DJI to restrict non-compliant drones at next software update

[firefly3630]

Last week msm reported FAA regs overturned for drones. Current administration rolled back the regs.

So if my government doesn't require whatever makes no sense dji would do this.

I emailed support and have not got an answer yet asked if this upcoming update will include those rolled back regs.

 

[jwjonesjr]

A Mavic crashed into a car recently on the Sydney Harbour Bridge and 7 out of 10 pilots here wanted blood for ruining their hobby. This is the software update that could possibly track down the owner and have him prosecuted if it was to happen again and 7 out of 10 pilots here agreed they would welcome licensing/registering/identification of some sort. You got your wish so be very careful of where you fly as prosecutions will no doubt follow.
If you fly in a red zone like Sydney Harbour expect to be identified, prosecuted and possibly have your drone confiscated - (AU is a police state)

If someone else does something stupid demand his blood.
If YOU want to do something stupid you want the freedom of anonymity to do it.
Talk about inconsistent reasoning..... sheesh!

Bad actors are not ruining anything. Law abiding drone owners like ourselves are letting the hobby get ruined by the one or two law breakers. We let the community lump us all in. I won't waste all my time trying to point them out either. I would much rather take a stand for law abiding drone owners then stand against the few bad actors. They will get caught, but I'm not about to let DJI or anyone else treat me as though I may be the 1% that might break the rules. Target THEM! Not everyone.

If we let the few that don't fly responsibility ruin our hobby then shame on us.

 

[Blades]

Makes me happy I do not have the latest firmware.

If you do not update it you will only be able to fly a few feet! DJI Will Severely Limit Your Drone if You Don't 'Activate' it Online

 

[Ziggy01]

If you do not update it you will only be able to fly a few feet! DJI Will Severely Limit Your Drone if You Don't 'Activate' it Online

The presumption is that restriction will only occur with those of us operating the latest firmware.

The presumption is that those who currently use or roll back to, say, 4.00 won't suffer this restriction.

 

[jwjonesjr]

All true but 2 points.

1) DJI argues that a 'remote' drone is different from a 'car' because the 'driver' can be several miles away from its physical location. Crash a car into the White House and the police can physically arrest the 'driver' because he will be at the White House. Fly a drone into the White House from a couple of miles away and the 'driver' cannot be caught unless he is physically registered to the drone. It appears that the reason DJI want us to 'log in' with the new update is to confirm that the current 'owner/user' of the drone is the one that first registered it (and it hasnt been sold to a third party'.)

2) As you point out, car manufacturers do not require you to get a 'license plate'for a car - but 'national authorities' insist on it (everywhere). I personally think that if DJI doesnt include a 'license plate' at the manufacturers end, National Governments inevitably will. And if 'National Governments' insist on a license plate there are likely to be 2 problems for us users. 1) National Governments will insist on you acquiring a 'drivers license' to qualify for your drone license plate (so that they have the ability to take it away). You are likely to have to take a 'test' and keep it up to date (as in France). Secondly many National Governments will only give 'licenses' to their own 'Nationals' which means visitors/tourists will not be able to 'drive' their drones in the country.

Really there are effectively a lot of people on this thread who are arguing that 1) they should have the right and freedom to fly their drone wherever they like even if it is illegal and 2) they have the freedom and right to fly 'anonymously' so they cannot be held responsible for their actions.

Now all I can really say is that if you really think this position is sustainable long term either for you or the drone industry in general you are being 'heroically optimistic'.

Which means we have 2 options... comply or abandon the hobby. Don't know about anyone else, but I abandon the hobby.

 

[adiru]

Bad actors are not ruining anything. Law abiding drone owners like ourselves are letting the hobby get ruined by the one or two law breakers. We let the community lump us all in. I won't waste all my time trying to point them out either. I would much rather take a stand for law abiding drone owners then stand against the few bad actors. They will get caught, but I'm not about to let DJI or anyone else treat me as though I may be the 1% that might break the rules. Target THEM! Not everyone.

If we let the few that don't fly responsibility ruin our hobby then shame on us.

Currently it is still lawful to build your own drone in the US, without GPS, without NFZ, without monthly firmware updates, without registration now even....

Just like it was declared jail breaking a phone to be lawful, therefore I really hope Mavic gets firmware unlocked. The NFZ mod isn't just a tiny fraction of that and only works on 700 and costs 200

Here is to hoping we see an fully unlocked Mavic soon, not from DJI of course.

 

[Blades]

Last week msm reported FAA regs overturned for drones. Current administration rolled back the regs.

So if my government doesn't require whatever makes no sense dji would do this.

I emailed support and have not got an answer yet asked if this upcoming update will include those rolled back regs.

I also emailed DJI I would not have paid $1000. For the MP 35 days ago if I knew they would control the product that I paid for and own! I am not happy at all. The FAA can not regulate Hobby recreational drones here in the USA. So why can DJI? Again I did not buy my MP for them to later do this! DJI Will Severely Limit Your Drone if You Don't 'Activate' it Online

 

[Blades]

Which means we have 2 options... comply or abandon the hobby. Don't know about anyone else, but I abandon the hobby.

We need someone to jail break the DJI software!

 

[adiru]

I also emailed DJI I would not have paid $1000. For the MP 35 days ago if I knew they would control the product that I paid for and own! I am not happy at all. The FAA can not regulate Hobby recreational drones here in the USA. So why can DJI? Again I did not buy my MP for them to later do this! DJI Will Severely Limit Your Drone if You Don't 'Activate' it Online

if you are within 35 days? call your credit card company get a charge back started on grounds of false advertising, material misrepresentation, coercing, duress, ineffective assistance of counsel, fraudulent conveyance, etc etc etc.... there are enough internet posts for you to link to them as evidence that you got 'had'.

 

[dbyantis]

Essentially, in a few days, DJI Go and DJI Go 4 apps will have new versions. After upgrading to these new versions, users will have to re-activate via at least a login method to their DJI account. At such time, DJI will mark the location of the user, probably via combination of GPS, IP address, credit card info on file, or some other method, and the user will be subject to strict(er) enforcement based on the region of the world that they live in. The GEO will no longer be only "optional" and will make it so that in busy cities, many folks will not be able to fly at all, and have to drive out to the "country". In some countries were drone flying is not allowed, the mavic might not even fly at all. If the user chooses not to consent to this re-registration, the Mavic will be severely limited, including but maynot not limited to things like only being able to fly max altitude of 98feet above the ground, only being able to fly approciatelmy 150 feet from the remote control, and many other registrations like perhaps speed cap and including confirmed NO LIVE feed back to control etc...

So therefore, effectively, they are essentially forcing all users to upgrade. It is likely that once upon upgrade to this new firmware and new app, users via re-registration will be presented and asked to accept a new Terms of Service, etc while might have legal language that says there will be no more downgrading allowed to previous firmware/apps...

This paves the path of the slippery slope to potentially once DJI has the majority of the customers on effective "lock down" that in the future it might technically allow DJI to do things like remotely send a "kill signal" to a drone to permanently disable it from flying, if someone has reported that drone user to DJI etc, or DJI catches that drone user uploading a flight on youtube that was "against the rules" , regular always online during flight so that it can be tracked in real time and sent to law enforcement and FAA and CAA and whatnot, and many other things such as allowing DJI to continue to degrade the performance of the Mavic (for example now only 84% of a full charge battery is actually "usable" as opposed to 90% when it was first sold on earlier firmware, later this number could get to like 70% or even 60% etc) and perhaps also enforce an open ended NFZ where everyone can request airspace above their home or building to be a NFZ, esssentially in the future "allowed flying areas" will be like the ever shrinking "designated smoking areas" or "free speech zones" of today.

I also received this information re:developer SDK:"Dear developer,


In July, DJI aircraft firmware will require mobile applications that control DJI aircraft to be activated with the user’s DJI account, if that application is being used in China. This will ensure operators use the correct set of geospatial information and flight functions for their aircraft, as determined by their geographical location and user profile.


A summary of the activation system is:

• On July 1, this feature will go live on all aircraft (except standalone A3 and N3) that have been upgraded to the latest firmware
• Users in China will be required to activate their application by logging into their DJI account at least once every three months within the application
• Activation will be persistent in the application until the user logs out
• A data connection will be required to log into a DJI account
• Outside of China, the SDK will automatically activate the application without requiring the user to log in
• If an application is not activated, or a legacy version of the SDK is being used, all camera live streams will be disabled, and flight will be limited to a cylinder of 100m diameter and 30m height to ensure the aircraft stays within line of sight.

This week, v4.1 of the Mobile SDK will be released that will include APIs to support this system. Applications should update to v4.1 as soon as they can to support the activation system natively. For applications that are not upgraded to v4.1 or activated by the user, full aircraft functionality can still be achieved by first connecting any other upgraded/activated application on each power cycle of the aircraft. For example, DJI Go could be initially connected to the aircraft, then the user could switch to the SDK based application.

In addition, v4.1 of the Mobile SDK will include support for M200, Phantom 4 Advanced, and Individual Unlock Fly Zones. Please see the release notes for more details on the updates to the Mobile SDK."

So the meat of this is a new SDK, so GO4 and 3rd party apps, like Litche will need to re-compile and upgrade as well.By embedding the logic in the SDK they have much more control of the software behavior. Good or bad.

 

[stratos]

via Imgflip Meme Generator

 

[Blades]

What do you suppose gives DJI the legal 'right' to handicap the Mavic of customers post-sales , retroactively and after the fact, without consent and without legal justification (ie Go Pro Karma recall)
If DJI prioritizes appeasing governments or safety in the name of self preservation then so be it, but if it wants to handicap units already sold, then DJI has the obligation to at least give a partial / pro-rated if not full refund for those customers whom demand /request to be given the option to return their units and get their money back, since the product they got effectively was or had become materially different from what was represented to them at the time of purchase.

Sorry but no matter how DJI spins it, they can't have it both ways. Either DJI screwed up back then when the Mavic was on the drawing boards or DJI screwed up now, but why is the consumer subsidizing for DJI's mistake by getting less than what they paid for? Why is DJI allowed to effectively use tactics that could be construed as anti-competitive (artificially reducing battery safety margins to give better flight times against competitors on specs to publicize themselves to market, but then push out firmware updates to cap the battery usable levels after the fact, in the name of safety and the banner of security, without updating the true effectively flight time to reflect the change, etc) when they have ulterior motives and vested interests (increasing DJI Care profit margins for being more and more conservative in flight envelopes anyone?!) .... either way I don't see how this is anything but 'evil'.

You are so right! I would not have bought the MP 35 days ago of I knew this and to sell me something then change it now is not right! Can we do a class action lawsuit or like you said I want my money back and my money for the DJI care also! They can have the MP back!

 

[dwallersv]

Last week msm reported FAA regs overturned for drones. Current administration rolled back the regs.

So if my government doesn't require whatever makes no sense dji would do this.

I emailed support and have not got an answer yet asked if this upcoming update will include those rolled back regs.

Did you read the thread? The entire situation has been laid out in bits and pieces over many posts, but it's all there and pretty clear:

1. This change is taking place because of new requirements in China -- and ONLY China. I don't know the legal particulars, but I expect this is in response to some law/regulation going into effect in China.
2. Users who reside in China will be required to re-authorize their DJI drones every three months by going through the login process with the DJI servers. Users outside China are required to re-authorize one time.
3. The authorization requirement will be enforced by limiting drone functionality as follows: No live streaming video (FPV), range limited to 100m (330ft), height 30m (100ft). Users outside China are not affected by these limitations. [but what if they fail to perform the one-time re-authorization? This is unclear)
4. The performance/functionality limitations require updating to a later firmware version than .400, which has now been removed from available firmwares in DJI Assistant 2; however there is a Virtual Machine snapshot created by member @adiru (props ) that can be used to downgrade to .400, currently believed to be the last firmware without the crippling capability.
5. DJI quite understandably is keeping a single firmware implementation and version for each drone, rather than starting to branch to multiple versions needing to be supported. Anyone here who's worked in software development knows the nightmare, and impracticality of doing anything that idiotic in software management.

So, what can we conclude from a sober, calm analysis of what's going on? Simply this: China is requiring these capabilities to aid authorities, so DJI has implemented these features. They are activating them and using them in China. My heart and spirit goes out to you, my Chinese brothers and sisters!

However, the hysteria over rather extreme, and very unlikely uses of these features in the US, in particular, and other "Western" nations is quite overblown. For good reasons DJI releases firmware world-wide, rather than trying to manage the nightmare of country-specific code branches. Instead, the generic functionality is implemented, and then turned on and configured where local law requires it.

This looks exactly like what DJI is doing.

Can the worst fears expressed in this thread occur with these new features? Yes, of course! That doesn't mean it ever will, however, and believing it's certain, or likely, is quite a stretch with no other facts or evidence of anything.

Like something from the FAA, connected to this. There ain't.

So everyone calm down, and wait and see what happens. If you're concerned, downgrade to .400. I'm staying there for the time being too. But whatever you do, relax if you're not in China -- this will have no effect on you. If you're in China, sorry to say, it will, and it sucks.

 

[adiru]

You are so right! I would not have bought the MP 35 days ago of I knew this and to sell me something then change it now is not right! Can we do a class action lawsuit or like you said I want my money back and my money for the DJI care also! They can have the MP back!

Realistically the best and fastest route for you, charge back immediately. DOn't even bother with DJI they will just stall and waste your time.
Number one priority is get your money back first.

 

[Stuart Wood]

You are so right! I would not have bought the MP 35 days ago of I knew this and to sell me something then change it now is not right! Can we do a class action lawsuit or like you said I want my money back and my money for the DJI care also! They can have the MP back!

Yes, it is not the possible restrictions that bother me so much, it is that this is being done after the fact that we have bought into the capabilities of the product. Think this is called "bait and switch!"

 

[dewster]

I'm sure there's also a kill switch able to brick your drone. Thinking I should have kept my Typhoon H. Offline control, better camera.

 

[Johanna]

I am thinking this is about security. Yes, there are people out there (ISIS) who are using these for "bad"! DJI will be able to disable drones that are up to no good. Ultimately this will help us as the restrictions will not need to be as strict. It adds a level of security at the source so local authorities won't be inundated with enforcement issues. Too many users are simply not going to use common sense and abide by the rules/laws. Not an ideal world for law abiding citizens, but sadly, that's where it's at. It appears the FAA is already aware of what's coming as they no longer require registration for recreational users. As for travelling, we will probably have to log in from the current location to invoke local regs. What comes to mind when someone orders an initial order of 50 Matrice with night vision and payload dropping capability?? Maybe Santa?? Lol

 

[Blucenturion]

I'd forgotten how to do that so I found this:
How to Enable or Disable Automatic Updates for iOS Apps
But, it turns off auto updating for all apps. I don't think there's a way to just turn it off for specific apps. Therefore, kind of a pain IMO.

It is kind of a pain, but unless you fly every day, it shouldn't disrupt your life too much.

 

[Ziggy01]

Did you read the thread? The entire situation has been laid out in bits and pieces over many posts, but it's all there and pretty clear:

1. This change is taking place because of new requirements in China -- and ONLY China. I don't know the legal particulars, but I expect this is in response to some law/regulation going into effect in China.
2. Users who reside in China will be required to re-authorize their DJI drones every three months by going through the login process with the DJI servers. Users outside China are required to re-authorize one time.
3. The authorization requirement will be enforced by limiting drone functionality as follows: No live streaming video (FPV), range limited to 100m (330ft), height 30m (100ft). Users outside China are not affected by these limitations. [but what if they fail to perform the one-time re-authorization? This is unclear)
4. The performance/functionality limitations require updating to a later firmware version than .400, which has now been removed from available firmwares in DJI Assistant 2; however there is a Virtual Machine snapshot created by member @adiru (props ) that can be used to downgrade to .400, currently believed to be the last firmware without the crippling capability.
5. DJI quite understandably is keeping a single firmware implementation and version for each drone, rather than starting to branch to multiple versions needing to be supported. Anyone here who's worked in software development knows the nightmare, and impracticality of doing anything that idiotic in software management.

So, what can we conclude from a sober, calm analysis of what's going on? Simply this: China is requiring these capabilities to aid authorities, so DJI has implemented these features. They are activating them and using them in China. My heart and spirit goes out to you, my Chinese brothers and sisters!

However, the hysteria over rather extreme, and very unlikely uses of these features in the US, in particular, and other "Western" nations is quite overblown. For good reasons DJI releases firmware world-wide, rather than trying to manage the nightmare of country-specific code branches. Instead, the generic functionality is implemented, and then turned on and configured where local law requires it.

This looks exactly like what DJI is doing.

Can the worst fears expressed in this thread occur with these new features? Yes, of course! That doesn't mean it ever will, however, and believing it's certain, or likely, is quite a stretch with no other facts or evidence of anything.

Like something from the FAA, connected to this. There ain't.

So everyone calm down, and wait and see what happens. If you're concerned, downgrade to .400. I'm staying there for the time being too. But whatever you do, relax if you're not in China -- this will have no effect on you. If you're in China, sorry to say, it will, and it sucks.

But...the sky is falling.

 

[dwallersv]

I'm sure there's also a kill switch able to brick your drone. Thinking I should have kept my Typhoon H. Offline control, better camera.

Yeah, and I'll bet the NSA is archiving all the video streams and telemetry too, don't ya think? I give it less than a year before we see the first story of a local PD taking control of a Mavic that was being used illegally. And no doubt DJI is recording everything too, doing image-matching and data-mining to target marketing at us. They already know where we are whenever we're flying... what are they doing with that right now??!?!?