Aeroscope use by the Russian military

[Cymru]

Interesting Twitter threat where a Russian soldier is talking through the use of Aeroscope on the front complete with video and web screenshots:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1602690997082882048

A few points of note:

(i) This is why everyone prefers Mavic 2 and below - they can be firmware flashed to disable location telemetry from Aeroscope. Mavic 3s above cannot.
(ii) Detection distances are huge - even at 400m a M3 target is detected 18.2km away

Both sides are employing DJI drones and both sides are employing Aeroscope but this highlights just how hazardous it is for the operators where their exact location can be pinpointd from 10s of km away.

(Video is perfectly safe for work, its just display screen footage of software taken from an original Telegram source).

 

[TommyGrimmer]

Not sure if you use Telegram but there is a lot of good info on there. It is said the Ukrainians have a hack to outsmart the Aeroscope and will not give any information on how it is done. They are also using counter-drone equipment to bag home two russian Mavic-3 drones

Live: Ukraine

Ukrainian forces use counter-drone equipment to bag home two russian Mavic-3 drones

t.me

 

[lookout]

Wasn't go after 48 setting dji remote id to on?

 

[vindibona1]

Wow... I didn't know such a device existed. Who needs RID when Aeroscope exists? The authorities really have/had the technology to do everything they needed. So why RID? Color me skeptical, but nothing happens in a vacuum and when government gets involved there are always unintended consequences... or hidden consequences.

 

[sar104]

Wow... I didn't know such a device existed. Who needs RID when Aeroscope exists? The authorities really have/had the technology to do everything they needed. So why RID? Color me skeptical, but nothing happens in a vacuum and when government gets involved there are always unintended consequences... or hidden consequences.

Aeroscope has to be actively deployed, only works fully with DJI aircraft, and only operates over a limited area, whereas RID is a passive, compliance-based system that will work everywhere.

 

[Chip]

The authorities really have/had the technology to do everything they needed. So why RID?

Very good question. During the appellate court hearing in the Race Day Quads Remote ID case, Judge Robert L. Wilkins asked the FAA's lawyer whether remote ID added anything to the government's current ability to track drones? The FAA lawyer said no. Remote ID gives no new capability. By forcing everyone to "voluntarily" broadcast a signal, the regulation undercuts the ability of drone pilots to allege illegal search and seizure under the 4th Amendment when they are tracked. That is why the FAA has hung onto broadcasting pilot location and will continue to do so like a rabid dog with a bone. There is no limit on aeroscope range distance with the placement of cheap, mobile, repeater stations.

 

[karlblessing]

(i) This is why everyone prefers Mavic 2 and below - they can be firmware flashed to disable location telemetry from Aeroscope. Mavic 3s above cannot.

Air 2S can have the Aeroscope security bit disabled too (but not if you're above 2190 firmware).

 

[Cymru]

Wasn't go after 48 setting dji remote id to on?

Remote ID and Aeroscope aren't related.

Aeroscope data has been on all drones since Phantom and always transmitted. All drones have had that remote ID and you cant do anything about it.

 

[Cymru]

Air 2S can have the Aeroscope security bit disabled too (but not if you're above 2190 firmware).

Yep - any of the DJI "3" ranges are more problematic. After certain firmware revisions it cant be disabled.
Ultimately means any new drones supplied there cant have it disabled so light up on the screen 20+ miles away complete with the operators exact location.

 

[karlblessing]

Yep - any of the DJI "3" ranges are more problematic. After certain firmware revisions it cant be disabled.
Ultimately means any new drones supplied there cant have it disabled so light up on the screen 20+ miles away complete with the operators exact location.

I thought that the aeroscope system had rather limited range (to the drone)?

 

[sar104]

I thought that the aeroscope system had rather limited range (to the drone)?

All it needs is to be able to receive, at least intermittently, the transmissions from the aircraft - enough to pull out some telemetry data.

 

[Cymru]

Its signal path line of sight. It doesnt need a video feed or low latency so the low bandwidth telemetry can propagate much further.
Its a passive system so no need to transmit and perform 2 way data exchange - it simple listens to encrypted data bits from the drone. It doesnt need all of them or even regularly.

Brief theoretical max. If Aeroscope antenna is at ground level (not on a hill) and a drone is at 500ft the range is about 30 miles.

If the drone is at 1600ft then its nearer 50 miles.

Actual received range will be less than that but you get the general idea. The video shows a drone at 400ft some 15 miles away from example.
Put Aeroscope on high ground and its even further.

 

[dotquod]

I'm actually surprised that it's a big news for you here. We here in Ukraine live with this **** since the beginning of the full blown intrusion. And yes, the Aeroscope is highly used by the russians on the frontline. And yes, it is really generous: drone pilots are a prior target for them. They can even send a full pack of MLRS Grad to get you.

That's why we are using "anonymizer" hacks to fool around their aeroscopes by sending fake / zero telemetry.

PS. We've got the Aeroscopes as well

PPS. I know what I'm saying because:

 

[Cymru]

Its not big news.

Both sides use of DJI drones is well understdood.

And hacks don't work on newer firmware of newer models.

Both sides operators take huge risks utilising the devices.

 

[Jinhai]

Very resourceful those Ukrainians are. Ukrainian women learning to fly drones. Good thing they have other options then just DJI.

 

[Aerophile]

PPS. I know what I'm saying because:View attachment 158399

Slava Ukraini!

 

[EliteBleader]

Other than identifying where they are, can aeroscope actually counter drones?

 

[sar104]

Other than identifying where they are, can aeroscope actually counter drones?

No.

 

[karlblessing]

Other than identifying where they are, can aeroscope actually counter drones?

No, but knowing where the operator is on a battlefield is a pretty bad disadvantage to the pilot.