Is there a definitive source of no-fly zones?

[GroovyGeek]

Newbie first post, please be gentle

B4UFLY and related apps are a great source of information on where you can and cannot fly... except that they seem to be far from exhaustive and authoritative. For example, I am heading to AK in the near future and was mapping out potential areas to fly in Google Earth. One of the areas that looks really good is in a remote part Chugach state park. Checked the location on several apps and it shows good to fly. However numerous websites list Chugach as a nofly zone, for example
Alaska Drone Laws & Regulations – FAA Drone Registration Support Site Noticed a similar situation with lots of state parks which show good to fly on B4UFLY but often have obscure regulations that prohibit drone flights.

Is there an authoritative source for this? Surely the expectation can't be that we somehow figure out every little local regulation on our own? Or is that exactly the case?

 

[GFields]

Greetings from Birmingham Alabama USA, welcome to the forum! We look forward to hearing from you!

The FAA website

 

[GroovyGeek]

Greetings from Birmingham Alabama USA, welcome to the forum! We look forward to hearing from you!

The FAA website

The FAA website seems to only identify the status of the airspace, but not whether you can take off or land at a particular location... which given the VLOS requirement is often next to useless. For example the FAA No Drone Zone is explicit: air space authorization does not mean land use approval.

How does one navigate this thicket?

 

[Vic Moss]

Put the address in the search box here. It will tell you airspace restrictions. Make sure you've checked all the boxes in the "Layer List".

ArcGIS Web Application

www.arcgis.com

 

[GroovyGeek]

Put the address in the search box here. It will tell you airspace restrictions. Make sure you've checked all the boxes in the "Layer List".

ArcGIS Web Application

www.arcgis.com

Thx but this seems to also tell me stuff about the airspace, not whether I can actually take off or land from any particular area. I understand that having a database of every individual parcel of private land is darn near impossible, but it seems that federal and state lands should be doable. The apps correctly flag federal land (NPS, wilderness areas, etc) as no fly zones, but they seem to miss the boat completely on state land.

 

[Vic Moss]

Thx but this seems to also tell me stuff about the airspace, not whether I can actually take off or land from any particular area. I understand that having a database of every individual parcel of private land is darn near impossible, but it seems that federal and state lands should be doable. The apps correctly flag federal land (NPS, wilderness areas, etc) as no fly zones, but they seem to miss the boat completely on state land.

Sorry, misread the post. There is no definitive site for all of the land laws, but give this one a try.

Drone Laws in Alaska (2022) - Pilot Institute

pilotinstitute.com

 

[akdrone]

As mentioned there is no special clearing house that lists all the many localities that forbid launching. As for Chugach…what a shame. I run into it all the time when traveling down south. I have spoken with the Dept. of Natural Resources (overseeing Chugach) and they confirmed that the highway along the park is not within the park itself and therefore you can launch from any turnoff that you deem safe to do so. You can’t, of courwe, hike into the park and fly. North of Anchorage there is some incredible flying but many authorization zones. With all the airports and the military presence it’s a real web of restrictions. The Matanuska Glacier (I’ve posted a vid from there) is within a days drive from Anchorage. Heading south, Beluga Point is very interesting. If you time it so you arrive at mid tide you may find some good action in Cook Inlet. A bit further south, the area called Indian is a carved out place that is not within the Park and provides a great place to launch out over the inlet. My YouTube channel as a couple of videos from the area if you are interested. https://www.youtube.com/@digibud/videos. is the channel and here is a quick pano of Cook Inlet shot from the Highway. Chugach park extends into the Inlet itself so at places like Beluga Point you can’t even go off the highway - at all - to launch. Following the pano is some footage from Beluga Point.

 

[Yorkshire_Pud]

The FAA website seems to only identify the status of the airspace, but not whether you can take off or land at a particular location... which given the VLOS requirement is often next to useless. For example the FAA No Drone Zone is explicit: air space authorization does not mean land use approval.

How does one navigate this thicket?

For clarity are you asking whether or not there is a list specifying whether or not the owner of a piece of land permits the use of their land as a launching and landing site for drones?

 

[GroovyGeek]

As mentioned there is no special clearing house that lists all the many localities that forbid launching. As for Chugach…what a shame. I run into it all the time when traveling down south. I have spoken with the Dept. of Natural Resources (overseeing Chugach) and they confirmed that the highway along the park is not within the park itself and therefore you can launch from any turnoff that you deem safe to do so.

Yes, indeed a shame. I was "flying" around the Eagle River trail on Google Earth and the valley about two miles south of The Perch look amazing from an elevated viewpoint. I will probably still snowshoe it (avalanche conditions permitting) because once it gets flatt-ish even the ground based views look amazing.

Thanks for the tip about AK-1. It is indeed solidly outside the park on the north side and at a couple of locations the road approaches the park sufficiently close which makes launching from there a flyover possible while staying on the good side of the law.

Regarding the Seward Hwy, I am reading your post that it is OK to launch immediately off the paved road and pullouts but if you step even an inch to the side you are technically on park land.

 

[SmilingOgre]

I start with FAA sectionals. Next up is the TFR list which can be a career choice if there are a lot of them on the books. Last call is to local police as they would be the ones enforcing any restrictions legal or otherwise. Often times I have nothing "definitive" but I have what I can find to make a decision.

 

[akdrone]

Yes, indeed a shame. I was "flying" around the Eagle River trail on Google Earth and the valley about two miles south of The Perch look amazing from an elevated viewpoint. I will probably still snowshoe it (avalanche conditions permitting) because once it gets flatt-ish even the ground based views look amazing.

Thanks for the tip about AK-1. It is indeed solidly outside the park on the north side and at a couple of locations the road approaches the park sufficiently close which makes launching from there a flyover possible while staying on the good side of the law.

Regarding the Seward Hwy, I am reading your post that it is OK to launch immediately off the paved road and pullouts but if you step even an inch to the side you are technically on park land.

That issue of driving through a park can get sticky I'm sure which is why I called and spoke with a the folks at Dept. of Nat. Resources. Denali Natl Park is another example. The highway runs right along the border and I fly from the highway quite often, over the Nenana River, and I am sure I fly just a bit into the park regularly but am also confident I am OK in doing so. Going down the Seward there are forbidden parks all along the way. I have not flown down there but I treat all highways going through parks as legal to fly from as they are, I believe, not technically part of the park. In my mind, if a road (like the Denali Park roads inside the park) is being maintained by the park and the law enforcement is done by park rangers I respect the rules and don't fly there but if I'm on a highway that is controlled by state troopers or other civilian authorities I will stop anywhere I want and feel free to fly into the park as long as there is not B4UFLY restrictions or DJI zone problems.

 

[Bob Jones]

The FAA website seems to only identify the status of the airspace, but not whether you can take off or land at a particular location... which given the VLOS requirement is often next to useless. For example the FAA No Drone Zone is explicit: air space authorization does not mean land use approval.

How does one navigate this thicket?

Hi I'm in Canada. You need permission to land and takeoff even in class G airspace on private property. On public property there may be bylaws prohibiting takeoff/landing. You will be responsible for confirming the legality of where you launch. FAA in the US, and Canda Transport in Canada rule air space. From what I understand, public property such as sidewalks or parking lots should be okay if the muncipality does'nt have bylaws to stop it.

 

[WanderLost]

Newbie first post, please be gentle

B4UFLY and related apps are a great source of information on where you can and cannot fly... except that they seem to be far from exhaustive and authoritative. For example, I am heading to AK in the near future and was mapping out potential areas to fly in Google Earth. One of the areas that looks really good is in a remote part Chugach state park. Checked the location on several apps and it shows good to fly. However numerous websites list Chugach as a nofly zone, for example
Alaska Drone Laws & Regulations – FAA Drone Registration Support Site Noticed a similar situation with lots of state parks which show good to fly on B4UFLY but often have obscure regulations that prohibit drone flights.

Is there an authoritative source for this? Surely the expectation can't be that we somehow figure out every little local regulation on our own? Or is that exactly the case?

Lots of good feedback here. It's my understanding that you cannot fly from inside State or National park boundaries. In Canada, this includes Federal and Provincial parks and Conservation areas and in many municipal parks.
"Without permission from the park supervisor."
If there are off peak times in the parks you are interested in flying over, you might get some slack cut for an overflight with permission from the park warden/supervisor from within the park boundaries.
I've been able to get permission to fly in a local Conservation area and was happy to share the videos with them and give them permission to use as they see fit in their outreach.

 

[bitsbytes]

It's my understanding that you cannot fly from inside State or National park boundaries.

You are right about national parks in the US, but not all states ban drones in their parks. Some may allow them, but only with permission and some list of conditions.

The problem with OP's question is that the answer has to be determined on a case-by-case basis, both at a regional level (city, county, and state level) as well as a per-operation level. This is why planning, such as site surveys, is important to conduct even if not explicitly mandated for you do to so. Unfortunately there isn't one place that just tells you if flying is allowed or not.

 

[jephoto]

Put the address in the search box here. It will tell you airspace restrictions. Make sure you've checked all the boxes in the "Layer List".

ArcGIS Web Application

www.arcgis.com

Aren’t the ARCGIS only having to do with airspace around airports and altitudes that you can use the LAANC system to get an authorization to fly?
I don’t think ARCgis will even show up around a State Park. And I admit, I could be wrong on that. I will do a test in a moment.

 

[jephoto]

As I thought. I plugged in address of a state park here in Illinois to the ARCgis page and it shows NOTHING.

ArcGIS Web Application

faa.maps.arcgis.com

Here’s the address of “Chain ‘O Lakes State Park
8916 Wilmot Rd
Spring Grove, IL 60081
United States

Bud move the map an inch or 2 NE or SE of the park and you see two ARCgis circles around two regional airports showing the altitudes you May get permission for for each block surrounding the airport.

 

[Vic Moss]

Aren’t the ARCGIS only having to do with airspace around airports and altitudes that you can use the LAANC system to get an authorization to fly?
I don’t think ARCgis will even show up around a State Park. And I admit, I could be wrong on that. I will do a test in a moment.

This is just an airspace map. No local laws.

 

[jephoto]

This is just an airspace map. No local laws.

That’s what I was saying

 

[Vic Moss]

That’s what I was saying

Sorry, I was reading that on my phone. Misunderstood what you wrote.

 

[RPerry]

I'll throw my two cents in. I haven't read all the responses so this may be a little redundant. Many state parks create their own rule regarding drones, and some are ridiculous. I wanted to get some photos of a lighthouse in Northern California. The state park said no way does not allow to fly a drone. I went outside the park, flew the drone into the lighthouse and got my pictures. The state park has no authority over airspace; they do have the authority over their own turf. Once airborne, you fall under FAA jurisdiction, not any local authority. Fortunately, I have a wife who was an attorney, so I sometimes may push the envelope a little bit, but I always attempt to remain legal. The problem is local authorities generally have little or no knowledge of federal aviation laws.