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Canada, flying in controlled airspace

Hmm! Is that ‘Common Sense’ with a drone that weighs 250g. Just like flying within 5nm of an Airport or 3nm of a heliport - would that be common sense and safe?

I mean, yeah, I don't have any plans on flying my mini near airports, it won't go well regardless. I think it's way more important for the OP though to know they're free to fly it in controlled airspace. Very important for somewhere like Toronto where practically the whole city is controlled airspace due to three overlapping airports.

All I know is I'll be confidently flying my mini in situations where I want to fly out of VLOS such as inspecting a roof and when I don't feel like doing a site survey, flight plan, logging every flight, etc. (I mean, are you *really* flying your drone legally? have you actually run down the number of preparations you're supposed to make for taking off each and every time?) and I'll save my Mavic Air 2 for restricted use with my advanced certificate.
 
While Fly, UAV forecast and AirMap are excellent apps for guidance the NRC Drone site selection tool is far more reliable. Drone Pilot from Don DronesOn is Canada specific and under constant upgrading. PS: You 3NM & 5 NM above are out of whack.
If I am unsure at my flight location, I usually check UAV forecast (especially) for wind, but also the site selection tool. What I find is that UAV forecast and AirMap show the 3nm or 5nm as circles whereas Site selection tool shows what I assume are the landing and approach airspace. So technically you could be within 3nm/5nm of a heliport/airport but outside the landing/approach airspace. I usually air on the side of caution and stay outside the circles.

Chris
 
If I am unsure at my flight location, I usually check UAV forecast (especially) for wind, but also the site selection tool. What I find is that UAV forecast and AirMap show the 3nm or 5nm as circles whereas Site selection tool shows what I assume are the landing and approach airspace. So technically you could be within 3nm/5nm of a heliport/airport but outside the landing/approach airspace. I usually air on the side of caution and stay outside the circles.

Chris


Here's the NRC Drone Site Selection Tool:



What you're probably seeing is a lot of apps show a circle that includes a radius of established landing and takeoff paths. The tool above shows them more accurately. Zoom in on the Burlington Executive Airport for instance (Burlington, ON) and you'll see what look like actual runways (extended beyond of course). Most other apps just show a radius that encompasses all of this. That's not 5 or 7 NM or anything else, it's just the established landing/takeoff paths that could be any radius. Most aerodromes don't even have controlled space at all and unless they're certified, you don't even legally need to inform them you're entering their space. There are even certified aerodromes that still have no controlled airspace but you do need to contact them before flying within 3 NM (edit: I mean if you have an advanced certificate, basic pilots can't ever go within 3 NM of a certified aerodrome).

To make it even more complicated, if you look at Pearson International in Mississauga, they show the 3 NM radius around the airport, then a larger 7 NM control zone but nothing else. Technically, these tools should be showing a lot more. For instance, if you had a Special Flight Operation Certificate to fly above 400 feet, you could find yourself in Pearson's Class E airspace at 700 feet AGL for 12 NM around the airport or even their control area at 2200 feet AGL for a 35 NM radius! My guess is you'd never be approved for such a flight so they don't bother pointing it out in the site selection tools.
 
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Wow....what a confusing mess!! The main thing I am getting from all the responses is...even the more seasoned pilots here, seem to agree and disagree???. I have not gotten the mimi yet, but did look into a couple programs like airmap and the dpi fly app. I guess my main concern in starting this thread was...there are a number of yellow and orange sections, not far from me and I did not know if, using a mini, I would have to submit some form of RPAS flight plan through one of these apps to the TC before flying in these zones, and get approval. What I am understanding now, is that is not required for the mini but just to be aware of these areas and proceed with caution. I will avoid the red and blue areas like it is the plague. And I have to make sure not to put people or other aircraft in danger.

One area in particular, I was interested in filming, was Mount Royal in Montreal. It appears in the orange zone. So I gather I can fly there, as long as I am away from people, but do not have to report in advance, my RPAS flight plan to TC and getting approval from them is not necessary. I hope this assumption is correct, but please let me know if it is not.

Thanks for all the responses. I do really appreciate all the input. K.
 
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Correction to my above post. Was confusing NM with KM. Should be 5.6 km (3nm) for an airport and 1.9 km (1nm) of a heliport. Sorry for any confusion.

Regardless of whether the Drone Site Selection Tool is more accurate, I still follow the rule on my Basic Pilot Certificate that states "No flights within 5.6 km (3 nautical miles) of an airport, or 1.9 km (1 nautical mile) of a heliport (CAR 901.47)" . I assume they are talking about a radius here and not just approach/takeoff airspace.

Chris
 
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I’m not a fan of third party Apps or YouTube so called training videos, they can be misleading. The data U need is very clear and precise on the appropriate sectional or VTA chart for the airport. CARs section 900 and the AIM are clear Plus TC provides lots of info. on their website.
 
Sorry if I made it more confusing for you. I think the Mavic Mini being outside the registration and licencing requirements has made it confusing since TC has not really clarified the rules for that particular class of drone.Best advice I'd give is to check the Site Selection Tool and one of the other apps like UAV Forecast (free) for that location.

I use UAV forecast most of the time but also use the other ones if I am uncertain. UAV forecast (free) allows you to set the Threshold parametres and the maximum wind speed. Very handy for the mini.

I also ordered a Mavic Mini on Prime Day and haven't got it yet. I will likely register it since I already have my Pilot's licence and it will allow me to add things like strobe lights so I can fly at night, etc.

Chris
 
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Wow....what a confusing mess!! The main thing I am getting from all the responses is...even the more seasoned pilots here, seem to agree and disagree???. I have not gotten the mimi yet, but did look into a couple programs like airmap and the dpi fly app. I guess my main concern in starting this thread was...there are a number of yellow and orange sections, not far from me and I did not know if, using a mini, I would have to submit some form of RPAS flight plan through one of these apps to the TC before flying in these zones, and get approval. What I am understanding now, is that is not required for the mini but just to be aware of these areas and proceed with caution. I will avoid the red and blue areas like it is the plague. And I have to make sure not to put people or other aircraft in danger.

One area in particular, I was interested in filming, was Mount Royal in Montreal. It appears in the orange zone. So I gather I can fly there, as long as I am away from people, but do not have to report in advance, my RPAS flight plan to TC and getting approval from them is not necessary. I hope this assumption is correct, but please let me know if it is not.

Thanks for all the responses. I do really appreciate all the input. K.

I don't remember you saying, are you certified for either basic or advanced operations? If not, you can't even apply for an RPAS flight authorization and with only basic certification, you can never fly into controlled airspace or within 3 NM of an aerodrome. But again, as long as you're smart about it, my opinion is your sub-250g drone is exempt anyway. One caveat: no one can ever fly into Class F restricted space. Your app of choice should be telling you that.

I suggest you watch this video for this guy's latest word on the subject:


He helped me more than anyone in getting my advanced certification and probably knows as much as anyone about this stuff and he spells out the only things you can't do.
 
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Sorry if I made it more confusing for you. I think the Mavic Mini being outside the registration and licencing requirements has made it confusing since TC has not really clarified the rules for that particular class of drone.Best advice I'd give is to check the Site Selection Tool and one of the other apps like UAV Forecast (free) for that location.

I use UAV forecast most of the time but also use the other ones if I am uncertain. UAV forecast (free) allows you to set the Threshold parametres and the maximum wind speed. Very handy for the mini.

I also ordered a Mavic Mini on Prime Day and haven't got it yet. I will likely register it since I already have my Pilot's licence and it will allow me to add things like strobe lights so I can fly at night, etc.

Chris

I know you don't want to hear this but adding strobes puts the Mavic Mini over 250g changing everything about it (rules-wise).
 
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I don't remember you saying, are you certified for either basic or advanced operations? If not, you can't even apply for an RPAS flight authorization and with only basic certification, you can never fly into controlled airspace or within 3 NM of an aerodrome. But again, as long as you're smart about it, my opinion is your sub-250g drone is exempt anyway. One caveat: no one can ever fly into Class F restricted space. Your app of choice should be telling you that.

I suggest you watch this video for this guy's latest word on the subject:


He helped me more than anyone in getting my advanced certification and probably knows as much as anyone about this stuff and he spells out the only things you can't do.
No, i do not have basic or advanced certifcation. although i plan to get them as soon as i can, right now I will just be starting out. I got the Amazon Prime Deal, although, from what i am reading now...I may be retuning it as soon as I get it, as it appears dji may be putting out a mini 2 with 4K and maybe more...soon. Ah, decisions, decisions. what to do, what to do.

Thanks so much for the link. I will be sure to use it. All the best, K.
 
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I know you don't want to hear this but adding strobes puts the Mavic Mini over 250g changing everything about it (rules-wise).
I realize that. I have my basic licence and will probably register it with TC.
 
I'm new to this forum, and am waiting on my Mini to be delivered today, but this thread it timely.

I've gone through a ground school and passed the Basic and Advanced tests, just waiting on doing a flight review to get my advanced license.

This has all happened recently and I'm doing a lot of reading to try to cement rules and concepts more solidly in my head.

The whole "what rules apply to sub-250g UAVs" thing is seemingly a tough one.

I understand it the same way pawnie does. The CAR regulations make it fairly clear, in my view, that most of the regulations don't apply to "microdrones", including the need to get NavCan authorization in controlled airspace, VLOS, etc.

900.06 does apply, the overall "fly safe" rule.

In an attempt to fully clarify this for myself I emailed the NavCan Vancouver RPAS Coordination office with that question... do sub-250g drones fall outside of those controlled airspace regulations...

The person responding said that microdrones are NOT exempt from those regulations, stating that the regulations do not specify a drone weight.

But... of course they do... Section 901.01 specifies that the Subpart in question only applies to "small remotely piloted aircraft"... and CAR defines that as drones between 250g and 25kg.

When I replied to the person pointing that out, they replied that, yes, that is an understandable interpretation, but that they would still suggest that flying "safely" as required in 900.06 means still following all of the drone regulations, regardless of drone weight.

So I thought, OK, I could accept that advice as maybe over-bearing but still, simply as a safety-first "rule of thumb".

But then the person went on to specifically call out Section 903 (rules around SFOC's), specifically saying that those rules (including, for example, flying beyond VLOS) apply to ALL drones, micro or larger..... but that is simply not true... 903.01 specifically calls out aircraft of 250g or more....

Sorry for the wall of text, long story short, even officials in the RPAS section of Nav Canada don't fully understand the regulations.
 
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Don’t overly complicate things. If CARS don’t address your situation, they don’t apply. Just use common sense and fly safe
 
Don’t overly complicate things. If CARS don’t address your situation, they don’t apply. Just use common sense and fly safe
That's what caused me to shake my head a bit.... CARs does address the question I had, ... someone from NavCanada contradicted it. lol

I'm confident in my interpretation of CARs though.
 
That's what caused me to shake my head a bit.... CARs does address the question I had, ... someone from NavCanada contradicted it. lol

I'm confident in my interpretation of CARs though.
Bet you can't wait to find the contradictions between CARS and the latest release of AIM
 
I find the rules as they apply to the Mini vague. I had my new mini out yesterday and got out to just over 300m and it was a speck in the sky. Any further and I would have lost sight. Even though I could probably legally fly it beyond VLOS, I won’t because I would not have any situational awareness and that to me is unsafe. I have been flying my other drones over the years and have encountered low flying helicopters and planes in areas that are legal for me to fly in. Had I not had my drone in VLOS I would not have had any situational awareness to take evasive action had I needed too.

Chris
 
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