Always shooting in 60fps for 30fps timeline

[Ice_2k]

Quick question for you guys with more experience: if I'm trying to shoot a scenario where manual settings are not ok and I do want auto (e.g. I'm doing a reveal from a dark terrain shot to a brighter sky and I would like the exposure to adjust as the gimbal is raising). Is there any downside to shooting in 60fps and then just use this in a 30fps timeline (without slowing it down, so basically just skipping every other frame). This would ensure the SS never drops below 1/60fps which is what I'm looking for.

Thanks.

 

[Ian in London]

Quick question for you guys with more experience: if I'm trying to shoot a scenario where manual settings are not ok and I do want auto (e.g. I'm doing a reveal from a dark terrain shot to a brighter sky and I would like the exposure to adjust as the gimbal is raising). Is there any downside to shooting in 60fps and then just use this in a 30fps timeline (without slowing it down, so basically just skipping every other frame). This would ensure the SS never drops below 1/60fps which is what I'm looking for.

Thanks.

Using a higher frame rate isn't the best way I think; maybe have a look at using ND filters to reduce the light and keep the shutter speed near where you want it.
This video explains all the manual settings, the exposure triangle and the use of NDs; even tho it was made for the Mini, the settings and points made are precisely the same for the Air 2:
Cheers, Ian

 

[Ice_2k]

Using a higher frame rate isn't the best way I think; maybe have a look at using ND filters to reduce the light and keep the shutter speed near where you want it.
This video explains all the manual settings, the exposure triangle and the use of NDs; even tho it was made for the Mini, the settings and points made are precisely the same for the Air 2:
Cheers, Ian

Thanks Ian but the issue I’m trying to avoid is the shutter going to low (it seems to very happily drop it into the 1/30s, which makes the footage way to blurry), so ND filters are not the answer. I’m trying to limit it from going below 1/60s.

 

[Ian in London]

Thanks Ian but the issue I’m trying to avoid is the shutter going to low (it seems to very happily drop it into the 1/30s, which makes the footage way to blurry), so ND filters are not the answer. I’m trying to limit it from going below 1/60s.

Right; that's very surprising. It would normally only drop to such a lower shutter speed in very low light. And normally the framerate has no impact on the shutter speed as the shutter speed is determined by the ISO and the aperture. In normal daylight your shutter speed should set itself to around 1/100 - 1/400 sec, so I have no idea why your shutter speed keeps trying to drop below 1/30 which is extremely slow. If it's very dim, maybe try increasing the ISO to 400. The framerate isn't a factor in determining the shutter speed, although in this case, I can see why you want to use it as 60 frames per second would imply 1/60 s is the slowest speed it can go....

 

[boblui]

I will definitely check the image quality of 60 fps vs that of 30 fps. The camera may under-sample at higher frame rate. This has been seen on M2P :

 

[Ice_2k]

Right; that's very surprising. It would normally only drop to such a lower shutter speed in very low light. And normally the framerate has no impact on the shutter speed as the shutter speed is determined by the ISO and the aperture. In normal daylight your shutter speed should set itself to around 1/100 - 1/400 sec, so I have no idea why your shutter speed keeps trying to drop below 1/30 which is extremely slow. If it's very dim, maybe try increasing the ISO to 400. The framerate isn't a factor in determining the shutter speed, although in this case, I can see why you want to use it as 60 frames per second would imply 1/60 s is the slowest speed it can go....

Exactly, I’m just trying to set the lower limit to 1/60 instead of 1/30. To clarify, I AM using filters to get the correct shutter. But, conditions sometimes change slightly (or you just point the camera down) and the exposure needs to be increased. When that happens, I would rather the automatic algorithm bump the ISO to 200 rather than drop my shutter to 1/30

 

[Ice_2k]

I will definitely check the image quality of 60 fps vs that of 30 fps. The camera may under-sample at higher frame rate. This has been seen on M2P :

Thanks, I’ll look into this!

 

[Ian in London]

Exactly, I’m just trying to set the lower limit to 1/60 instead of 1/30. To clarify, I AM using filters to get the correct shutter. But, conditions sometimes change slightly (or you just point the camera down) and the exposure needs to be increased. When that happens, I would rather the automatic algorithm bump the ISO to 200 rather than drop my shutter to 1/30

Right. Get you now. Didn't realise you were already using filters. TBH I have often used differing FPS clips in a single framerate timeline; the rendering seems to handle things okay but I can't imagine this is getting the best results.

The 180 rule on using a shutter speed of twice the framerate is a good guide but to be honest, I would actually use the right ND to get the right shutter speed when it's darkest, and allow the shutter speed to go up beyond 1/60 when you tilt the camera up to the brighter scene. Having a shutter speed of 1/80 or 1/100 will still give excellent results, probably far better than mixing different FPS.
A final point is that the auto-adjustment can be a little hard and obvious; you end up with the landscape suddenly getting darker as the auto-exposure tries to compensate. I would have thought it better to lock the exposure for the darker part of the landscape so that the landscape stays the same brightness as you tilt up; yes the sky and clouds will be over-exposed but that may be better than seeing the land suddenly get darker....
Bottom line; experiment...

 

[raphi_d]

Quick question for you guys with more experience: if I'm trying to shoot a scenario where manual settings are not ok and I do want auto (e.g. I'm doing a reveal from a dark terrain shot to a brighter sky and I would like the exposure to adjust as the gimbal is raising). Is there any downside to shooting in 60fps and then just use this in a 30fps timeline (without slowing it down, so basically just skipping every other frame). This would ensure the SS never drops below 1/60fps which is what I'm looking for.

Thanks.

or try to do the shot differently so you don't need to have varying exposure. You can pan upwards from the dark portion, cut into another scene for 1-2 seconds and continue into the light part of the scene while having the right exposure for every scene. It will always look bad when the exposure suddenly changes, better to "mask" it with another clip inbetween.

As for the 180 degree rule, I am not sure what quality of a shot you try to achieve but there is a reason this rule exists: Shutter Speed, Frame Rate and the 180° Rule

Personal opinion: shoot in 25fps with 1/50 shutter and appropriate ND filters for the scene you are filming (and no, lets not start a debate about framerates, this is a personal opinion which differs from person to person ).