Line of Sight - Really?

[Paul Schulze]

Maybe this has already be presented, but just in case, here it is:

My Mavic 2Z has a body roughly 0.25 ft wide. This is the most visible part when flying away or toward the pilot. Now the accepted angular resolution of the human eye is about 1/60 degree or 0.000291 radian.
Calculations:
Distance X Angle (in radians) = Arc length
Distance X 0.000921 = 0.25 ft whence distance = 859 ft or 0.16 mile.

Now even if we up the angular resolution of your eye by a factor of 4, we get about .064 mile straight line.

Note: if the drone is at h=300 ft, the horizontal distance is 804 ft.

I challenge anyone to let someone fly your drone out somewhere randomly to a distance of, say 0.64 mile, while you keep your back turned and then you turn around and see the drone.

Who flies their Mavic 2 drone no farther than 1000 feet? As for myself, I have trouble seeing it four or five hundred feet away.

 

[WithTheBirds]

Most people would be my guess.

 

[Paulf10]

Very true!?

 

[Thomas B]

Maybe this has already be presented, but just in case, here it is:

My Mavic 2Z has a body roughly 0.25 ft wide. This is the most visible part when flying away or toward the pilot. Now the accepted angular resolution of the human eye is about 1/60 degree or 0.000291 radian.
Calculations:
Distance X Angle (in radians) = Arc length
Distance X 0.000921 = 0.25 ft whence distance = 859 ft or 0.16 mile.

Now even if we up the angular resolution of your eye by a factor of 4, we get about .064 mile straight line.

Note: if the drone is at h=300 ft, the horizontal distance is 804 ft.

I challenge anyone to let someone fly your drone out somewhere randomly to a distance of, say 0.64 mile, while you keep your back turned and then you turn around and see the drone.

Who flies their Mavic 2 drone no farther than 1000 feet? As for myself, I have trouble seeing it four or five hundred feet away.

That’s why I use four of the Firehouse ARC2s.... massively increased LOS visibility, especially in the golden hours.

 

[Johnmcl7]

The conditions the drone is flying in can vary how far I can see the drone, in some conditions I struggle to see it at any distance and keep it close whereas other times I can fly it a bit further and still see it. Aside from being legal I prefer to be able to see the drone in case I need to fly it back without the camera view which I've needed to do a couple of times and the Mavic is so small it's easy enough to pack it up, walk/cycle onto the next place I want to fly it and take off from there.

 

[razoraerial]

Can this thread get deleted before the google search engine eats it up ? Lol.

 

[Cyclonetog]

As a potential new owner in the very near future, this is one of my questions.

YouTube is full of videos of people doing range tests and range hacks, some of them linked to this very site. I think I saw 11 miles on a video yesterday.

I know some of these videos may be from places where these rules don't exist, but definitely not all.

 

[old man mavic]

i wouldnt worry about it, the subject is something that we all have differing opinions on,this forum caters for all opinions ,and if people choose to break the rules, then we can only hope it doesnt spoil things to much down the line,untill then we can express our concerns as you have, but that will not change anything, the best thing to do is not look at posts that are about that sort of thing

 

[Thomas B]

All you can do is remind the poster and encourage legal flight.

 

[razoraerial]

Very good points, the problem is we bring more on us by posting this stuff. Think about it. Nobody goes to a driving forum and asks speed limit really? We sit here wondering about new laws on a regular bases and it’s truely stuff like this ends up in search engines It really isn’t back and forth rule. Can’t see it bring it back.

 

[THE CYBORG]

½ the time I could do with a spotter, when I look up from the screen I often have trouble locating my Mavic, I started flying with an Xiaomi 4k and compared to the Mavic it is big and loud but I have no problems locating it in the sky.

 

[Paul Schulze]

My main point in starting this thread was at least two fold, 1). At best a three or four inch object can be seen, without lights, about 1000 ft. 2) eyes vary from person to person so the 1000 ft distance might be a whole lot less for most pilots.

When the FAA police show up what test do they administer to check LOS? I am serious on this. Even a spotter cannot see any farther than a pilot. I am not advocating breaking any laws, but we need to advocate for laws that are reasonable. With the rapid advancement of technology, especially since the laws were first enacted,, studies on new drone safety laws need to be made.

How does Amazon expect expect to meet LOS requirements? A lot of reasonable study needs to be done by knowledgeable people and not politicians.

 

[MacCool]

I have a pair of the Race Edition goggles and prefer that to line of sight. FPV is so much fun that I got a 3 inch race/freestyle quad to fly with them.

 

[deleted member 877]

How does Amazon expect expect to meet LOS requirements? A lot of reasonable study needs to be done by knowledgeable people and not politicians.

I figure Amazon and other companies engaged in setting up drone delivery operations would be applying for BVLOS waivers like what is happening in Australia:-

Airobotics receives first CASA approval for BVLOS drone flights in Australia from remote ops centre

Airobotics has made Australian aviation history. The automated drone startup has obtained the nation’s first and only Civil Aviation Safety Authorit...

www.miningglobal.com

 

[Paul Schulze]

I figure Amazon and other companies engaged in setting up drone delivery operations would be be applying for BVLOS waivers like what is happening in Australia:-

BVLOS may indeed be the answer. You can bet recreational drone manufacturers are hot on this as we “speak.“

 

[WithTheBirds]

BVLOS may indeed be the answer. You can bet recreational drone manufacturers are hot on this as we “speak.“

Out of curiosity what might you suggest the manufacturers could be doing? The currently available models all perform BVLOS exceptionally well.

 

[Paul Schulze]

Hear is something newsworthy for all -

First part New York's 50-mile drone corridor receives FAA approval for BVLOS

Part of New York's 50-mile drone corridor received approval from the Federal Aviation Authority for beyond-visual-line-of-sight (BVLOS) drone test flights.

dronedj.com

 

[Paul Schulze]

Out of curiosity what might you suggest the manufacturers could be doing? The currently available models all perform BVLOS exceptionally well.

Yes, , but they need FAA approval before it replaces VLOS. So far, some improvements are needed as verified by all the sad story crashes one can read about on this forum.

 

[WithTheBirds]

Yes, , but they need FAA approval before it replaces VLOS. So far, some improvements are needed as verified by all the sad story crashes one can read about on this forum.

That is what I am curious about- the nature of the improvements. Anything short of a demonstration that the sUAV can do a better job of avoiding conflicting with manned AC (and probably each other) than the PIC might be able to do, and in all circumstances, won’t do it. You simply can’t have the situation awareness needed to avoid conflicts flying FPV.

 

[Dakarenduro]

My opinion... for the hobbyist VLOS is fine and will remain. For commercial operations BVLOS waivers will become more common as the UAVs become more advanced with redundant systems for fail over (not hobbyist drones but purpose built commercial units like the ones being tested by amazon, Google, fedex, etc).

I mean why not? The Marines were using two drone helicopters in Afghanistan for years...