it seems permission from the building owner, and every resident, would be required to operate closer to the building than 50m. Further, i interpret the rule to require this notification and permission to be obtained from the other residents (involved people) for every instance of flight operations. This my interpretation.

So, for practical purposes, a flight like this is basically prohibited in Canada.

 

[Capt KO]

Flying without GPS lock, atti mode, takes practice..it's a totally different animal. Blows with the wind and won't stop when sticks released, unless commanded. It's lost, has no idea where it is so all on the pilot..you. Without gps hand launch and land get very tricky..but doable with practice in an open area. Good luck

 

[Dronecation]

There are two different issues here, risk and compliance, only risk being discussed.

What the aviation authority where @CaptinCrunch lives requires is quite important too. His profile says he's in Canada, so this article may be helpful, which includes this paragraph:

​

"So you have to make sure that the owner or whoever has an interest in the structure (whomever primarily leases the building) has granted you permission to fly within the 50 metres of the building but, but also, any and all occupants of the structure are under control of the remote pilot"​

The article does reference specific parts of the CAA regs, which should be followed-up on, I didn't bother as I'm not in Canada.

Judging by the above paragraph, it seems permission from the building owner, and every resident, would be required to operate closer to the building than 50m. Further, i interpret the rule to require this notification and permission to be obtained from the other residents (involved people) for every instance of flight operations. This my interpretation.

So, for practical purposes, a flight like this is basically prohibited in Canada.

That applies to drones 250grams and above...
CC is using a sub 250 gram drone. Rules are different.