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Mini 2 What I've learned about various filters. . .ND, variable ND and polarizer. . . .

Karlewski

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I started out with a convenient to change variable ND, tried all kinds ND strengths and I did get great motion blur flying fast and low but, honestly not worth the effort or the non uniform sky effect from a variable filter. So then I only used an nd 16 or nothing at all in low light, cloudy, real early. . . . Again, I'm not convinced that was really a very noticeable/worthy improvement, a bit more blur for rare low passes. Next trial, nd16 with PL, that I believe did slightly improve blur like before but, for my scenes, I think the Polarizer aspect is the best improvement. Flying over snow, water buildings. . .even glare from rock and vegetation is often reduced substantially when angled properly to the sunlight. I am speculating that the PL reduction in glare also slightly reduces the overall exposure range by dimming reflective highlight areas, and reducing the overall dynamic range of these shots which is great for our little drone sensors with poor dynamic range to begin with. Very recently I flew my mini 2 with PL one trip and no PL filter the next. I liked the PL footage better, improved saturated colors, more detail in highlight/reflective areas. Since I generally fly all over the place searching for cool angles to reveal scale, get nice parallax. . . I always fly in auto mode. I hate wasting flight time/battery fiddling with camera settings while airborne as ambient exposures constantly change anyway with quickly changing camera angles like orbits around a subject. . . . Not only am I searching for impressive angles and composition but also observing where the footage appears to be most attractive due to sun angle coupled with the auto settings and PL. Last thing, with so many airborne particles these days, especially smoke, I am quite sure the polarizer also reduces the haze associated to sunlight reflecting off that crap as well. . . I do remove my PL if I'm in low light. . . heavy clouds or sun rise/set trying to stop the auto setting from bumping up the ISO. . . Personally nd is not worth the effort for me. . . I rarely see/notice that jitter associated to the lack of motion blur and if it is real bad I suppose I could add blur in post anyway. . .
Way long winded, hope that helps!

PS never use digital zoom, you can alway zoom in post while better controlling you composition. The only reason I would even consider it. . . if I was searching for something, using it like magnifying glass. . . once found I'd go right back to 1x with 4k resolution. . .
 
Nice post.
Yeah, a polarizer will knock the exposure down some. I haven't bothered purchasing filters for my Mini 2. A fixed aperture camera is a pain do deal with if you need to shoot with shutter priority of the golden 2:1 cinematic ratio as the only options for exposure change is to change the ND filter or change the shutter speed, which negates the need for an ND filter. In changing or variable light it can be futile. After 4 weeks of owning a Mini 1 I purchased a Mavic 2 Pro with variable aperture. It doesn't take much guesswork to understand why DJI didn't put a variable aperture on the Air2s, but I don't understand why they haven't updated the Mavic 2 series which is now 3 years old while the MA2 was only out about a year.

My experience with filters and the M2P has been interesting. I first bought a set of Skyreat ND and PL filters, but came across someone's post that had shots with PolarPro GRADIENT filters. Those have become my go-to filters. Why gradients? Because all of us know when we are shooting scenes with both ground and sky either the sky is too bright or the ground is too dark. When shooting one of those scene you can almost never go wrong with a gradient as long as you make a good exposure choice. Sadly, Polarpro had discontinued the gradients and I have no idea why. I finally found a set in JAPAN and they were expensive, but IMO well worth it. With a variable aperture camera I can guess an exposure if I am in need of the 2:1 1/60- 30fps shutter ratio and pick the best gradient filter, but often just leave the lowest one on the camera if I'm not that concerned with the ratio because the sky will always be brighter than the ground and even if not shooting sky the gradient isn't that pronounced and a little vignetting doesn't really hurt in most cases...

HEY SKYREAT... GRADIENTS... ARE YOU LISTENING????
 
Wow, interesting, love the gradient idea for all bright sky shots! And you don't really think it hurts those top down shots much with no sky in them??? I am tired of the sky being blown out regularly, LOL cool solution!
 
Wow, interesting, love the gradient idea for all bright sky shots! And you don't really think it hurts those top down shots much with no sky in them??? I am tired of the sky being blown out regularly, LOL cool solution!
Yeah... But nobody makes them any longer. If you can find a set- grab 'em. I think Freewell has them for other DJI models but the ones for the M2P are no longer available on Amazon. Here's an Amazon link: Amazon.com : Freewell Landscape Gradient ND Camera Lens Filters – 4K Series – 3Pack ND8-GR, ND16-4, ND32-8 Compatible with Mavic Air 2 Drone : Camera & Photo
 
Wow, interesting, love the gradient idea for all bright sky shots! And you don't really think it hurts those top down shots much with no sky in them??? I am tired of the sky being blown out regularly, LOL cool solution!

Generally you line up the middle horizontal on the horizon with gradients, for all other shots it will not be a good thing.
 
Generally you line up the middle horizontal on the horizon with gradients, for all other shots it will not be a good thing.
I’m sorry, but I don’t totally agree. At least the gradients that I have are not so severe that it makes much difference. At least I’ve never suspected that it is ruined anything. I tend to use the gradients just like I use a regular ND filter and leave it on a lot of the time.
 
I’m sorry, but I don’t totally agree. At least the gradients that I have are not so severe that it makes much difference. At least I’ve never suspected that it is ruined anything. I tend to use the gradients just like I use a regular ND filter and leave it on a lot of the time.

I've only ever read about them (here and other places like YouTube), so maybe they don't change things as much as I thought .. .. .. but isn't the idea that the top half is more filtered to lower the glare of the sky, while leaving the bottom half less affected to allow more light.

It's generally accepted this is a 50/50 thing on the horizon.

Neutral Density Filters For Great Aerial Landscape Photography

Billy Kyle did a great video, he explains ND in this video then goes onto the gradient, which is where I copied the URL for the video below from.

 
I've only ever read about them (here and other places like YouTube), so maybe they don't change things as much as I thought .. .. .. but isn't the idea that the top half is more filtered to lower the glare of the sky, while leaving the bottom half less affected to allow more light.

It's generally accepted this is a 50/50 thing on the horizon.

Neutral Density Filters For Great Aerial Landscape Photography

Billy Kyle did a great video, he explains ND in this video then goes onto the gradient, which is where I copied the URL for the video below from.

Thanks for the post. If you fast forward to 4:38 of Billy's video he said "If I didn't tell you there was a gradient filter on, you might not know". That was my point exactly. As a professional photographer back in the day shooting film I often shot with a vignetter in front of the lens. When I went full digital in 2001 (I think) Photoshop eliminated the need for an on camera vignette filter (as well as the bellows attachment that the vignette screen attached to. It is rare that I don't do something to gradate the light in my photographs.
 
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Thanks for the post. If you fast forward to 4:38 of Billy's video he said "If I didn't tell you there was a gradient filter on, you might not know". That was my point exactly. As a professional photographer back in the day shooting film I often shot with a vignetter in front of the lens. When I went full digital in 2001 (I think) Photoshop eliminated the need for an on camera vignette filter (as well as the bellows attachment that the vignette screen attached to. It is rare that I don't do something to gradate the light in my photographs.

Cheers.
Billys example there at 4:38 is interesting, of course when he pans up later with blown out sky, that's where it would be very handy to have 1/8th of the light in the upper half.

My initial thoughts on gradient filters is that due to the obvious ND difference between top and bottom (some 3 stops between the different levels) these filters would be perfect for landscape photography, where it is often difficult to get good exposure between sky and ground.
Clear at the bottom, ND8 top would be perfect for photos I feel, as you generally keep that crisp shutter speed.

A little more hit and miss for video where you are constantly changing gimbal pitch for the obvious benefits of shots from horizon level to directly below, but it was hard to pick up in his example 4:38.
 
Cheers.
Billys example there at 4:38 is interesting, of course when he pans up later with blown out sky, that's where it would be very handy to have 1/8th of the light in the upper half.

My initial thoughts on gradient filters is that due to the obvious ND difference between top and bottom (some 3 stops between the different levels) these filters would be perfect for landscape photography, where it is often difficult to get good exposure between sky and ground.
Clear at the bottom, ND8 top would be perfect for photos I feel, as you generally keep that crisp shutter speed.

A little more hit and miss for video where you are constantly changing gimbal pitch for the obvious benefits of shots from horizon level to directly below, but it was hard to pick up in his example 4:38.
After reading through the three -way conversations above between Karlewski, Vindibona, and Mavic South-oz, I would just add this.

I freely use gradient filters (mostly LEE filters from England) for my DSLR work, to hold back a bright sky, sunrise, sunset against a darkened foreground. These require careful positioning of the horizon, and a tripod.

This is not quite so easy with a drone, where you have little ability to make that very fine horizon adjustment in flight, or if you are changing directions. Thus, I continue to just use my ND16 in videos for bright situations, and no filter for darker lighting situations.

For still images, my still my GO-TO fix is the Adobe Camera RAW (ACR) gradient filter. I can always bring out details in the bottom foregrounds, but I do not want to blow out the details in the right side of the histogram, from where there is no chance of a a recovery of details. So I will always expose to the right of the histogram, not clipping on the right to recovery any highlights there. Then, in post, I can bring out details with the gradient filter.

Oh how I would love to have a gradient filter for Premiere Pro! Anybody out there know how I can do that?

For serious filming, I am happy to have the aperture control of the Mavic 2 Pro, but sometimes, we are forced to fall back on the Mini because of travel restrictions. For Karlewski, it is important to lighten the load in his backpack, for me it is important to get the smaller drone through customs. So we have to make some compromises.

Dale
Miami
 
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I’m tempted. . . I think I could make gradients work, even top down there is usually a bright side and I fly right stick only often to maintain a constant shot direction and exposure. ie due north. . .once I find an “exposure sweet spot“ . The most basic example being the sun behind the camera and everything lit up. . . All shadow works well too but Maybe the worst exposure for a gradient?.?.
I reviewed a few different polarizers on Amazon. Some PL and some CPL, adjustable. Iv only used the fixed version, PL just to clarify, and with good results on my air 2, mini 2 and gopro. Definitely only hurt the shots if I was in lowlight and forgot to remove them. . .generally I try to use the I phone in lowlight nice I find the computation hdr most effective there, though stabilization does struggle.
 
Dale, da Vinci definitely has gradient exposure controls but learning it all is serious work. . . Sadly these issues are definitely really small sensor weaknesses as you alluded to. I hope to purchase a mavic air 2 S soon and I’m hoping the expanded dynamic range of the 1” sensor will allow me to focus more on composition then exposure.
I may still try a gradient filter with it, having everything nearer to the center of the histogram would be nice,lol!
 
After reading through the three -way conversations above between Karlewski, Vindibona, and Mavic South-oz, I would just add this.

I freely use gradient filters (mostly LEE filters from England) for my DSLR work, to hold back a bright sky, sunrise, sunset against a darkened foreground. These require careful positioning of the horizon, and a tripod.

This is not quite so easy with a drone, where you have little ability to make that very fine horizon adjustment in flight, or if you are changing directions. Thus, I continue to just use my ND16 in videos for bright situations, and no filter for darker lighting situations.

For still images, my still my GO-TO fix is the Adobe Camera RAW (ACR) gradient filter. I can always bring out details in the bottom foregrounds, but I do not want to blow out the details in the right side of the histogram, from where there is no chance of a a recovery of details. So I will always expose to the right of the histogram, not clipping on the right to recovery any highlights there. Then, in post, I can bring out details with the gradient filter.

Oh how I would love to have a gradient filter for Premiere Pro! Anybody out there know how I can do that?

For serious filming, I am happy to have the aperture control of the Mavic 2 Pro, but sometimes, we are forced to fall back on the Mini because of travel restrictions. For Karlewski, it is important to lighten the load in his backpack, for me it is important to get the smaller drone through customs. So we have to make some compromises.

Dale
Miami


In 20 years of working with digital still images I have always found it better to bias slightly to the left of the histogram than to the right. You have a much better shot at reviving shadow detail than retrieving ANY blown highlight detail. Obviously keeping the exposure between 0 and 255 will yield the best final image. In the image comparison below I took an image that is underexposed at the bottom that had somewhat extreme dynamic range that couldn't be picked up fully by the sensor. This was shot intentionally underexpose for a HDR composite. For the demonstration I've chosen to use this frame without the others of the composite to illustrate shadow recovery. Note the histogram. No other work was done to the image but a shadow adjustment.

FWIW, this is one of the same images in the series that we discussed in an earlier thread. Note the absence of the road :).

1627225473621.png
 
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Wow, that is one extreme example! I'll bet that sensor still has more beef then my Mini 2, lol. Quite a retrieval of those darks. Darks can be recovered, blown out is gone forever. . .
 
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Wow, that is one extreme example! I'll bet that sensor still has more beef then my Mini 2, lol. Quite a retrieval of those darks. Darks can be recovered, blown out is gone forever. . .
It was shot with a Mavic 2 Pro. I'm not sure if I had a gradient on it or not, but I'm guessing that I had the lightest gradient Polarpro which I tend to leave on a lot of the time.
 
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