Hot Air Balloon Loophole

[Slade]

Hot Air balloons galore this morning. As three balloons hovered over my home I wondered if the anti-drone Woke police were complaining about the balloon pilots invading their privacy. Notwithstanding, the balloons flew over busy traffic and people “oot and aboot.” Let’s work to close the Hot Air Balloon Loophole.

 

[MA2 317]

Manned aircraft with different rules.

 

[old man mavic]

and dont forget the people who fly them have to have similar training to light aircraft pilots plus a licence to handle propane burners safely

 

[tck444]

And of course, Hot Air balloons are completely safe?

 

[Repaid1]

And of course, Hot Air balloons are completely safe?

Well they don't have a unblemished record like "Drones" During the 12-yr period, 78 hot-air balloon tours crashed, involving 518 occupants. There were 91 serious injuries and 5 fatalities; 83% of crashes resulted in one or more serious or fatal outcomes. Of the serious injuries characterized, 56% were lower extremity fractures. Most crashes (81%) occurred during landing; 65% involved hard landings. Fixed object collisions contributed to 50% of serious injuries and all 5 fatalities. During landing sequences, gondola dragging, tipping, bouncing, and occupant ejection were associated with poor outcomes. Of the crashes resulting in serious or fatal outcomes, 20% of balloons were significantly damaged or destroyed.

While manned aircraft do have to follow separate guidance and training, the key point is both manned and unmanned aircraft involve....ahhhh...Man.

 

[BenF]

I actually was in a tethered hot air balloon when it "crashed". A strong wind suddenly appeared, The attendants
scrambled to get the gondola stabilized and the balloon deflated. The balloon didn't get more than a few inches above the ground before wind hit. No one was hurt. The balloon people had a DJI Phantom 4 taking pictures, but not at the time when the wind picked up. Luckily one of the ropes held, two ropes didn't.

 

[hiflyer201]

I suggest we let them do their thing and we do ours. Actually we owe a lot to the brothers Montgolfier.
After their demo flight before the King way back in the 1700's, The King decreed that none of his subjects would never ever be allowed to go aloft. Thankfully that ship has sailed.

 

[SkyeHigh]

And of course, Hot Air balloons are completely safe?

Sure, just like a Mavic Mini - flyaway with the wind. [emoji41]

 

[Tim40]

Well they don't have a unblemished record like "Drones" During the 12-yr period, 78 hot-air balloon tours crashed, involving 518 occupants. There were 91 serious injuries and 5 fatalities; 83% of crashes resulted in one or more serious or fatal outcomes. Of the serious injuries characterized, 56% were lower extremity fractures. Most crashes (81%) occurred during landing; 65% involved hard landings. Fixed object collisions contributed to 50% of serious injuries and all 5 fatalities. During landing sequences, gondola dragging, tipping, bouncing, and occupant ejection were associated with poor outcomes. Of the crashes resulting in serious or fatal outcomes, 20% of balloons were significantly damaged or destroyed.

While manned aircraft do have to follow separate guidance and training, the key point is both manned and unmanned aircraft involve....ahhhh...Man.

Yeah - so what does the FAA go after - the drones. Without any fatalities. And even the tinywhoops - are banned from FPV. The tinywhoop - you can fly em into people all day long - without incurring any injuries - even if you were trying to harm someone - you couldn't. But ... the FAA ... it somehow finds em to be lethal - when flown FPV. The FAA is the problem here. Not pilots flying tinywhoops FPV.

 

[BigAl07]

Yeah - so what does the FAA go after - the drones. Without any fatalities. And even the tinywhoops - are banned from FPV. The tinywhoop - you can fly em into people all day long - without incurring any injuries - even if you were trying to harm someone - you couldn't. But ... the FAA ... it somehow finds em to be lethal - when flown FPV. The FAA is the problem here. Not pilots flying tinywhoops FPV.

What size of UAS do you think the FAA should stop controlling? In time there will probably be classifications but until then it's all lumped into one pot together. It takes time to iron out the wrinkle and get regulations worked out even more so when the technology is changing daily.

 

[611WM]

The privacy concern with a low slow balloon over houses is the same. I think the privacy concern is used most often to restrict drones.

 

[CaptSheffield]

Yeah - so what does the FAA go after - the drones. Without any fatalities. And even the tinywhoops - are banned from FPV. The tinywhoop - you can fly em into people all day long - without incurring any injuries - even if you were trying to harm someone - you couldn't. But ... the FAA ... it somehow finds em to be lethal - when flown FPV. The FAA is the problem here. Not pilots flying tinywhoops FPV.

I wouldn't say you can't get hurt. Weight of the drone at 20+, but the sharp blades spinning however fast. But generally I think you've a good point. I'm not a fan of their desire to control, and am a bit disappointed in the number of ppl who think it's a wonderful thing. Talking bout fliers, not karens.

 

[Tim40]

What size of UAS do you think the FAA should stop controlling? In time there will probably be classifications but until then it's all lumped into one pot together. It takes time to iron out the wrinkle and get regulations worked out even more so when the technology is changing daily.

Common sense brings the tinywhoop class into mind. FPV tinywhoops can weigh as little as an ounce. But they're still considered lethal by our incredible FAA. They max out at 60g or so. And they have prop ducts around their tiny props. The smallest ones - the prop guards are for protecting the props, not people. The FAA put its hands over its eyes, stamped its feet on the floor - and said ban em all - ban em all. That's stupid. We don't want stupid, do we? That's how we got the Boeing MAX's falling out of the sky - the FAA did stupid with that too - letting the mfgs test their own work. That FAA isn't smart these days - it's up to us to make it smart again.

 

[BigAl07]

Common sense brings the tinywhoop class into mind. FPV tinywhoops can weigh as little as an ounce. But they're still considered lethal by our incredible FAA. They max out at 60g or so. And they have prop ducts around their tiny props. The smallest ones - the prop guards are for protecting the props, not people. The FAA put its hands over its eyes, stamped its feet on the floor - and said ban em all - ban em all. That's stupid. We don't want stupid, do we? That's how we got the Boeing MAX's falling out of the sky - the FAA did stupid with that too - letting the mfgs test their own work. That FAA isn't smart these days - it's up to us to make it smart again.

At what point do you want the FAA to change classifications? The problem is whatever weight you say, someone with a UAS just a few grams heavier will have your same argument. It's a never ending debate and someone is always going to get their feelings hurt who just happens to be close to the thresh-hold on weight classification once they are established.

For YEARS our industry as a whole has begged to be considered Aircraft so we can have the ability to do more in the NAS but some of the lighter units are going to be "hampered" simply because it's not a multitiered system YET.

I welcome you to come "make me smart" again any time you'd like. I can give you my personal phone # and we can privately discuss your point of view (it's incorrect BTW). The FAA isn't "going after TW's flying FPV". It just happens they are in the sUAS classification and subject to the same rules as larger UAS. It does no good to fixate on one tiny aspect when the Big Picture is what matters.

Allen
FAA Safety Team Representative & FAA Safety Team Drone Pro (Charlotte NC region)

I have 47 years of UAS experience and 27 years of Manned Aircraft Experience. I've flown everything from TW's up to 75lb High Performance UAS and everything in between. I look forward to more enlightenment from you sir.

 

[Tim40]

Nawww - this is the FAA in a nutshell - just plain stupid ... and saying there's nothing to be done for it.

Not a thing we can do they claim - to fix their stupid rules. And the FAA is claiming that if you can't fix it all - you can't touch any of it. Some nonsense about the FAA's big picture. Does that picture include the Boeing MAX disasters? (Can you tell the level of respect I got for today's FAA? I'm worried that it doesn't show.)

Again - start with the obvious - fix that. Then work on the next stupid bit.

So right now - today - the obvious ... 1 ounce tinywhoops are harmless - and the FAA could say they are hands off on anything under an ounce - FPV, anything under an ounce - hands off. But -- they are too stupid to do even that little bit.

That little bit of obvious common sense is beyond their capabilities. Boggles the mind.

Stupid - not smart. Wringing their hands - weeping that there's simply no way to fix the dumb things they do. Turning our hobby into a crime. That's criminal, in my book.

You suggested a tele call - but then you put up the FAA wall (there's nothing to be done) - so ... until you can say that the FAA should not be regulating the tiny stuff - until you can say maybe the FAA did get some of this wrong and needs to change it now - we got nothing to discuss.

SO - how about those 1 ounce FPV tinywhoops - are you ready to admit the FAA goofed?

 

[BigAl07]

LOL!! ^^^

 

[Tim40]

LOL!! ^^^

Nothing funny bout today's FAA. Tinywhoops are harmless - why can't the FAA see that? Why?

 

[BigAl07]

Nothing funny bout today's FAA. Tinywhoops are harmless - why can't the FAA see that? Why?

Listen, you've stated your point.... repeatedly... your actions are becoming Troll-ish. Move on and let the thread get back on topic.