Remote ID for registered drones under 250g

[jfwag3]

If I have registered my drone voluntarily but it weighs under 250g am I required to have Remote ID?

 

[mavic3usa]

You are not required to transmit RID as long as you are flying your sub-250 as a recreational pilot.

eta: for clarification

 

[msinger]

You are also not required to transmit RID when flying in an FRIA.

You can find more details on this topic here.

 

[Vic Moss]

If it's registered, you need RID. Just unregister it if you aren't using it for 107 fights.

 

[Vic Moss]

You are not required to transmit RID as long as you are flying as a recreational pilot.

As long as you're a recreational flyer and under 250g...

 

[wcmead]

If I have registered my drone voluntarily but it weighs under 250g am I required to have Remote ID?

The current FAA requirement is this:

"Drones which are required to be registered or have been registered, including those flown for recreation, business, or public safety, must comply with the rule on Remote ID."

UAS Remote Identification | Federal Aviation Administration

Drones or unmanned aircraft systems (UAS) are fundamentally changing aviation, and the FAA is committed to working to fully integrate drones into the National Airspace System (NAS). Safety and security are top priorities for the FAA and remote identification (remote ID) of drones is crucial to...

www.faa.gov

That means registered drones (like mine, ugh) under 250 g must comply. Major bummer. Might end my brief encounter with drones.

 

[mavic3usa]

The current FAA requirement is this:

"Drones which are required to be registered or have been registered, including those flown for recreation, business, or public safety, must comply with the rule on Remote ID."

UAS Remote Identification | Federal Aviation Administration

Drones or unmanned aircraft systems (UAS) are fundamentally changing aviation, and the FAA is committed to working to fully integrate drones into the National Airspace System (NAS). Safety and security are top priorities for the FAA and remote identification (remote ID) of drones is crucial to...

www.faa.gov

That means registered drones (like mine, ugh) under 250 g must comply. Major bummer. Might end my brief encounter with drones.

Sigh, except that's not what it means. Unfortunately the lack of clarification and the confusion caused and the unbelievable inability of the government to properly and clearly explain the rules, understandable the answer is not always apparent when you allow a broken database to exist. If you want to wade thru the twisted and convoluted language to see how we get there, happy to go thru it with you. Still, I understand how you arrived at your conclusion, but....

Answer: Today, no you don't have to transmit RID if you are flying your under 250g recreational drone just because your drone is added to your inventory in the FAA database (i.e. often referred to as "registered.")

How do I know? Try it for yourself. Go into the FAA database, log in, added a sub-250g drone to your inventory, under the RID column choose NO. If you were required to transmit RID (which means add your RID serial number) then you wouldn't be allowed to chose NO but would be forced to choose YES and add the RID number.

 

[wcmead]

Sigh, except that's not what it means. Unfortunately the lack of clarification and the confusion caused and the unbelievable inability of the government to properly and clearly explain the rules, understandable the answer is not always apparent when you allow a broken database to exist. If you want to wade thru the twisted and convoluted language to see how we get there, happy to go thru it with you. Still, I understand how you arrived at your conclusion, but....

Answer: Today, no you don't have to transmit RID if you are flying your under 250g recreational drone just because your drone is added to your inventory in the FAA database (i.e. often referred to as "registered.")

How do I know? Try it for yourself. Go into the FAA database, log in, added a sub-250g drone to your inventory, under the RID column choose NO. If you were required to transmit RID (which means add your RID serial number) then you wouldn't be allowed to chose NO but would be forced to choose YES and add the RID number.

Excellent! Wahoo! Doesn't pay to be able to read. Thanks for the reply. Apologies to those posters to whom I gave the "correct" info direct from the FAA.

 

[BigAl07]

Excellent! Wahoo! Doesn't pay to be able to read. Thanks for the reply. Apologies to those posters to whom I gave the "correct" info direct from the FAA.

I'd get it in writing from the FAA or from one of our FAA Safety Team Members (like @Vic Moss ). They are truly "vested" in giving correct and factual advice and they have the resources to back up what they say. Just because someone on the forum showed us a loophole doesn't mean that will hold up in the Court of Law.

Listen people, if we are going to give LEGAL advice on this forum, we have the MORAL responsibility to give the BEST advice possible and not just hyperbole/hypothetical loopholes etc. If someone were to follow your advice and they ended up on the wrong side of the Judge's bench are you also going to be there to support (aka pay for) their defense? Thing BIGGER than just your keyboard and understand someone could be taking your word as gospel and it may not turn out the way you think. We OWE this to our fellow members because it's terribly easy to sit behind the keyboard and make these statements when you have no skin in the game for our fellow members . . . .

 

[wcmead]

OK. Point taken. I'll look for more authoritative advice.

 

[mavic3usa]

OK. Point taken. I'll look for more authoritative advice.

Sir, while I don't give legal advice on this forum and I only give you my opinion, as I mentioned I can give you the readout on this topic as I see it. When I post, I do so responsibly and with the understanding that the topic is complicated and often open to interpretation. I would prefer you rely on the folks with the most authority but that isn't always possible (which is why I think some people come here to post instead of calling or reaching out to the FAA). Check out post #2 and post #5.

If you check the rest of the internet, you'll see there are thousands of RID discussions so it's a good topic to have a round discussion among drone pilots. I prefer otherwise because discussing the FAA law requires a debate and this forum isn't always prepared to debate the issues; but I'm happy to explain my opinion if you wish, just let me know.

 

[wcmead]

Sir, while I don't give legal advice on this forum and I only give you my opinion, as I mentioned I can give you the readout on this topic as I see it. When I post, I do so responsibly and with the understanding that the topic is complicated and often open to interpretation. I would prefer you rely on the folks with the most authority but that isn't always possible (which is why I think some people come here to post instead of calling or reaching out to the FAA). Check out post #2 and post #5.

If you check the rest of the internet, you'll see there are thousands of RID discussions so it's a good topic to have a round discussion among drone pilots. I prefer otherwise because discussing the FAA law requires a debate and this forum isn't always prepared to debate the issues; but I'm happy to explain my opinion if you wish, just let me know.

Thanks.

 

[Vic Moss]

I won't give legal advice on a forum either (I'm not a lawyer), but I will give regulatory guidance.

This is for folks still confused...

This is how Remote ID boils down. If you have to register your drone, it has to have RID. RID is tied directly to registration.

The only sUAS not required to have RID is a <250g recreational drone. If all you do with a <250g is fly recreationally, it does not require registration. And since it does not require registration, it does not need RID. If you have a >250g sUAS (including r/c aircraft), and it doesn't not have RID, it must be flown at an FAA Recognized Identification Area (FRIA). For the <250g non-registered/non-RID drone, you can fly it outside a FRIA.

As far as the "discretionary enforcement" policy in effect until 3/16/24, that basically means if you can be compliant, you're supposed to. If however you can't (can't find RID module, DJI hasn't updated your drone, don't have access to a FRIA), you won't be cited for flying w/o RID in the extremely rare case that someone actually cares.

This is the current state of RID in the U.S.

 

[BigAl07]

Well stated @Vic Moss . We appreciate your time and knowledge.

 

[Aerophile]

I sincerely appreciate @Vic Moss' attempts to clarify things and offer regulatory guidance.

Not to be pedantic (or beat a dead horse), but I think there's still a bit of ambiguity here - at least to me (and I suspect I am not the only one). Bolded emphasis is mine below...

If you have to register your drone, it has to have RID. RID is tied directly to registration.

Fair enough, but are those two short sentences always BOTH true?

What about if you don't "have to" register, but you have voluntarily registered previously? Registration not required, but it's registered, so...RID required? I'm in that boat (sort of...) as are others. So some questions...

Once you have registered a sub-250 gram sUAS, is that registration "reversible"?

How about a sUAS that can be (and often is) flown under 250 grams (using standard batteries), but also can be over 250 grams (using extended batteries, or with strobes stuck on)?

My usually – but not always – sub-250 gram sUAS is/was not required to be registered, at least when I use the standard batteries. But because I also have the heavier batteries, and strobes (all of which puts it over 250 grams, when I use those things), I registered it (and at the time, I saw no reason not to register it). When I use the standard batteries and forego any strobes or other weight-adding accessories, it seems that my sUAS would NOT "have to be registered" but it is registered (at least until I decide to un-register it, assuming that's even possible).

The only sUAS not required to have RID is a <250g recreational drone. If all you do with a <250g is fly recreationally, it does not require registration. And since it does not require registration, it does not need RID. If you have a >250g sUAS (including r/c aircraft), and it doesn't not have RID, it must be flown at an FAA Recognized Identification Area (FRIA).

This, at least, seems somewhat clear:

For the <250g non-registered/non-RID drone, you can fly it outside a FRIA.

So in this case, it's the registration STATUS of my <250g drone that makes it require RID (not whether it is/was ever REQUIRED to be registered...). That seems, well, not completely logical.

In all cases, whether I use the standard or extended batteries, with or without strobes/other add-ons, my flights are all 100% recreational (no YouTube channel for me, no monetization of any sort), flights are 100% only for pleasure/recreation.

In my case (and I bet I'm not the only one), my Mini 3 Pro was registered, back before the details of RID were rolled out (so was my Mini 2, but lets leave that out).

However, I am confident it is not currently broadcasting RID because I have not updated the firmware (enabling RID broadcast for Mini 3 Pro was quietly slipped in to a firmware update early in 2023; I have not applied that firmware update, nor any other firmware update, since then).

It seems to me that, at least using the standard batteries (and no add-ons), at <250 grams and flown recreationally, this drone does not "have to be registered" (even though it currently is).

Given the above criteria, does this drone require RID broadcast? As I understand the requirements, it does not...except that it is already registered, so maybe it does?

Or does it only require RID broadcast when its takeoff weight exceeds 250 grams (when using big batteries, or strobes)? That would certainly be convenient, and also logical (and in keeping with the spirit of the rule "if registration is required"). Or is all this moot because, flying light or heavy, it's already registered, and once registered, RID is required (that is, there's no going back to unregistered status)?

(Note: I have been out of the country for almost a month, and the drone has not been flown in the USA since RID requirements went into effect).

So...is it possible/necessary to now "de-register" a drone that has already been registered? If so, can I simply re-register it every time I want to fly with the extended battery or other add-on that puts it over 250 grams? (Not exactly an elegant solution, and I bet the FAA would not love that either...)

Thanks for any additional clarification on my sometimes (but not always), <250g sUAS that's already registered (but maybe could be de-registered if that would make it possible to fly legally without RID). Sheesh.

 

[mavic3usa]

^So what will probably happen in real life is a bunch of drone pilots will buy the Mini 3 and Mini 4 thinking it is under 250g and not required to be registered....and so they won't register it. They will have no idea their drone is broadcasting remote ID, just because something flashes on the display from time to time saying RID error....

Thus the FAA database becomes ineffective because there will be thousands and thousands of remote IDs transmitted across the airspace that do not show up in a database linked to anyone. But we knew this was going to happen from the sheer number of people who simply refuse to register (regardless the weight) but given the fact there is a semi-valid reason for not doing so....again, just another reason why the entire process is rendered unenforceable. I would hate to be the person caught flying a ghost-drone that is transmitting a rogue RID; it's akin to driving a car with plates but the plates are not on file.

 

[MartMX]

Code of Federal Regulations, title-14, chapter-I, subchapter-F, part-107: 26 pages for flying a quadcopter.
(Note: US Constitution: 16 pages for starting a country.)
Has someone created a flow chart for part 107?

 

[scott135]

@Aerophile did you ever get answers to your questions about RID and a registered sub 250g drone? I too have a sub 250g drone that was registered pre-RID and would be interested to learn what needs to be done to be compliant.

 

[msinger]

As noted here and in the official regulation here:

"All persons operating unmanned aircraft (UA) registered or required to be registered under 14 CFR Parts 47 or 48 must comply with the operating requirements of Part 89 by September 16, 2023."

According to that wording, it doesn't matter if the aircraft was voluntarily registered or not.

 

[scott135]

@msinger thank you for the reply.