New Hobby LAANC system vs Old System

[tcope]

Okay... I'll ask... what do you see as a benefit of the mew LAANC system for hobby flight. That is, does this new system add any benefits (to flyers) over the old system (calling the airport and notifying them of the flight)?

 

[msinger]

does this new system add any benefits (to flyers) over the old system (calling the airport and notifying them of the flight)?

The largest benefit (for everyone involved) is that the system is automated. Within about a minute, you can get authorization to fly in controlled airspace using apps like Airmap and Kittyhawk.

HOW TO: Request FAA authorization in Airmap

Using Airmap to Request FAA Authorization Before flying in controlled airspace (Classes B, C, D, and E Surface) in the US, you must get authorization from the FAA. Airmap is an approved LAANC UAS service supplier and has a feature built into their iOS/Android app that allows FAA authorization...

mavicpilots.com

HOW TO: Request FAA authorization in Kittyhawk

Using Kittyhawk to Request FAA Authorization Before flying in controlled airspace (Classes B, C, D, and E Surface) in the US, you must get authorization from the FAA. Kittyhawk is an approved LAANC UAS service supplier and has a feature built into their iOS/Android app that allows FAA...

mavicpilots.com

 

[dawgpilot]

The old system required you to notify every airport within 5 miles, which could include a bunch of helipads, uncontrolled fields, etc.

The new system is solely focused on controlled airspace and is far less of a hassle especially if the nearby airport is LAANC enabled.

 

[tcope]

The largest benefit (for everyone involved) is that the system is automated. Within about a minute, you can get authorization to fly in controlled airspace using apps like Airmap and Kittyhawk.

Appreciate the input.

The largest benefit (for everyone involved) is that the system is automated. Within about a minute, you can get authorization to fly in controlled airspace using apps like Airmap and Kittyhawk.[/QUOTE]I'd say that this is more of a trade off (at best), rather than a benefit. Before, if you were within 5 miles of an airport, you only needed to make a call to the airport and you'd be flying. You say now, you can get authorization to fly in controlled airspace via automated system. However, in a lot of cases, you cannot. The area is far larger than 5 miles from an airport and within that area, there are large sections where you _cannot_ get any authorization to fly... period. You may very well be 4 miles from an airport and want to fly at 10' next to a building and now you cannot. In even further areas you are, at best, further limited on the altitude.

I would agree that you could say it is easier to properly notify the required party but not that this results in authorization to fly but in some cases, that authorization is greatly reduced. Again, there is a trade off to this. Some "airports" no longer require any authorization. This is a huge benefit in my opinion (and as I write this, dawgpilot is making this point). But let me play devil's advocate in this regard. Is it really less likely that you are going to interfere with a small plane or helicopter in a local airfield that you probably won't know exists or a bigger plane that is flying from/to a very big airport? Why is it now not important to coordinate with those airport when flying? I'm not knocking this.. as my view is this is yet another "feel good" process created by the FAA and it certainly does not hurt those that fly drones (eliminating those smaller airports). I'm just saying that this furthers my point that the LAANC really does nothing safety wise (same with the registration).

 

[msinger]

Before, if you were within 5 miles of an airport, you only needed to make a call to the airport and you'd be flying.

Expecting all airports to have a staff on hand to man a call center for drones really isn't something they likely desire to do. I don't think you're going to find one airport that agrees this new system is worse than the old system.

 

[tcope]

Expecting all airports to have a staff on hand to man a call center for drones really isn't something they likely desire to do. I don't think you're going to find one airport that agrees this new system is worse than the old system.

I don't disagree. I don't think they would be getting flooded with calls but I don't see them needing to take those calls anyway. Truth is, they were about pointless. They served almost no safety purpose. Personally, I see LAANC not doing anything either. It is slightly easier but it is more restrictive.

 

[Thomas B]

One problem is airports not signing up for LAANC. Example is the airport in south Chandler. Small planes mostly but still get a 5 mile NFZ. LAANC not available, and can’t contact the tower for clearance anymore. Creates a potential risk to all and homes in the area.

 

[tcope]

Creates a potential risk to all and homes in the area.

In what way? That is, what would a phone call have changed?

 

[DanMan32]

You also have to remember that the October FAA reauthorization act repealled the original hobbyist law that had the 5 mile rule. The replacement required contacting an authorized agent in any controlled airspace.
Since FAA didn't have one in place yet for us hobbyists, they said follow the old rules until they figure it out.
They now have it figured out: use LAANC in supported areas (quick) or dronezone in all other situations in controlled airspace. Not all controlled airspace is confined to 5 miles from an airport.

 

[tcope]

You also have to remember that the October FAA reauthorization act repealled the original hobbyist law that had the 5 mile rule. The replacement required contacting an authorized agent in any controlled airspace.

The replacement is what we have now. It had always required authorization under LAANC, which was not available at the time.

​

Since FAA didn't have one in place yet for us hobbyists, they said follow the old rules until they figure it out.

They said no such thing. They bared us from contact under the old law and bared us from a non-existent LAANC system. So until a few days ago, no could fly under hobby within controlled airspace. I'm sure everyone followed that law.

​

They now have it figured out: use LAANC in supported areas (quick) or dronezone in all other situations in controlled airspace. Not all controlled airspace is confined to 5 miles from an airport.

As far as I know, the new law only requires use of LAANC, period. To expand on that, no authorization is needed outside areas covered by LAANC. As far as I see (and I'm not 100% up-to-date on this), LAANC goes beyond controlled airspace in some cases.

 

[SoCalDude]

...the airport in south Chandler. Small planes mostly but still get a 5 mile NFZ. LAANC not available, and can’t contact the tower for clearance anymore.

Yes, instead of calling them, the FAA says you now have to use DroneZone to gain authorization.

However, when I go to DroneZone, I don't see where hobbyists can request said authorization.

 

[Possums]

Yes, instead of calling them, the FAA says you now have to use DroneZone to gain authorization.

However, when I go to DoneZone, I don't see where hobbyists can request said authorization.

I am trying this suggestion from another flyer, I also am in a "LAANC system not available yet" area and have also tried to call the tower and told to "go away", not a 107 either, but a recreational flyer - but DroneZone still let me apply for Airspace Authorization - will let you know if it works in a few days:

this suggestion
"The process/website is a bit confusing if you haven't gone through it before.

The FAA has previously explained that for 99% of the pilots out there, authorizations is what they want us to be selecting. It can be better explained this way: an authorization is "getting permission to enter the airspace", whereas a waiver is saying that the airspace rules don't apply to you at all. They are much more comfortable with the idea of "authorizing" UAS pilots, even if it's for a wide-area (the entire Class D airspace, up to the UAS Facility Map altitude) and even for an entire year's duration.

I'll tell you how I've filled out the application:

Select Airspace Authorization on Drone Zone.

For your title, just name your operation whatever you want. (for example, "Wide-Area Authorization for XXXX Class D Airspace") You'll fill out your personal details below that, such as your name and phone number.

On the next page enter your proposed start date and end date. The end date can be a year into the future (or more). In my experience the FAA examiner will automatically adjust the dates when they approve you to whatever they are comfortable with.

Timeframe: you can select everything but Night. Flying at night requires a separate Night waiver to be on file, which I don't have.
Frequency: How often do you expect to be flying? Make your best guess there.
Time Zone: self explanatory.
Proposed Location of Operation: Here you can write that you are planning to operate in multiple locations in that airspace area, up to the Facility Map Altitudes. You should add that you will comply with the UAS Facility Map and not fly in any areas that have a 0 altitude posted.

Proposed Maximum Altitude: Here I selected 400 feet.

For latitude and longitude, you pick the GPS coordinates for the center of the airport at the middle of the airspace area you are applying for. You can get the GPS coordinates for an airport off of AirNav.com.

For Radius (this is important): You want to pick "Wide Area".
Nearest airport: the airport associated with that Class D airspace, and for Airspace: Pick Class D

Description of your operation: You can briefly write the purpose of your operations. (aerial photography, roof inspections, etc). I usually add something about maintaining compliance with all Part 107 regulations and again that I will follow the UAS Facility Map as far as altitudes that I will be flying. Also that I won't fly if there is a Temporary Flight restriction in the area, etc.

Existing authorizations/waivers: Unless you've applied in the past, this should be answered No.

After that you can submit your application and wait. Depending on their workload, I've had applications approved in as little as 24 hours recently. After they approve it, you can download an Authorization document that you can print out that shows you have FAA permission to fly in that airspace. None of my authorizations have required that I contact ATC or anything before specific flights, so I'm basically good to go for flying in these areas for the next year.

Hope it works, I'll let you know.

 

[msinger]

However, when I go to DoneZone, I don't see where hobbyists can request said authorization

You can submit a request for authorization here:

 

[JAW]

You can submit a request for authorization here:

View attachment 78375

The fact that Dronezone fails to provide clear guidance on how a recreational pilot gains an airspace authorization via the Part 107 process is just another indication they, the FAAA, don't really want us around.

 

[msinger]

The fact that Dronezone fails to provide clear guidance on how a recreational pilot gains an airspace authorization via the Part 107 process is just another indication they, the FAAA, don't really want us around

Or is it just an indication that they aren't good at documenting their processes?

Assumptions aside, the system is in place and ready for you to use. If you decide not to use it, you're only punishing yourself.

 

[JAW]

Or is it just an indication that they aren't good at documenting their processes?

Assumptions aside, the system is in place and ready for you to use. If you decide not to use it, you're only punishing yourself.

Dont get me wrong, I very much would like to use it.......my home area previously just required a phone call for an airspace authorization but because LAANC is not available this route is not available. Some say I can leave the recreational side of Dronezone, go into the Part 107 section and click on the request waiver/authorization. There I find this statement:

These tools should only be used to request waivers or authorizations for operations flown under Title 14 Part 107. They are not intended for operations flown in accordance with The Exception for Recreational Flyers.
​

So, please, point me to where there is a way for a recreational pilot to obtain an airspace authorization in an area not serviced by LAANC?

ps I sent an email to [email protected] with the question.

​

 

[kensteele]

Dont get me wrong, I very much would like to use it.......my home area previously just required a phone call for an airspace authorization but because LAANC is not available this route is not available. Some say I can leave the recreational side of Dronezone, go into the Part 107 section and click on the request waiver/authorization. There I find this statement:

These tools should only be used to request waivers or authorizations for operations flown under Title 14 Part 107. They are not intended for operations flown in accordance with The Exception for Recreational Flyers.
​

So, please, point me to where there is a way for a recreational pilot to obtain an airspace authorization in an area not serviced by LAANC?

​

im in the same boat. frustrating because we don't have a date. im tempted to just fly...but for now, i won't.

 

[Slade]

I receive LAANC Authorization within 5 secs. I also receive a text Authorization which is beneficial should someone question my right to fly at a specific location. ??

 

[dawgpilot]

I am trying this suggestion from another flyer, I also am in a "LAANC system not available yet" area and have also tried to call the tower and told to "go away", not a 107 either, but a recreational flyer - but DroneZone still let me apply for Airspace Authorization - will let you know if it works in a few days:

this suggestion
"The process/website is a bit confusing if you haven't gone through it before.

The FAA has previously explained that for 99% of the pilots out there, authorizations is what they want us to be selecting. It can be better explained this way: an authorization is "getting permission to enter the airspace", whereas a waiver is saying that the airspace rules don't apply to you at all. They are much more comfortable with the idea of "authorizing" UAS pilots, even if it's for a wide-area (the entire Class D airspace, up to the UAS Facility Map altitude) and even for an entire year's duration.

I'll tell you how I've filled out the application:

Select Airspace Authorization on Drone Zone.

For your title, just name your operation whatever you want. (for example, "Wide-Area Authorization for XXXX Class D Airspace") You'll fill out your personal details below that, such as your name and phone number.

On the next page enter your proposed start date and end date. The end date can be a year into the future (or more). In my experience the FAA examiner will automatically adjust the dates when they approve you to whatever they are comfortable with.

Timeframe: you can select everything but Night. Flying at night requires a separate Night waiver to be on file, which I don't have.
Frequency: How often do you expect to be flying? Make your best guess there.
Time Zone: self explanatory.
Proposed Location of Operation: Here you can write that you are planning to operate in multiple locations in that airspace area, up to the Facility Map Altitudes. You should add that you will comply with the UAS Facility Map and not fly in any areas that have a 0 altitude posted.

Proposed Maximum Altitude: Here I selected 400 feet.

For latitude and longitude, you pick the GPS coordinates for the center of the airport at the middle of the airspace area you are applying for. You can get the GPS coordinates for an airport off of AirNav.com.

For Radius (this is important): You want to pick "Wide Area".
Nearest airport: the airport associated with that Class D airspace, and for Airspace: Pick Class D

Description of your operation: You can briefly write the purpose of your operations. (aerial photography, roof inspections, etc). I usually add something about maintaining compliance with all Part 107 regulations and again that I will follow the UAS Facility Map as far as altitudes that I will be flying. Also that I won't fly if there is a Temporary Flight restriction in the area, etc.

Existing authorizations/waivers: Unless you've applied in the past, this should be answered No.

After that you can submit your application and wait. Depending on their workload, I've had applications approved in as little as 24 hours recently. After they approve it, you can download an Authorization document that you can print out that shows you have FAA permission to fly in that airspace. None of my authorizations have required that I contact ATC or anything before specific flights, so I'm basically good to go for flying in these areas for the next year.

Hope it works, I'll let you know.

That was my post you are quoting, but you are not allowed to fill that out since you don't have a 107. Applying for airspace authorizations through DroneZone is currently limited to Part 107 pilots only.

 

[dawgpilot]

Dont get me wrong, I very much would like to use it.......my home area previously just required a phone call for an airspace authorization but because LAANC is not available this route is not available. Some say I can leave the recreational side of Dronezone, go into the Part 107 section and click on the request waiver/authorization. There I find this statement:

These tools should only be used to request waivers or authorizations for operations flown under Title 14 Part 107. They are not intended for operations flown in accordance with The Exception for Recreational Flyers.
​

So, please, point me to where there is a way for a recreational pilot to obtain an airspace authorization in an area not serviced by LAANC?

ps I sent an email to [email protected] with the question.

​

You can't. You just have to wait until the FAA either expands LAANC or opens the DroneZone authorization process to recreational fliers. This was explained during the FAA's recent LAANC Webinar.