Real Estate and 107

[tck444]

I would like to do a one-time aerial video for a friend who is in the real estate business and would provide it at no charge. Can I do (legally) without the need for a 107 certification?

 

[mham]

Legally speaking, No. This was one of my first questions (not this one specifically) after I discovered all the rules and regs behind drone flight. Do folks do it? Yeah they do, but you put yourself and your friend's business at risk should the FAA decide to make an issue of it.

 

[tck444]

Legally speaking, No. This was one of my first questions (not this one specifically) after I discovered all the rules and regs behind drone flight. Do folks do it? Yeah they do, but you put yourself and your friend's business at risk should the FAA decide to make an issue of it.

Thanks, Good point !

 

[Vic Moss]

Your main concern shouldn't be the FAA. It should be the insurance of yours (if you have it), and the broker's. If something were to happen, neither insurance company would cover the damages. It would be considered an illegal activity, and therefore not covered.

The only recourse the damaged party would have is legal action against you, the broker, and the brokerage owners.

Really not worth the chance.

 

[CactusJackSlade]

Any furtherment of a business, whether you charge or not, is considered commercial... and what Vic Moss said - make sure your insurance is up to snuff.

 

[offtheback]

I would like to do a one-time aerial video for a friend who is in the real estate business and would provide it at no charge. Can I do (legally) without the need for a 107 certification?

As I understand the rule,you can do it for" pleasure"and when your friend sees it he can say"may I use that"?Then it's legit to use it.Liability insurance as in any case needs to be up to snuff.Murky rule.

 

[Vic Moss]

As I understand the rule.you can do it for" pleasure"and when your friend sees it he can say"may I use that"?Then it's legit to use it.Liability insurance as in any case needs to be up to snuff.Murky rule.

Nope. The rules are not murky at all. Unless it’s 100% recreational (and this wouldn’t be), a Remote Pilot Certificate is required. No question.

 

[Rich QR]

The only way you can fly without a Part 107 license is if the flight is "strictly for recreational purposes". Charging money is one way to demonstrate that the flight is not strictly for recreational purposes, but it's not the only way.

If your friend is telling you what he'd like a video of, it looks like you're doing it as a favor to him, and whether compensated explicitly or not, it doesn't sound like it's strictly for your own recreation.

 

[offtheback]

Nope. The rules are not murky at all. Unless it’s 100% recreational (and this wouldn’t be), a Remote Pilot Certificate is required. No question.

I believe it has to do with original intent of flight.In this case the cards have been laid on the table but in the scenario I presented you can do it but not a lot as one of your competitors will turn you in or if you make it a regular habit the FAA may get wind of it. From SAR 104-
"The FAA regulations care only about the intent of the flight at the time, making this a bit of a grey area. If you were just flying for fun when you took them then technically you could later sell them with or without a Part 107 certification. However - do that too much and the argument becomes less credible.

Once you actually have a Part 107 certification the same rules still apply to those previous flights, but it's really unlikely that anyone is going to pursue you over use of prior work."

 

[Vic Moss]

I believe it has to do with original intent of flight.In this case the cards have been laid on the table but in the scenario I presented you can do it but not a lot as one of your competitors will turn you in or if you make it a regular habit the FAA may get wind of it. From SAR 104-
"The FAA regulations care only about the intent of the flight at the time, making this a bit of a grey area. If you were just flying for fun when you took them then technically you could later sell them with or without a Part 107 certification. However - do that too much and the argument becomes less credible.

We are basically saying the same thing, just in a different manner.

Once you actually have a Part 107 certification the same rules still apply to those previous flights, but it's really unlikely that anyone is going to pursue you over use of prior work."

But you are wrong here. The FAA doesn't retroactively designate flights as 107 or 44809. Everything you've done before you get your 107 is still considered recreational flights. You can sell the imagery of course, but you can do that before you have your 107 anyway if the intent at the time of the flight was recreational.

And you can fly under recreational rules after you've obtained your 107. But only if it's a recreational flight. If I've made the decision to fly recreationally, I don't have a card in the camera. Ever. Just in case.

 

[offtheback]

We are basically saying the same thing, just in a different manner.

But you are wrong here. The FAA doesn't retroactively designate flights as 107 or 44809. Everything you've done before you get your 107 is still considered recreational flights. You can sell the imagery of course, but you can do that before you have your 107 anyway if the intent at the time of the flight was recreational.

And you can fly under recreational rules after you've obtained your 107. But only if it's a recreational flight. If I've made the decision to fly recreationally, I don't have a card in the camera. Ever. Just in case.

To be clear,you agree that in my hypothetical situation that he could fly recreationally and his friend could see the video afterwards and say-hey that's cool and use it commercially?

 

[Vic Moss]

To be clear,you agree that in my hypothetical situation that he could fly recreationally and his friend could see the video afterwards and say-hey that's cool and use it commercially?

No, I read your post wrong if that's what you're saying.

In your situation, that would be a 107 flight. Anything flown outside recreation (flying for your friend to show a house isn't recreation) needs to be flown with a 107.

If he's flown something previously, and someone sees it later and wants to use it, that's fine. If he's flying for a Realtor, even "for recreation", it's not under 44809.

 

[neggy]

NOT LEGAL

 

[offtheback]

No, I read your post wrong if that's what you're saying.

In your situation, that would be a 107 flight. Anything flown outside recreation (flying for your friend to show a house isn't recreation) needs to be flown with a 107.

If he's flown something previously, and someone sees it later and wants to use it, that's fine. If he's flying for a Realtor, even "for recreation", it's not under 44809.

Well..last try.I go out one day recreationally without telling anyone and do a random video.My friend sees it and says that's a cool video.Friend says ok if I use it on my realty website?You say-well I flew as a recreational pilot and didn't intend to sell it/use it commercially so it's ok for you to use it.Is this ok or am I being thick?

 

[Vic Moss]

Well..last try.I go out one day recreationally without telling anyone and do a random video.My friend sees it and says that's a cool video.Friend says ok if I use it on my realty website?You say-well I flew as a recreational pilot and didn't intend to sell it/use it commercially so it's ok for you to use it.Is this ok or am I being thick?

You can sell it. 100% legal in that case. The FAA ruled this perfectly acceptable in 2015.