Why is it bumping base ISO100 even at shutter speed of 1/3000?

[WildcatDave]

For reference, previously used a Mavic Air 2....

Just flew my new Mini 3 today (Auto mode for photos) and got back to notice the images had ISO varying from iso100 to iso200 even though the Shutter never went below 1/3000. Why would they up the ISO if the SS is already plenty high enough. I want the ISO locked at 100 to minimize noise in the sky and shadows (shoot real estate, often boost shadows a lot to bring out landscaping). With my Air 2 I could set Auto and the ISO would stay at 100 and it would vary the SS as needed but not affect the ISO for outdoor shots,. Even if the SS went down to 1/500 the Air 2 would keep base iso100. We should be able to set range parameters without having to buy the Mavic 3.

I know I can shoot in "Pro" mode and lock the ISO at 100, but then I have to watch the histogram for EVERY shot and adjust the SS for EVERY shot (as clouds and sunlight change). I need to be able to shoot rapidly once I'm airborne. Luckily the noise difference between iso100 and iso200 in minimal, but that is not the point. Either they need to leave the ISO at base below 1/1000 or give us more shooting modes, on this "PRO" drone.

If I am missing something, please let me know...

 

[Bodkin's Best Photography]

For reference, previously used a Mavic Air 2....

Just flew my new Mini 3 today (Auto mode for photos) and got back to notice the images had ISO varying from iso100 to iso200 even though the Shutter never went below 1/3000. Why would they up the ISO if the SS is already plenty high enough. I want the ISO locked at 100 to minimize noise in the sky and shadows (shoot real estate, often boost shadows a lot to bring out landscaping). With my Air 2 I could set Auto and the ISO would stay at 100 and it would vary the SS as needed but not affect the ISO for outdoor shots,. Even if the SS went down to 1/500 the Air 2 would keep base iso100. We should be able to set range parameters without having to buy the Mavic 3.

I know I can shoot in "Pro" mode and lock the ISO at 100, but then I have to watch the histogram for EVERY shot and adjust the SS for EVERY shot (as clouds and sunlight change). I need to be able to shoot rapidly once I'm airborne. Luckily the noise difference between iso100 and iso200 in minimal, but that is not the point. Either they need to leave the ISO at base below 1/1000 or give us more shooting modes, on this "PRO" drone.

If I am missing something, please let me know...

You seem to be confused. 1/3000th of a second is an absurdly fast shutter speed. Of course your ISO is going to go up if in auto. Fast shutter speeds (1/3000) let in LESS light. Slow shutter speeds (1/500) let in MORE light.

 

[brett8883]

You seem to be confused. 1/3000th of a second is an absurdly fast shutter speed. Of course your ISO is going to go up if in auto. Fast shutter speeds (1/3000) let in LESS light. Slow shutter speeds (1/500) let in MORE light.

The question is why did auto mode increase iso and not lower the shutter speed instead. I think it’s a fair question and the OP seems to understand that it’s an absurdly high shutter.

 

[MS Coast]

The question is why did auto mode increase iso and not lower the shutter speed instead. I think it’s a fair question and the OP seems to understand that it’s an absurdly high shutter.

That's behavior is programmed into the DJI software that sets exposure in the auto mode. You hve to change one or the other and they chose to adjust ISO. I think a change from 100 to 200 isn't going to produce a big change in noise or grain.

EDIT: This is not available on the Mini 3 Pro. It is on some DJI models.
If you want to lock ISO at 100 and still have auto exposure, then just use the manual mode and set IS0 to 100 and all the other parameters to auto.

 

[WildcatDave]

You seem to be confused. 1/3000th of a second is an absurdly fast shutter speed. Of course your ISO is going to go up if in auto. Fast shutter speeds (1/3000) let in LESS light. Slow shutter speeds (1/500) let in MORE light.

Not confused, maybe I just didn't get my point across correctly. It shouldn't be using any iso besides 100 unless the shutter speed starts dropping below 1/500. Otherwise is a quick enough shutter to avoid any kind of vibration or blurring in the image capture.

Are other people experiencing this as well? There's just no reason to have ISO 200 with a shutter speed of 1/3000. It should be ISO 100 with the shutter speed of 1/1500.

It seems like they've programmed the "Auto" setting to keep shutter speeds extremely high. I wonder if in testing they had issues with vibration of the drone because of the tiny gimbal or tiny drone body with wind? And to avoid it they are bumping ISO to keep shutter speeds extremly high. All in all, it seems like a bad design decision. In bright sunlight there's no reason to shoot anything but ISO 100.

 

[WildcatDave]

That's behavior is programmed into the DJI software that sets exposure in the auto mode. You hve to change one or the other and they chose to adjust ISO. I think a change from 100 to 200 isn't going to produce a big change in noise or grain.

If you want to lock ISO at 100 and still have auto exposure, then just use the manual mode and set IS0 to 100 and all the other parameters to auto.

I would love to be able to do this. However this drone does not support this. You have to get one of the higher end drones like a Mavic 3. If you set the camera to "Pro" mode (which is I think what you're meaning when you say "manual mode") you have to manually set the parameters (iso & shutter). But there are no Auto options at that point for either of them. It would be great if they availablize this but they're reserving it for their higher end drones, which is absolutely ridiculous.

Every drone should have an ISO priority mode and shutter speed priority mode. The higher end ones that have adjustable aperture should have an aperture priority mode. It seems like this is a technique to push you into buying a higher-end drone, which is really not a way to take care of your customer base. You should have real features that make your upper models desirable, not locked out normal camera settings.

I hope the drone industry continues to grow and become popular so other manufacturers jump in. Because the business practices that DJI use as the industry leader are abhorrent. But they don't have any real competition so they can kind of get away with whatever they want to at this point.

I previously had a Yuneec Typhoon H (before getting an Air 2) which was a wonderful piece of equipment without real any limitations. The way that they designed their software and hardware was pretty impressive.

 

[bkushner]

It's always been that way. The Mavic 3 Pro does it.

 

[globetrotterdrone]

@WildcatDave
Unluckily, as you experienced, the Mini 3 Pro doesn't feature a semi auto mode, so setting the camera to PRO involves dealing with the shutter speed manually.

This behaviour reminds me on the earlier times of digital cameras, when the manufacturers only implemented the more advanced mode in their high price series. It's certainly not that hard to do but they didn't for a long time.

For now, we can only hope if DJI might improve on this.
With one of the latest updates you at least have the chance to set the exposure setting to a custom key, which I did on the right wheel. So it is less of a hassle to touch and adjust but now just turning the wheel.

 

[akdrone]

I would love to be able to do this. However this drone does not support this. You have to get one of the higher end drones like a Mavic 3. If you set the camera to "Pro" mode (which is I think what you're meaning when you say "manual mode") you have to manually set the parameters (iso & shutter). But there are no Auto options at that point for either of them. It would be great if they availablize this but they're reserving it for their higher end drones, which is absolutely ridiculous.

Every drone should have an ISO priority mode and shutter speed priority mode. The higher end ones that have adjustable aperture should have an aperture priority mode. It seems like this is a technique to push you into buying a higher-end drone, which is really not a way to take care of your customer base. You should have real features that make your upper models desirable, not locked out normal camera settings.

I hope the drone industry continues to grow and become popular so other manufacturers jump in. Because the business practices that DJI use as the industry leader are abhorrent. But they don't have any real competition so they can kind of get away with whatever they want to at this point.

I previously had a Yuneec Typhoon H (before getting an Air 2) which was a wonderful piece of equipment without real any limitations. The way that they designed their software and hardware was pretty impressive.

Availablize - my new favrite word !

 

[MavicAir2Marc]

It seems like they've programmed the "Auto" setting to keep shutter speeds extremely high. I wonder if in testing they had issues with vibration of the drone because of the tiny gimbal or tiny drone body with wind? And to avoid it they are bumping ISO to keep shutter speeds extremly high. All in all, it seems like a bad design decision. In bright sunlight there's no reason to shoot anything but ISO 100.

I think you're right. They've most likely prioritized shutter speed over ISO. It doesn't make sense in bright conditions but when you start getting into lower light, they want to ensure you get a picture that isn't blurred because the shutter speed was too low. Unfortunately, that's the choice they have to make and there is no changing it mid stream. Obviously DJI engineers thought shutter priority was a better choice than low noise ISO priority. They can only choose one without some AI involved which they aren't there yet in these consumer level drones.

 

[SrMi]

What is the slowest shutter speed on Mini 3 that avoids blur (stationary objects)?

 

[WildcatDave]

What is the slowest shutter speed on Mini 3 that avoids blur (stationary objects)?

That's going to depend on the conditions that you're flying in for sure. I will say I never had a single blurry shot with my mavic Air 2 and it would commonly shoot at 1/500th of a second at ISO 100. So deciding to bump the ISO at 1/3000 is absolutely ridiculous.

The best way to determine this would be to set it to manual mode and keep lowering the shutter speed. You'll have to get some ND filters to do that, otherwise all your images will be blown out and you'll have trouble seeing anything.

 

[brett8883]

What is the slowest shutter speed on Mini 3 that avoids blur (stationary objects)?

You’d be pretty safe at 1/100 but possibly as low as 1/25.

 

[WildcatDave]

You’d be pretty safe at 1/100 but possibly as low as 1/25.

I would say this is probably true. As the gimbal provides quite a bit of stabilization. If you ever have to shoot in conditions where you're down around 1/100, I would take multiple shots to make sure you have one in focus. Got to love digital!

 

[brett8883]

I would say this is probably true. As the gimbal provides quite a bit of stabilization. If you ever have to shoot in conditions where you're down around 1/100, I would take multiple shots to make sure you have one in focus. Got to love digital!

The usual rule of thumb for handheld of a non stabilized camera is 1/(focal length*2).

The equivalent focal length is about 24mm so it would be 1/(24*2)=1/50. The Mini 3 is stabilized but I doubled that figure anyway to get to a very conservative figure at 1/100. So I think you can shoot pretty confidently at 1/100 no problem.

For stabilized cameras cameras the figure is usually 1/focal length which is where the more liberal figure of 1/25 comes from.

 

[SrMi]

I would say this is probably true. As the gimbal provides quite a bit of stabilization. If you ever have to shoot in conditions where you're down around 1/100, I would take multiple shots to make sure you have one in focus. Got to love digital!

Motion blur differs from focus, which can also be unreliable (AF).
With an equivalent 24mm lens and at least a couple of stops gained by gimbal stabilization, I would expect sharp results at 1/12 sec or slower.
But experience trumps guessing .

 

[WildcatDave]

This is what I'm talking about. Here is a photo from a shoot earlier today. Why is the camera picking that ridiculous shutter speed and moving past base ISO. They need to do a firmware update and change the way the camera makes decisions, because this is stupid.

You can't even do a three shot Auto exposure bracket because it goes past the 1/8000 shutter speed for the underexposed image. You'd have to put on ND filter on to even do something as simple as a three shot aeb because of the wide aperture. The camera boosting the ISO makes the situation even less workable. I prefer not to have more glass in front of the lens as it always causes some degradation in image quality. And with the Arizona sun you get some odd reflections with filters often.

Note... Used my phone to quickshot lightroom.

 

[WildcatDave]

Motion blur differs from focus, which can also be unreliable (AF).
With an equivalent 24mm lens and at least a couple of stops gained by gimbal stabilization, I would expect sharp results at 1/12 sec or slower.
But experience trumps guessing .

That all makes sense and I'm sure you can shoot like that if you need to. I've seen drone shots as long as a second that look just perfectly fine. You just don't want to get back to edit and find out you have a blurry mess. And with the mini 3 it shoots shutter speeds into the thousandths regardless apparently, so no worry there for me. I don't shoot at night only, daytime real estate.

 

[Wumpus_NJ]

Availablize - my new favrite word !

He needs to incentivize DJI to implement semi-auto mode.

 

[WildcatDave]

It's always been that way. The Mavic 3 Pro does it.

Just because its always been that way doesn't mean its acceptable. Especially when THEY named it a PRO drone; which it is definitely not. Nice little consumer drone... yup, but not Pro. Using the moniker just to sell more widgets