No Fly Zones

[kopykat]

on one of my Facebook groups some dude asked me what kind of drone I had and then proceeded to tell me that he didn't like DJI drones because they had too many NFZ. he claims that his drone (whatever it is) doesn't have any NFZ and he can fly anywhere he wants to. I explained to him that, for where I flew today I got clearance from the KittyHawk app, my drone gave me no warnings but as a responsible pilot, knowing I was near a small airport I took the steps to get LAANC.
question for those that know, is this guy just assuming that he can fly wherever he wants or do such drones with zero NFZ exist?

 

[Phantomrain.org]

on one of my Facebook groups some dude asked me what kind of drone I had and then proceeded to tell me that he didn't like DJI drones because they had too many NFZ. he claims that his drone (whatever it is) doesn't have any NFZ and he can fly anywhere he wants to. I explained to him that, for where I flew today I got clearance from the KittyHawk app, my drone gave me no warnings but as a responsible pilot, knowing I was near a small airport I took the steps to get LAANC.
question for those that know, is this guy just assuming that he can fly wherever he wants or do such drones with zero NFZ exist?

Recently Learned that some Autel Drones do not have Geo Fencing and therefore provide a few more freedoms.

Phantomrain.org
Gear to fly your Mavic in the Rain.
Coal

 

[brett8883]

on one of my Facebook groups some dude asked me what kind of drone I had and then proceeded to tell me that he didn't like DJI drones because they had too many NFZ. he claims that his drone (whatever it is) doesn't have any NFZ and he can fly anywhere he wants to. I explained to him that, for where I flew today I got clearance from the KittyHawk app, my drone gave me no warnings but as a responsible pilot, knowing I was near a small airport I took the steps to get LAANC.
question for those that know, is this guy just assuming that he can fly wherever he wants or do such drones with zero NFZ exist?

Yea as @Phantomrain.org pointed out this sounds like an Autel pilot to me.

DJI fly zones are separate from LAANC zones or controlled airspace. There are places you can fly legally that your drone won’t fly because DJI has decided they are our Chinese overlords and as such even if we have LAANC authorization or airspace waivers making it 100% legal to fly DJI won’t let you.

You either have to go through a complicated process in which DJI requires you to give them your phone number, IP address, a credit card, your social security number, the names and school addresses of your children (ok the last 2 are an exaggerating) to get their permission to fly your drone or they have no process what so ever to let you fly your drone there. Even if you get the correct permission from DJI there’s a 75% chance it won’t work and you still can’t fly

Particularly for us Part 107 pilots that can and do get advanced permissions from the government, it would be very nice not to show up to a job site with fingers crossed that our equipment will work.

I take what your friend said as not having to deal with that. No intelligent person would ever believe that there are no regulations on where you can fly and where you need authorization to fly.

 

[kopykat]

I take what your friend said as not having to deal with that. No intelligent person would ever believe that there are no regulations on where you can fly and where you need authorization to fly.

appreciate it. there was talk about flying near ATL airport, flying near a dam that's maintained by ARMY Core of Engineers, flying in some National Parks and I was like, "whoa! you can't just fly anywhere you want to. some places ARE off limits."

the more I get into drones the more people I find who don't know or care about rules, laws or regulations.

 

[brett8883]

appreciate it. there was talk about flying near ATL airport, flying near a dam that's maintained by ARMY Core of Engineers, flying in some National Parks and I was like, "whoa! you can't just fly anywhere you want to. some places ARE off limits."

the more I get into drones the more people I find who don't know or care about rules, laws or regulations.

Careful. Better make sure you don’t live in a glass house if you are gonna throw stones.

You’d need authorization to fly in the ATL controlled airspace but it’s not off limits. There are no FAA regulations regarding national parks or dams. You’d have to get their permission to take off from their land just like anywhere else but nothing special about dams or national parks.

 

[tca]

Hi.....
I went to down load the Kitty Hawk app but there were a few of them.....which one do you use....how does it work?
Thanks

 

[itsneedtokno]

Careful. Better make sure you don’t live in a glass house if you are gonna throw stones.

You’d need authorization to fly in the ATL controlled airspace but it’s not off limits. There are no FAA regulations regarding national parks or dams. You’d have to get their permission to take off from their land just like anywhere else but nothing special about dams or national parks.

Uhhhh...

Hold that thought.

Im 99.9999% sure that the FAA states all NPS locations are off limits.

Flying Drones in National Parks | Master Your Drone

When it comes to flying drones in national and state parks, you have to know the rules. Learn what drone use is permitted in parks and wilderness areas.

masteryourdrone.com

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Can I Fly My Drone in a National Park? What You Need to Know - Pilot Institute

Nature is one of the best subjects of drone photography. There are only a few places that could rival the beauty of the canyons of Yellowstone or the majestic waterfalls in the Yosemite Valley. You might even include national monuments as a close second, solely because of their cultural and...

pilotinstitute.com

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So while you are technically right it doesn't necessarily make it right.

Still a big risk, but IMHO, sometimes worth it

 

[dawgpilot]

Hi.....
I went to down load the Kitty Hawk app but there were a few of them.....which one do you use....how does it work?
Thanks

This site links to the official apps for iOS or Android: Download | Kittyhawk

 

[dawgpilot]

Uhhhh...

Hold that thought.

Im 99.9999% sure that the FAA states all NPS locations are off limits.

Good thing you left that 0.0001 margin there, because you are wrong on that. There are no FAA regulations about flying above NPS property. It's simply a regulation of the land manager (here the NPS), who can control the take-off and landing on their property.

 

[itsneedtokno]

Good thing you left that 0.0001 margin there, because you are wrong on that. There are no FAA regulations about flying above NPS property. It's simply a regulation of the land manager (here the NPS), who can control the take-off and landing on their property.

Check my post again, I edited it.

So yes, you both are right... But...

If somebody complains about the noise, or that you made that bird fly away, or that you were miles in to the park, you gonna have some "splainin" to do.



Do NOT get me wrong... I am completely against the NPS banning flights, and side wholeheartedly with the understanding of the fact that the FAA controls airspace.

If somebody can bring a DSLR in the park, why can't I bring my flying DSLR?

 

[itsneedtokno]

My wife just made a good point, NPS should be asking for drone footage.

It's free advertising.

But hey, if they want to make everybody keep the footage to themselves, then so be it.

 

[PhantomFandom]

on one of my Facebook groups some dude asked me what kind of drone I had and then proceeded to tell me that he didn't like DJI drones because they had too many NFZ. he claims that his drone (whatever it is) doesn't have any NFZ and he can fly anywhere he wants to. I explained to him that, for where I flew today I got clearance from the KittyHawk app, my drone gave me no warnings but as a responsible pilot, knowing I was near a small airport I took the steps to get LAANC.
question for those that know, is this guy just assuming that he can fly wherever he wants or do such drones with zero NFZ exist?

It's one of those people who never tried a DJI zone and just assumes he can't fly anywhere with one. There are also the types that don't care about FAA regulations and feel it is their right to fly wherever they please.

Personally I have never had a single problem with unlocking a DJI zone restriction. I get both my LAANC authorization and my DJI unlock IN ADVANCE whenever possible. That is especially true when I have commercial jobs to fly. I want to be fully prepared when I get onsite.

Many times, those who complain are the ones who have issues because they waited till the last minute and then have issues with the DJI unlock. YES it does pose problems sometimes (and not often) when you try to do it onsite, so plan ahead.

Of course it would be nice if we didn't need DJI's permission to fly somewhere that we already have FAA authorization to fly. However, you have the knuckleheads like the one you referred to that would just fly anywhere they feel like, so DJI is taking a measure in order to try and make that a bit more difficult.

Oh did I mention to PLAN AHEAD?

 

[brett8883]

My wife just made a good point, NPS should be asking for drone footage.

It's free advertising.

But hey, if they want to make everybody keep the footage to themselves, then so be it.

I agree there!

I live in Utah with lots of National Parks and I can tell you they are always complaining about how little funding they have and need to drive more people to the parks so they can get more entry fees.

 

[theDRONEranger]

My wife just made a good point, NPS should be asking for drone footage.

It's free advertising.

But hey, if they want to make everybody keep the footage to themselves, then so be it.

That would be a nice thing to do, but then FAA regulations may bump out a whole lot of good footage from non107’s. Ultimate goal of the footage to increase revenue via tourism. Personally, I do NOT want to see drones in NPS’s. Wildlife is the issue. Although, some NPS, Arches NP comes to mind, I believe it may have minimal impact on wildlife.

 

[brett8883]

That would be a nice thing to do, but then FAA regulations may bump out a whole lot of good footage from non107’s.

I think he means if people show their photos to family and friends or post them online it will spread awareness and make people want to go to the park. Not in a literal for marketing purposes, they use their own drones for that ironically.

Personally, I do NOT want to see drones in NPS’s. Wildlife is the issue.

I definitely think that there would have to be strict rules (there already are) about not harassing wildlife. It is a concern but I think there are smart ways to mitigate it. Drones aren’t nearly as disruptive as cars and motorcycles.

Although, some NPS, Arches NP comes to mind, I believe it may have minimal impact on wildlife.

I agree. I don’t think the tarantulas and Juniper trees will mind. Well I should say tarantulas are already always POed anyway but they don’t have ears so...

 

[itsneedtokno]

Personally, I do NOT want to see drones in NPS’s. Wildlife is the issue. Although, some NPS, Arches NP comes to mind, I believe it may have minimal impact on wildlife.

So I can ride my ATV through the Ocala National Forest, but not fly my much quieter drone? The disturbing wildlife thing is a hit or miss for me. Yeah, some people, as is always the case, are going to get too close and make the bird fly from it's nest, or the deer run in to the forest, or the drug addict hiding out scamper for the hills... But that's just it... So would the guy riding the ATV. His ATV would scare the deer, maybe not the birds, but it leaves a trail through a preservation area. Drones are Zero Emissions vehicles, and leave no footprint.

That's why, that point is particular, is moot to me.

I think he means if people show their photos to family and friends or post them online it will spread awareness and make people want to go to the park. Not in a literal for marketing purposes, they use their own drones for that ironically.


I definitely think that there would have to be strict rules (there already are) about not harassing wildlife. It is a concern but I think there are smart ways to mitigate it. Drones aren’t nearly as disruptive as cars and motorcycles.



I agree. I don’t think the tarantulas and Juniper trees will mind. Well I should say tarantulas are already always POed anyway but they don’t have ears so...

Yup.
Yup.
Yup.

 

[MavicAir2Marc]

I live near St. Louis and the Arch grounds are a National Park but it is also labeled as "Special Use " airspace as well as being in controlled airspace. There have been people allowed by the Parks Department to fly around the Arch with special permissions. I believe according to the FAA, you can overfly a National Park, you just can't land or take-off from a National Park. Most of the scenic stuff however is in the interior of the park boundaries beyond the range and VLOS limits of drones. While I agree about "responsible pilots" being able to fly in National Parks, the problem is there are too many people out there that would take advantage of the rules and fly wherever they want, bothering whomever they want just because it's their "right" to fly in the park. Maybe limiting it to Part 107 pilots and/or permit based (which would also be a source of income for the park system) that specifies a time period and area would make the National Parks accessible to drone pilots.

 

[DavidT_ NZ]

It's one of those people who never tried a DJI zone and just assumes he can't fly anywhere with one. There are also the types that don't care about FAA regulations and feel it is their right to fly wherever they please.

Personally I have never had a single problem with unlocking a DJI zone restriction. I get both my LAANC authorization and my DJI unlock IN ADVANCE whenever possible. That is especially true when I have commercial jobs to fly. I want to be fully prepared when I get onsite.

Many times, those who complain are the ones who have issues because they waited till the last minute and then have issues with the DJI unlock. YES it does pose problems sometimes (and not often) when you try to do it onsite, so plan ahead.

Of course it would be nice if we didn't need DJI's permission to fly somewhere that we already have FAA authorization to fly. However, you have the knuckleheads like the one you referred to that would just fly anywhere they feel like, so DJI is taking a measure in order to try and make that a bit more difficult.

Oh did I mention to PLAN AHEAD?

DJI should just make and service drones. Period. Getting involved in any form of restricting then approving (unlocking) drone flights is exposing the company to enormous financial and legal risks in the event that someone misused a cleared drone for catastrophic attack purposes, especially in areas where zones are restricted. I am very surprised since I started encountering the need to obtain an occasional unlock from DJI (in New Zealand), that they are participating in this manner. From an insurance liability aspect, they should be nowhere near such “authorisations”. Flight clearances outside of general flying should only be in the domain of the relevant air traffic control, be that domestic, international or military. There will always be people who will fly unrestricted drones however they please. That is entirely different. DJI does not seem to have considered how much liability they are exposing themselves to, by being a flight approving agent. Very unwise.

 

[PhantomFandom]

DJI should just make and service drones. Period. Getting involved in any form of restricting then approving (unlocking) drone flights is exposing the company to enormous financial and legal risks in the event that someone misused a cleared drone for catastrophic attack purposes, especially in areas where zones are restricted. I am very surprised since I started encountering the need to obtain an occasional unlock from DJI (in New Zealand), that they are participating in this manner. From an insurance liability aspect, they should be nowhere near such “authorisations”. Flight clearances outside of general flying should only be in the domain of the relevant air traffic control, be that domestic, international or military. There will always be people who will fly unrestricted drones however they please. That is entirely different. DJI does not seem to have considered how much liability they are exposing themselves to, by being a flight approving agent. Very unwise.

I don't know how the law works there in New Zealand, but your view is completely the opposite of how it actually works and protects DJI (at least here in the USA).

If they do not issue any warning then they can easily be sued by anyone who flies illegally because there was no warning. That's why everything here in the USA has the dumbest warnings on the package...cup of coffee may burn you, don't hold nails in your mouth, don't step on top rung of ladder, do not eat the silica gel packet etc...

The warning and unlock feature of DJI drones is not authorizing you to fly. It is warning you that you may be flying in an area that requires permission from the proper authorities. If you proceed, it is on you since you were warned and positively affirmed that you understand.

Without the warnings, DJI would be flooded with lawsuits and we would all be paying more for these drones to cover those costs.

Reminds me of the built-in GPS warning in my car. Before it allows me to see the map, I need to accept an agreement/warning. I have honestly never bothered reading it because it's stupid and it would require me to take my eyes off the road and my hands off the wheel in order to do so.

 

[brett8883]

I don't know how the law works there in New Zealand, but your view is completely the opposite of how it actually works and protects DJI (at least here in the USA).

If they do not issue any warning then they can easily be sued by anyone who flies illegally because there was no warning. That's why everything here in the USA has the dumbest warnings on the package...cup of coffee may burn you, don't hold nails in your mouth, don't step on top rung of ladder, do not eat the silica gel packet etc...

The warning and unlock feature of DJI drones is not authorizing you to fly. It is warning you that you may be flying in an area that requires permission from the proper authorities. If you proceed, it is on you since you were warned and positively affirmed that you understand.

Without the warnings, DJI would be flooded with lawsuits and we would all be paying more for these drones to cover those costs.

Reminds me of the built-in GPS warning in my car. Before it allows me to see the map, I need to accept an agreement/warning. I have honestly never bothered reading it because it's stupid and it would require me to take my eyes off the road and my hands off the wheel in order to do so.

The DJI fly zones don’t correspond to where you can actually fly legally or not. They don’t even attempt to do that.

If DJI flyzones lined up with where you actually have to get authorization to fly legally then this conversation would be different. Also warning me I’m in a zone that requires authorization is one thing. Completely preventing me from flying there is quite another.

Also, DJI doesn’t accept permissions granted through LAANC which is where we get authorization from the government to fly in controlled airspace. To fly in a DJI Flyzone you must get an airspace waiver from the FAA and send it to DJI. Not only is that an unnecessary lengthy process with the FAA. Ironically, the FAA only issues waivers for airspace that is actually controlled airspace. Not all DJI flyzones are in controlled airspace and are totally ok to fly in legally so there’s no recourse for getting those areas unlocked.

To use your example DJI is putting a label on its coffee that says, “Hot! You are Forbidden from drinking!” And locking the cup so there’s no way to get in.