U.S. Department of Justice : Their Drone Rules and Regs and Their Punishment Criteria.

Don Testme · Feb 1, 2023

NOTE: This post is simply placed here to inform drone pilots of the increasing threats and punishments of misusing your drone. I can't remove political names from the original article, so just ignore them and focus on the severe consequences that could occur if a drone is misused.

https://www.justice.gov/ola/page/file/1465976/download

"....I am pleased to present for the consideration of the Congress a legislative proposal that would fill a gap in authorities to prosecute malicious and dangerous uses of unmanned aircraft (drones)....."

Additional EDIT: I wasn't looking for this internet post, but here it is. It's as if our society thinks drones are going to be more of a threat than guns or just plane old bombs you can make at home. Here is the Link: Confronting Drone Threats: Why New Technology Requires Action

Click links to see more

BobaFut · Feb 1, 2023

So if I'm reading this correctly, DOJ would like to imprison you for a minimum of 5 years for things like not using proper lighting at night or flying above your LAANC-approved altitude, because terrorism?

AlanL · Feb 1, 2023

Which part of the suggested rules are a problem? None of the activities outlined for penalties are legal now anyway.

BobaFut · Feb 1, 2023

AlanL said:
Which part of the suggested rules are a problem? None of the activities outlined for penalties are legal now anyway.

Because this proposed legislation, AFAICT, takes what are now minor regulatory infractions and makes them major felonies? It's basically codifying FAA regulations into the US criminal code (not making new rules). Happy to be wrong in my interpretation though...

Dmcvey · Feb 1, 2023

The Senate version was referred to committee for review in Feb. 2022. The House version referred to committee in November.

Date	All Actions Except Amendments
11/01/2022	Referred to the Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism, and Homeland Security. Action By: Committee on the Judiciary
06/07/2022	Referred to the House Committee on the Judiciary. Action By: House of Representatives
06/07/2022	Introduced in House Action By: House of Representatives

vindibona1 · Feb 1, 2023

Dmcvey said:
The Senate version was referred to committee for review in Feb. 2022. The House version referred to committee in November.

Date All Actions Except Amendments
11/01/2022 Referred to the Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism, and Homeland Security.
Action By: Committee on the Judiciary
06/07/2022 Referred to the House Committee on the Judiciary.
Action By: House of Representatives
06/07/2022 Introduced in House
Action By: House of Representatives

I would have to assume that it was only introduced in the House and went no further that this particular legislation is dead in the water.

But I'm still amused by "President Harris". I suspect we might see this in the near future. I have thoughts on this, but I'll stop here for the sake of forum rules.

Dmcvey · Feb 1, 2023

It is probably working through committee sloooowly.
I think the VP is considered the President of the Senate, similar to House Speaker.

Chip · Feb 2, 2023

BobaFuct said:
So if I'm reading this correctly, DOJ would like to imprison you for a minimum of 5 years for things like not using proper lighting at night or flying above your LAANC-approved altitude, because terrorism?

Well I would add the FAA to DOJ.

BobaFuct said:
Because this proposed legislation, AFAICT, takes what are now minor regulatory infractions and makes them major felonies? It's basically codifying FAA regulations into the US criminal code (not making new rules). Happy to be wrong in my interpretation though...

Yes, exactly right. Note the one section that says if you cause $1,000+ property damage with your drone or cause bodily injury = years in federal prison. Statute uses the word "knowingly." That is a lower standard of proof than for "reckless endangerment," under state law. All of the FAA's statements over the years about no need to change or add to laws that already criminalize certain behaviors was total gaslighting.

BobaFut · Feb 2, 2023

Are there any drone hobbyist lobbying orgs? The only orgs I'm aware of are basically industry groups trying to make it easier for law enforcement and military to buy drones. No one seems to be looking out for the average flyer. I don't know that I like the idea of leaving lobbying to the AMA or whatever, since they'd probably just advocate for better RC flying fields and eventually drone flying will be limited to those areas. There is a similar problem with the motorcycle lobby, which is solely focused on defeating helmet laws and not actually getting states to make it better/safer/more convenient for riders.

Ideally, a drone lobby group would work with the FAA to produce common-sense regulations (Part 107 is largely reasonable, IMO, but could use some tweaks), which would hopefully forestall federal and local efforts to implement draconian limits and penalties on drone flyers. Not sure why the industry doesn't seem to be doing much in this space, since new restrictions are going to put a major dent in their sales. But maybe they don't care if their profits are mostly in the LE/Military sales anyway?

spsphotos · Feb 2, 2023

It won't go anywhere unless there is some major terrorist incident involving drones.

GFields · Feb 2, 2023

Stay on Topic folks. This thread has nothing to do with the rules or legislation of other countries (or other issues)

Nanny Ogg · Feb 2, 2023

I think society would be better off if the DOJ worried more about firearms rather than drones.

Don Testme · Feb 2, 2023

spsphotos said:
It won't go anywhere unless there is some major terrorist incident involving drones.

Prey it doesn't happen

Prop Wash · Feb 3, 2023

I just read the "Bill."
1. No wonder these bills are so long - they seem to repeat info several times.
2. Noted @ the top of the "Bill."
"A BILL
To prevent the misuse of drones, and for other purposes."
Look how many gun laws are on the books to "prevent" mass shootings - they still happen. Do they REALLY think they will prevent this from happening? Criminals don't follow the law.
3. As stated by @AlanL, these things are already illegal. "So let's be redundant!"
4. Yes, there should be penalties for the crimes, but these things tend to freak out the law-abiding drone community. The Majority of us will never face prison time for how we fly our drones.

This is MY opinion.

Don Testme · Feb 3, 2023

One of the biggest things that the people do who get caught IS BRAGGING and or Posting on their own personal social pages. That's just dumb.

Dmcvey · Feb 3, 2023

spsphotos said:
It won't go anywhere unless there is some major terrorist incident involving drones.

I would rather deal with it now. If there was an event there would be an overreaction and it might be worse.

BobaFut · Feb 3, 2023

Prop Wash said:
I just read the "Bill."
1. No wonder these bills are so long - they seem to repeat info several times.
2. Noted @ the top of the "Bill."
"A BILL
To prevent the misuse of drones, and for other purposes."
Look how many gun laws are on the books to "prevent" mass shootings - they still happen. Do they REALLY think they will prevent this from happening? Criminals don't follow the law.
3. As stated by @AlanL, these things are already illegal. "So let's be redundant!"
4. Yes, there should be penalties for the crimes, but these things tend to freak out the law-abiding drone community. The Majority of us will never face prison time for how we fly our drones.

This is MY opinion.

Not to debate the purpose of laws, but the argument you put forth is one against all laws, which is obviously a non-starter.

The violations outlined in this proposed legislation (e.g. flying without lights at night, violating restricted airspace) are regulatory violations (Part 107 falls under Title 14 of the US Code of Federal Regulations) with civil penalties. This law would make them *criminal* violations (again, I'm happy to have this interpretation corrected if I'm wrong). The US has civil penalties and criminal penalties, and being hit with one or other is (put very simply), the difference between getting fined and getting thrown in prison. I personally would not like to even potentially face felony charges if I don't fly with strobes on my drone at night or accidentally wander into controlled airspace without authorization.

Prop Wash · Feb 3, 2023

BobaFuct said:
Not to debate the purpose of laws, but the argument you put forth is one against all laws, which is obviously a non-starter.

The violations outlined in this proposed legislation (e.g. flying without lights at night, violating restricted airspace) are regulatory violations (Part 107 falls under Title 14 of the US Code of Federal Regulations) with civil penalties. This law would make them *criminal* violations (again, I'm happy to have this interpretation corrected if I'm wrong). The US has civil penalties and criminal penalties, and being hit with one or other is (put very simply), the difference between getting fined and getting thrown in prison. I personally would not like to even potentially face felony charges if I don't fly with strobes on my drone at night or accidentally wander into controlled airspace without authorization.

I can see how it might look like I'm against laws. I am not. Laws are absolutely necessary to keep people from running amuck and the law abiding citizens follow them. Punishment for violating laws, whether civil or criminal is also necessary.
Some laws, like this one and some gun laws, as mentioned, seem ineffective somewhat. I mentioned gun laws and as a gun owner myself, it seems that when a law isn't quite effective they wanted they start piling on new laws to bring more restrictions which, in turn, affects law abiding citizens making it harder for them to enjoy shooting.
My opinion is that this maybe one of those types of laws. If this law doesn't have desired effect, more laws will be added, will bring more restrictions which, in turn, will affect those of us who follow the law when flying our drones.

Dmcvey · Feb 3, 2023

"operates an unmanned aircraft across a border of the United States or its territories or possessions without complying with the requirements of Federal law".......Fly a drone of drugs from Mexico to US...how are you going to enforce that?

“(d) INTRUSION ON PROTECTED SPACES. – Whoever, knowing that his conduct is unlawful".....if you did not know or accidently flew into protected airspace???? but then you would be violation of flying reckless because you should have planned adequately and seen the restricted airspace.

"uses an unmanned aircraft to cause serious bodily injury to a person or damage exceeding $1,000 to property",...crashing accidently and causing injury would not apply, using is the key here, aiming the drone at a person or crowd and flying into them, yes. it is the intent.

BobaFut · Feb 3, 2023

Dmcvey said:
"it is the intent.

Yeah, criminal law typically revolves around intent. But in our justice system, regardless of how the system is supposed to work, the onus is on you to prove you didn't have the intent if you are charged with a crime. And doing that tends to involve things like an arrest, bail, lawyers, a trial or plea deal, etc...I would much rather fight a civil fine than face a felony charge, even if I didn't intend to break the law.