Is anybody in my area who can enlighten me, maybe share some knowledge not on YouTube. As of now I will probably purchase a Mavic 2, unless the Mavic 3 appears on my radar soon. I love the Skydio but the no flying in the low light is a big problem as that's the most interesting light. I'm just starting out and could use some wisdom. I'll buy dinner, LOL
Rockland County, NY, Expert Advice Requested
- Thread starter BAcoustic
- Start date
anotherlab
Well-Known Member
Welcome aboard BAcoustic and greetings from Albany, NY!?
I'm not near Rockland, that's a couple of hours south of me, but I'll toss my two cents in. I don't forsee a Mavic 3 any time soon. There would be advance notice from people leaking images and from when it hits the FCC database. It follows the same rule for basically any electronic device, buy for what you need now - there will always be a newer version.
If you want to fly in low light, you can attach LED strobes. That will greatly increase the visibility at dusk. I've taken some nice shots over the Hudson as the Sun was starting to set.
I'm not near Rockland, that's a couple of hours south of me, but I'll toss my two cents in. I don't forsee a Mavic 3 any time soon. There would be advance notice from people leaking images and from when it hits the FCC database. It follows the same rule for basically any electronic device, buy for what you need now - there will always be a newer version.
If you want to fly in low light, you can attach LED strobes. That will greatly increase the visibility at dusk. I've taken some nice shots over the Hudson as the Sun was starting to set.
mshmovie
Well-Known Member
I'm in New City, certainly Rockland as it's the county seat. I have a M2P, MP Platinum, MP, Spark, Mavic Mini, Skydio 2 (Flamewheel and another kit that uses the motors from the Inspire); tomorrow I'll add the MA2S to the fleet (easier to travel with than the M2P).
When flying as night, I use my M2 Pro with Red (Left), Green (Right) and White (Rear) Strobes so it's super easy to see it; in fact I'll use them during the day to enhance visual line of sight; I did this in Sedona the other week as I wanted to be able to see and be seen (Image below - obviously...)
Many folk put two reds in the front and two greens in the rear; I adhere to navigation conventions.
Feel free to reach out and I'll gladly share what I can to help you out.
Thanks for the info. I would love to drain your brain for info, can I buy you lunch one day and chat drones? How about Pastrami at the deli? Thx, Brad
mshmovie
Well-Known Member
Hi Brad,
Sure thing - we can meet on my street and fly (once above the trees it's an easy place to fly); I can toss something on the grill out back.
I'm off New Hempstead Rd a few blocks west of Little Tor. If the weather is decent this weekend - I'll be flying; great way to take my mind off work.
Regards,
Marc
Marc,
I have 4 grills, I'm into it. Two Pit Barrels, a Weber Summit Charcoal and a Bronco. I was reading flying in Rockland is way illegal, anywhere. I guess this is not enforced? Are you 107 certified?
mshmovie
Well-Known Member
I'm not 107 and our best friend is the town attorney and another friend is the town attorney of Orangeburg. Do not fly in a town or county park where it is prohibited. I fly from my property up to 100ft altitude (where it's FAA airspace) is outside jurisdiction; then I can operate within visual line of sight.
mshmovie
Well-Known Member
Adding that my son flew at RCC's field this weekend without issue; he's super diligent. I have two grills and a smoker (sous vide for those looooong cooks).
Sorry, I'm late to the game. I live off of Little Tor in New City also. I'm wavering on picking up a DJI Air 2s. I'm concerned I'll be limited to flying around my neighborhood. Was hoping to film along the river in Nyack and Haverstraw, but don't think I can legally.
Has anyone been issued a ticket for violating the county no-fly law?
Has anyone been issued a ticket for violating the county no-fly law?
mshmovie
Well-Known Member
A few years back the county passed a very strict drone law. I don't think it's enforceable, but I'm not going to be the one to sue over it. Rockland Drone Laws
The important part is "Rockland County to an individual's private property, another individual's private property with that private property owner's consent, public property with the consent of the municipality that owns it, and public parks, unless such use is prohibited by the governmental entity having jurisdiction over such park, including but not limited to the Division of Environmental Resources of the County of Rockland."
I included the complete law below for informational purposes.
This chapter shall be known as the "Drone Regulation Law."
§ 234-2Legislative intent.
A.
Drones, which are unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) that can fly under the control of a remote pilot or via a geographical positions system (GPS) guided autopilot mechanism, have become increasingly available to private citizens for personal and recreational uses due to their declining cost. Drones can fly at altitudes below the navigable airspace (generally at 400 feet) which is not within the jurisdiction, regulation and control of the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA).
B.
Some drones are equipped with high-definition cameras, night-vision cameras and infrared-see-through scopes. They can be used to fly about private residences and to hover outside someone's window or in their backyard without the knowledge of the resident, who has a reasonable expectation of privacy in his or her home and in his or her backyard.
C.
Additionally, there is a very real safety and security concern when it comes to drones carrying and dropping contraband items such as drugs or weapons onto certain grounds such as courthouses, correctional facilities or schools. For example, a drone was used in Bishopville, South Carolina in April 2014 to attempt the smuggling of contraband into a jail, including marijuana, cell phones and tobacco. A drone delivery attempt was likewise made in November 2013 to sneak contraband into a prison in Calhoun County, Georgia.
D.
In addition to those child and adult residents of this County that use these drones for hobby or enjoyment, drones may also be purchased and operated by sex offenders and other persons with criminal backgrounds, such as but not limited to those with convictions for domestic violence, theft, burglary, trespass, and assault. Yet there are currently no federal or state regulations regarding who may purchase a drone, which represents a safety risk to members of the public.
E.
In light of all the foregoing concerns, this chapter will limit the use of drones in Rockland County to an individual's private property, another individual's private property with that private property owner's consent, public property with the consent of the municipality that owns it, and public parks, unless such use is prohibited by the governmental entity having jurisdiction over such park, including but not limited to the Division of Environmental Resources of the County of Rockland.
§ 234-3Definitions.
As used in this article, the following terms shall have the meanings indicated:
COUNTYThe County of Rockland, New York.DRONEAn unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) that can fly under the control of a remote pilot or via a geographical positions system (GPS) guided autopilot mechanism.LAW ENFORCEMENTA lawfully established state or local public agency that is responsible for the prevention of crime, local government code enforcement with authority to enforce penal, traffic, regulatory, game, or controlled substance laws or regulations.PERSONAny natural person, individual, corporation, unincorporated association, proprietorship, firm, partnership, joint venture, joint-stock association, or other entity of business of any kind.
§ 234-4Restrictions on operation.
A.
A person may not fly or otherwise operate a drone in Rockland County except in and above the following locations:
(1)
A person's own private property;
(2)
Another person's private property with the permission of an owner of that property; and
(3)
Public property, other than public parks, only with the written permission of the controlling municipality or agency; and
(4)
Public parks, unless such use is prohibited by the governmental entity having jurisdiction over such property, including but not limited to the Division of Environmental Resources of the County of Rockland.
B.
Any flying of drones above the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex or within 50 feet of the property line of the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex is specifically prohibited and subjects the operator to enhanced penalties as set forth in § 234-6D of this chapter.
C.
Any unauthorized flying of drones above and within the property lines of a school, publically advertised house of worship, government building, courthouse or municipal sewer facility is prohibited and subjects the operator to enhanced penalties as set forth in § 234-6D.
D.
This section shall not be construed to authorize the use of a drone for any purpose that would violate state, local or federal law.
§ 234-5Exemptions.
This chapter does not prohibit the following use of a drone:
A.
Persons using drones in the course of employment of a government agency, or on behalf of one of those agencies are not subject to the prohibitions set forth in § 234-4.
B.
If a law enforcement agency is using the drone in accordance with accepted Fourth Amendment jurisprudence with regard to search and seizure.
C.
If a fire and emergency services agency is using a drone solely for purposes of:
(1)
Providing an aerial view in order to better manage fire-fighting resources by determining point of origin, shape, or boundaries of forest fires;
(2)
Assisting in rescue of individuals from remote and difficult-to-access locations such as parkland, forests or mountains; or
(3)
Providing crucial information needed when responding to incidents involving hazardous materials without endangering fire and emergency service personnel.
D.
In the event a federal, state or local official declares a state of emergency in Rockland County, in which case utility companies under the jurisdiction of the Public Service Commission, and any employees or other persons on the utility companies' behalf, may utilize drones for damage assessment and recovery operations without the need for a warrant or consent.
E.
By utility companies operating under the jurisdiction of the Public Service Commission, and any employees or other persons on the utility companies' behalf, for the purpose of:
(1)
Inspection of utility facilities and transmission lines they own and operate;
(2)
Inspection of lands, highway, roadways, or areas belonging to New York State or its political subdivisions that contain or are planned to contain utility facilities controlled by such utility company;
(3)
Inspection of utility easements on private property, with notification to the property owner.
§ 234-6Penalties for offenses.
A.
Any person found to be in violation of the provisions of this chapter shall be guilty of a violation and subject to a fine of $250.
B.
Any person found to have violated the provisions of this chapter twice within a twelve-month period shall be guilty of a violation and subject to a fine of $500.
C.
Any person found to have violated the provisions of this chapter three times within a twelve-month period or more than three times within a twenty-four-month period shall be guilty of a Class A misdemeanor and subject to a fine of up to $1,000 and a sentence of up to one year in jail.
D.
Any person found to have violated the provisions of this chapter by using or otherwise operating a drone above the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex or within 50 feet of the property line of the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex or above or within the property lines of a school, publicly advertised house of worship, government building, courthouse, or municipal sewer facility shall be guilty of a Class A misdemeanor and subject to a fine of up to $500 and a sentence of up to six months in jail.
E.
Any person found to have violated the provisions of this chapter by using or otherwise operating a drone above the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex or within 50 feet of the property line of the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex or above or within the property lines of a school, publicly advertised house of worship, government building, courthouse, or municipal sewer facility two times within a twelve-month period or more than three times within a twenty-four-month period shall be guilty of a Class A misdemeanor and subject to a fine of up to $1,000 and a sentence of up to one year in jail.
The important part is "Rockland County to an individual's private property, another individual's private property with that private property owner's consent, public property with the consent of the municipality that owns it, and public parks, unless such use is prohibited by the governmental entity having jurisdiction over such park, including but not limited to the Division of Environmental Resources of the County of Rockland."
I included the complete law below for informational purposes.
This chapter shall be known as the "Drone Regulation Law."
§ 234-2Legislative intent.
A.
Drones, which are unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) that can fly under the control of a remote pilot or via a geographical positions system (GPS) guided autopilot mechanism, have become increasingly available to private citizens for personal and recreational uses due to their declining cost. Drones can fly at altitudes below the navigable airspace (generally at 400 feet) which is not within the jurisdiction, regulation and control of the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA).
B.
Some drones are equipped with high-definition cameras, night-vision cameras and infrared-see-through scopes. They can be used to fly about private residences and to hover outside someone's window or in their backyard without the knowledge of the resident, who has a reasonable expectation of privacy in his or her home and in his or her backyard.
C.
Additionally, there is a very real safety and security concern when it comes to drones carrying and dropping contraband items such as drugs or weapons onto certain grounds such as courthouses, correctional facilities or schools. For example, a drone was used in Bishopville, South Carolina in April 2014 to attempt the smuggling of contraband into a jail, including marijuana, cell phones and tobacco. A drone delivery attempt was likewise made in November 2013 to sneak contraband into a prison in Calhoun County, Georgia.
D.
In addition to those child and adult residents of this County that use these drones for hobby or enjoyment, drones may also be purchased and operated by sex offenders and other persons with criminal backgrounds, such as but not limited to those with convictions for domestic violence, theft, burglary, trespass, and assault. Yet there are currently no federal or state regulations regarding who may purchase a drone, which represents a safety risk to members of the public.
E.
In light of all the foregoing concerns, this chapter will limit the use of drones in Rockland County to an individual's private property, another individual's private property with that private property owner's consent, public property with the consent of the municipality that owns it, and public parks, unless such use is prohibited by the governmental entity having jurisdiction over such park, including but not limited to the Division of Environmental Resources of the County of Rockland.
§ 234-3Definitions.
As used in this article, the following terms shall have the meanings indicated:
COUNTYThe County of Rockland, New York.DRONEAn unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) that can fly under the control of a remote pilot or via a geographical positions system (GPS) guided autopilot mechanism.LAW ENFORCEMENTA lawfully established state or local public agency that is responsible for the prevention of crime, local government code enforcement with authority to enforce penal, traffic, regulatory, game, or controlled substance laws or regulations.PERSONAny natural person, individual, corporation, unincorporated association, proprietorship, firm, partnership, joint venture, joint-stock association, or other entity of business of any kind.
§ 234-4Restrictions on operation.
A.
A person may not fly or otherwise operate a drone in Rockland County except in and above the following locations:
(1)
A person's own private property;
(2)
Another person's private property with the permission of an owner of that property; and
(3)
Public property, other than public parks, only with the written permission of the controlling municipality or agency; and
(4)
Public parks, unless such use is prohibited by the governmental entity having jurisdiction over such property, including but not limited to the Division of Environmental Resources of the County of Rockland.
B.
Any flying of drones above the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex or within 50 feet of the property line of the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex is specifically prohibited and subjects the operator to enhanced penalties as set forth in § 234-6D of this chapter.
C.
Any unauthorized flying of drones above and within the property lines of a school, publically advertised house of worship, government building, courthouse or municipal sewer facility is prohibited and subjects the operator to enhanced penalties as set forth in § 234-6D.
D.
This section shall not be construed to authorize the use of a drone for any purpose that would violate state, local or federal law.
§ 234-5Exemptions.
This chapter does not prohibit the following use of a drone:
A.
Persons using drones in the course of employment of a government agency, or on behalf of one of those agencies are not subject to the prohibitions set forth in § 234-4.
B.
If a law enforcement agency is using the drone in accordance with accepted Fourth Amendment jurisprudence with regard to search and seizure.
C.
If a fire and emergency services agency is using a drone solely for purposes of:
(1)
Providing an aerial view in order to better manage fire-fighting resources by determining point of origin, shape, or boundaries of forest fires;
(2)
Assisting in rescue of individuals from remote and difficult-to-access locations such as parkland, forests or mountains; or
(3)
Providing crucial information needed when responding to incidents involving hazardous materials without endangering fire and emergency service personnel.
D.
In the event a federal, state or local official declares a state of emergency in Rockland County, in which case utility companies under the jurisdiction of the Public Service Commission, and any employees or other persons on the utility companies' behalf, may utilize drones for damage assessment and recovery operations without the need for a warrant or consent.
E.
By utility companies operating under the jurisdiction of the Public Service Commission, and any employees or other persons on the utility companies' behalf, for the purpose of:
(1)
Inspection of utility facilities and transmission lines they own and operate;
(2)
Inspection of lands, highway, roadways, or areas belonging to New York State or its political subdivisions that contain or are planned to contain utility facilities controlled by such utility company;
(3)
Inspection of utility easements on private property, with notification to the property owner.
§ 234-6Penalties for offenses.
A.
Any person found to be in violation of the provisions of this chapter shall be guilty of a violation and subject to a fine of $250.
B.
Any person found to have violated the provisions of this chapter twice within a twelve-month period shall be guilty of a violation and subject to a fine of $500.
C.
Any person found to have violated the provisions of this chapter three times within a twelve-month period or more than three times within a twenty-four-month period shall be guilty of a Class A misdemeanor and subject to a fine of up to $1,000 and a sentence of up to one year in jail.
D.
Any person found to have violated the provisions of this chapter by using or otherwise operating a drone above the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex or within 50 feet of the property line of the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex or above or within the property lines of a school, publicly advertised house of worship, government building, courthouse, or municipal sewer facility shall be guilty of a Class A misdemeanor and subject to a fine of up to $500 and a sentence of up to six months in jail.
E.
Any person found to have violated the provisions of this chapter by using or otherwise operating a drone above the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex or within 50 feet of the property line of the Rockland County Jail or Sheriff complex or above or within the property lines of a school, publicly advertised house of worship, government building, courthouse, or municipal sewer facility two times within a twelve-month period or more than three times within a twenty-four-month period shall be guilty of a Class A misdemeanor and subject to a fine of up to $1,000 and a sentence of up to one year in jail.
mshmovie
Well-Known Member
There's parts of this that are incorrect and parts that coincide with known no fly zones; the jail for instance.
They're within jurisdiction to say you can't fly from within their property, you can fly over it at 100 ft to 400 feet.
The section about the FAA,: Drones can fly at altitudes below the navigable airspace (generally at 400 feet) which is not within the jurisdiction, regulation and control of the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA).
That's incredibly poor wording.
FAA governs airspace from 100 feet above ground level and up and constrains UAV generally to below 400ft. The county has no jurisdiction of the space between 100 and 400 ft even over parks; just don't fly from within.
No fly zones are to be taken seriously.
Additionally, our best friend is the town attorney for Clarkstown and another friend is the town attorney for Orangeburg; I fly over the town attorney's home always and have spoken with her about drone laws a few times.
I am unconcerned. Their draft is lacking in absolute constraint and fails fact immediately w.r.t. FAA jurisdiction.
I do appreciate and support the spirit and concerns it tries to protect; but it's very paranoid compared to the majority of drone users' intent - innocent fun, no harm, no privacy intrusion (which isn't viable from 100 feet and above)
They're within jurisdiction to say you can't fly from within their property, you can fly over it at 100 ft to 400 feet.
The section about the FAA,: Drones can fly at altitudes below the navigable airspace (generally at 400 feet) which is not within the jurisdiction, regulation and control of the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA).
That's incredibly poor wording.
FAA governs airspace from 100 feet above ground level and up and constrains UAV generally to below 400ft. The county has no jurisdiction of the space between 100 and 400 ft even over parks; just don't fly from within.
No fly zones are to be taken seriously.
Additionally, our best friend is the town attorney for Clarkstown and another friend is the town attorney for Orangeburg; I fly over the town attorney's home always and have spoken with her about drone laws a few times.
I am unconcerned. Their draft is lacking in absolute constraint and fails fact immediately w.r.t. FAA jurisdiction.
I do appreciate and support the spirit and concerns it tries to protect; but it's very paranoid compared to the majority of drone users' intent - innocent fun, no harm, no privacy intrusion (which isn't viable from 100 feet and above)
It's definitely not well written and probably not enforceable, but could cost a lot more than the $250 fine trying to fight it.
I may reach out to my county legislator questioning how broad it is?
I'm guessing it's one of those laws where unless someone complains about you flying over their house you won't have any problems.
Mike
I may reach out to my county legislator questioning how broad it is?
I'm guessing it's one of those laws where unless someone complains about you flying over their house you won't have any problems.
Mike
mshmovie
Well-Known Member
Check out this page: Recreational Flyers & Modeler Community-Based Organizations
Specifically item 6:
You will find that B4UFly give the all clear (not anywhere near the Sheriff's or Jail or course - that's a real no fly zone for good reason).
Airspace is FAA's domain where the homeowner stops using it; top of the tallest tree.
Assume whatever risk you feel comfortable with, I'm confident knowing I'm well covered and fly responsibly; no way I can violate privacy (even when I have my Skydio 2 following me, it's focused on me), my DJIs are way high at 100 feet AGL or higher once I'm away from my property.
The Rockland status appears to carve out an exception for public parks. See Section 4(A)(4) (http://rocklandgov.com/files/6114/3750/0716/LOCAL_LAW_NO._2_OF_2015.pdf)
mshmovie
Well-Known Member
Every Rockland country I've visited seemed to have a sign prohibiting drones.
If you takeoff from outside the park and do not walk into it, that keeps you FAA compliant. I'd prefer not to mess with it and use other options.
Thanks for this knowledge dump! Where do you fly the Skydio2 if you need to keep it above 100 ft?
Hi there! Where do you usually fly the Skydio2 since you fly higher than 100 ft?
Thanks
mshmovie
Well-Known Member
I rarely fly my Skydio.
Mostly on my street (double cul-de-sac), on a trail and through historical gold mine works in Colorado and through some wooded areas (also in Coloroado). Parks in Rockland are off limits so I can't enjoy it there.
My Skydio is always much lower than any other drone because it can do so without much (not any) concern for hitting objects and it's following us or it's being flown through obstacles that would be a bad idea for anything else (we'll see what the real obstacle avoidance capabilities are of the Mavic 3 as the real release of APAS 5 is made available). I'll occasionally raise it above a tree to get an unobstructed view of the subject.
The Skydio's use case is very different than other drones; it's like a GoPro/Action Cam that flies itself and keep you in focus with decent imaging and limited range (enhanced WiFi controls). DJI or Autel Robotics have significantly more range, better image quality and are more enjoyable to fly in open space (absolutely not in a confined space - get the Skydio as that's where it shines).
Never owned a drone before but am an avid cyclist and would like to get some shots of the drone following me. I have a Skydio2 with beacon so with somewhat an extended range. I ride along the GW all the way up Bear Mtn. Since the B4UFLY app only gives me the green on airspace clearance, how do you determine when you can use the drone?
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