Is Geo-fencing and DJI forced compliance a better thing than Autel's lack of geo fencing?

[Mantrain]

I ordered the Autel Nano Plus mainly because I love the camera it has for a sub 249 drone. I also note while I should be receiving mine tomorrow as I ordered it from Autel-Pilot a while back, this Autel apparently does not have geofencing in its units. This forces pilots to be extra vigilant and know where they are flying to avoid breaking laws and suffering FAA prosecution. I appreciate the DJI geo-fencing but a few times I noted it fails me for example if I a flying at 396' in a non-restricted zone and click RTH, occasionally the drone will fail to RTH when it enters an authorization zone it just hovers at whatever elevation it previously was at, for example at 396' . This is especially the case where there is a large mountain nearby which reaches height of over 1250,' and nearby an authorization zone of 196.' I like to scale the mountain with my drones so the approach is low at 196' but as the elevation of the mountain terrain comes into play it is also about that point where the authorization area terminates so DJY Fly App allows me to scale the mountain all the way to the top, though the app informs me I may be breaking laws by exceeding 396'; I am always just above the terrain. So what bothers me about the Geofencing is if I get to the top of mountain and click RTH my DJI products will turn tail and head home but when they approach and enter the authorization zone they often will just hover, forcing me to intercede and lower the drone manually.

another issue with geo fencing occurs with another smaller mountain that is in an authorization zone. I cannot scale that mountain past 196' even though I may be just 10' above the terrain. I have tried making sure I am in bypass mode but that has no effect. [ I have considered landing the drone there and taking off again to reset the height but I do not know whether that will work and I dread have any sort of take off failure .)

I have ordered the Nano Plus which I should be receiving tomorrow. I love the DJI MINI 2 in comparison to my Mavic 3, the Mini 2 is a marvel in its own right, though I would like a better camera for low light conditions. I am also kind of intrigued that I will not supposedly have these RTH issues when traveling from a non-restricted to authorization zones. I will be curious to see what it is like to fly a drone with no geo fencing and be forced to constant compliance with self governed geo fencing. That will mean though the Nano plus will not likely on its own lower its elevation in an RTH as described above and will require the pilot to also be involved in the process of compliance but at least in this regard there is much less chance of an RTH failure.

Please no haters I am just describing my experience and why I am interested in an Nano Plus not trying to make anyone angry or hot under the collar.

Thank you!

 

[iReviewFrozenDinners]

I think DJI's Fly Safe system leads a lot of beginners into thinking that they have proper FAA authorization to fly in places where they don't because there's a legitimate looking map and on screen prompts they have to accept. I think that ultimately does more harm than good.

Not to mention the goofiness of me having to send a foreign company proof to fly somewhere a government agency gave me permission. I personally hate it.

 

[sar104]

I think DJI's Fly Safe system leads a lot of beginners into thinking that they have proper FAA authorization to fly in places where they don't because there's a legitimate looking map and on screen prompts they have to accept.

As opposed to Autel's approach, that allows them to remain entirely oblivious to all airspace restrictions and flight rules.

I think that ultimately does more harm than good.

Any evidence for that?

Not to mention the goofiness of me having to send a foreign company proof to fly somewhere a government agency gave me permission. I personally hate it.

Obviously you are referring to custom unlocks, since that only applies to those. At least it makes sure that you have permission.

 

[db4476]

DJI's method blows as it is redundant and unnecessary IMO. I'm legal to fly with a LAANC authorization, but then I have to send the info to DJI to unlock the drone... For what purpose other than to collect information does it serve? Don't even get me started on flying in a specific 0' grid which DJI responds to 48hrs AFTER the authorization expires every time. Seriously considering applying the hack to rid myself of this nonsense.

Cheers!

 

[Saladshooter]

As opposed to Autel's approach, that allows them to remain entirely oblivious to all airspace restrictions and flight rules.

Autel does warn the user that they Are in or Near somewhere they don't belong. It just doesn't prevent the pilot from flying. I think its a sound approach that allows the pilot to back away from restricted airspace and allows flight in areas that DJI's map is in error. Many 107 pilots have wasted paid days because they couldn't get DJI to unlock an area they had permission for.

I recognize the potential for abuse but still personally would rather be able to make informed decisions rather than have them made for me.

 

[sar104]

Autel does warn the user that they Are in or Near somewhere they don't belong. It just doesn't prevent the pilot from flying. I think its a sound approach that allows the pilot to back away from restricted airspace and allows flight in areas that DJI's map is in error. Many 107 pilots have wasted paid days because they couldn't get DJI to unlock an area they had permission for.

I recognize the potential for abuse but still personally would rather be able to make informed decisions rather than have them made for me.

Personally I would like to see the DJI QEP extended to cover Part 107 pilots in general, which amounts to the same thing I guess.

 

[db4476]

Personally I would like to see the DJI QEP extended to cover Part 107 pilots in general, which amounts to the same thing I guess.

That just might work for part 107 pilots. I can understand where DJI is coming from for recreational pilots, but it seems like overkill and too restrictive for part 107 pilots. Autel's current method works well in my opinion. As much as I gripe about DJI's geofencing, I do have the option of flying the EVO II instead.

Cheers!

 

[Deleted member 103366]

I appreciate the DJI geo-fencing but a few times I noted it fails me for example if I a flying at 396' in a non-restricted zone and click RTH, occasionally the drone will fail to RTH when it enters an authorization zone it just hovers at whatever elevation it previously was at, for example at 396' .

Just for curiosity's sake, what would you do if/when the Autel approached the authorisation zone at 396ft? I am assuming this authorisation zone is something legally real and a corridor wall or something similar and not a DJI quirk.

 

[Don Testme]

Say no to DJI Geo Fencing.

 

[EsaT]

It's damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Sure geofencing can easily cause issues if DJI's data is erroneous, or you can't get fencing unlocked when having necessary authorizations/permits.

But if we have knowledge lacking new pilots, or those who just don't care about rules flying everywhere, we'll fast have bureaucrats and politicians pressing more and tighter regulations.
And that's one very slippery slope.


At least here in Finland DJI has very little areas in their Geo Zone database.
Wouldn't wonder any if in US there are bureaucrats sending what ever claims they want to DJI, considering how eager they're to claim being able to deny drone flying over some area even though FAA is the only one with authority for that.

 

[Saladshooter]

Just for curiosity's sake, what would you do if/when the Autel approached the authorisation zone at 396ft? I am assuming this authorisation zone is something legally real and a corridor wall or something similar and not a DJI quirk.

Don't forget..... DJI and Autel drones don't know how high they are, only how high they are above the launch point so this could often be a problem manufactured by the software. This is why its important to be able to make our own decisions.

 

[Deleted member 103366]

Don't forget..... DJI and Autel drones

True but I assumed he was quoting heights reported in the app, AGL's might be difficult to calculate "on the fly" (oops bad pun, unintended). If I am wrong then apologies.

 

[EsaT]

[ I have considered landing the drone there and taking off again to reset the height but I do not know whether that will work and I dread have any sort of take off failure .)

Altitude is based on barometric data comparison.
So landing and taking off should "reset/calibrate" it.

Though what happens with zone limits and negative altitude readings etc is another question.
(hopefully no "divide by zero")

 

[brett8883]

Any evidence for that?

There’s plenty of examples on this forum of people not realizing DJI’s GeoZones don’t line up with the facilities map and believing that since the drone doesn’t say they are in an authorization zone they don’t have to do anything.

Also, as far as I know, there’s no evidence that Autel pilots break the rules more often than DJI pilots. In fact when I do hear reports about drone pilots breaking the airspace rules it’s almost always a DJI pilot. Now that could be due to there being so many more DJI drones out there or other reasons I haven’t considered but I do think it’s noteworthy.

 

[Saladshooter]

True but I assumed he was quoting heights reported in the app, AGL's might be difficult to calculate "on the fly" (oops bad pun, unintended). If I am wrong then apologies.

I guess that is what I am crowing about also. With the Autel I would have a pretty good idea how high I was above the ground and could adjust my height accordingly to make for a smooth legal RTH without fear of something preventing it.

With DJI there is the potential to get stuck. You shouldn't put yourself in a situation where the drone is right on the line but due to GPS or barometer inaccuracy the DJI product has the potential to decide its in a restricted zone and refuse to come home.

Look at the incident with the Matrice in June. It was a combination of bad pilot choices and DJI's software that caused the incident. Pilot takes off outside of a prison restricted zone, when he tries to come back the Matrice decides its in the restricted zone and refuses to move or land. The pilot then tries to pull the batteries out of the hovering drone and suffers serious injury.

Drone Pilot injured in Geofencing Accident

 

[sar104]

I guess that is what I am crowing about also. With the Autel I would have a pretty good idea how high I was above the ground and could adjust my height accordingly to make for a smooth legal RTH without fear of something preventing it.

The Autel is reporting height AGL?

 

[Mantrain]

Don't forget..... DJI and Autel drones don't know how high they are, only how high they are above the launch point so this could often be a problem manufactured by the software. This is why its important to be able to make our own decisions.

that is why I was thinking like trying to scale up the mountain in a restricted zone, to land it on a trail and take off again, resetting the elevation. But that is harrowing too. What if the trail is off grade and will not allow for a takeoff. Cant; wait for my Autel Nano Plus.

I have learned a great deal about drones in the last couple months since I started with DJI but from here on out I think it is Autel for me.

 

[Saladshooter]

The Autel is reporting height AGL?

No, I'm just saying as an educated drone pilot, I can estimate my own height above terrain. Neither Autel or DJI are attempting to do so with their software so they will always be in error.

I often preplan missions which will take me up hillsides, I have to combine digital terrain maps and the simpler maps in the Apps to keep a correct distance above ground.

 

[old man mavic]

@Saladshooter ,no matter what brand of drone you have ,the indicated height shown on the App screen is above the take off point
it has always been the responsibility of the pilot to do their best to stay within the designated 400ft AGL

 

[Don Testme]

that is why I was thinking like trying to scale up the mountain in a restricted zone, to land it on a trail and take off again, resetting the elevation. But that is harrowing too. What if the trail is off grade and will not allow for a takeoff. Cant; wait for my Autel Nano Plus.

I have learned a great deal about drones in the last couple months since I started with DJI but from here on out I think it is Autel for me.

Received a notice today. My Autel Lite+ is shipping this month.