New to nd filters

[3rdof5]

Greetings Pilots,
I have never used nd filters before, I'm not a pro photographer, I'm more of a pilot and the video has always been secondary but with my new Classic I really want to take advantage of the great camera.
I understand nd filters somewhat, and how they help to keep the Shutter speed closer to the sweet spot, but I'm certainly no expert and would appreciate your advice.
I always fly with camera settings in Auto mode and mostly that works perfectly, mostly.
I did a test flight using the nd 16 filter vs no filter with the sun behind some clouds, in that order.
Please have a look at the video link and let me hear your opinions and advice

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[GadgetGuy]

Not seeing seeing any noticeable difference.
With mostly static scenes, you will never notice a difference.
ND filters are intended to create motion blur in between the frames where there is movement, so it avoids jitter. If there is no movement, there is no jitter to smooth out. Your video is at 60fps, so 1/120 sec is your optimal shutter speed. How did you arrive at ND 16 as the filter of choice?

 

[Vic Moss]

The only time you need ND filters for still photography is if you want movement in your photo. Something like cars or water. Otherwise, you don't need them at all.

For instance, there is an ND 32 on this shot because I needed to pan the drone. Without the ND, there would have no movement and the shot wouldn't work.

 

[3rdof5]

Not seeing seeing any noticeable difference.
With mostly static scenes, you will never notice a difference.
ND filters are intended to create motion blur in between the frames where there is movement, so it avoids jitter. If there is no movement, there is no jitter to smooth out. Your video is at 60fps, so 1/120 sec is your optimal shutter speed. How did you arrive at ND 16 as the filter of choice?

I chose the 16 based solely on the light level.

 

[Cosmo0g]

SkywalkerFeng has two great write ups about using filters.​

Freewell polarized ND filters and vinetting

Good evening guys. I have been having a problem that I will like some assistance with. Ever since I purchased my Mavic 3 and using freewell PL ND filters I get vinetting only when I take photos. I am not sure if the problem is with my filters or installation. When in post I always have to fix...

mavicpilots.com

Freewell polarized ND filters and vinetting

Good evening guys. I have been having a problem that I will like some assistance with. Ever since I purchased my Mavic 3 and using freewell PL ND filters I get vinetting only when I take photos. I am not sure if the problem is with my filters or installation. When in post I always have to fix...

mavicpilots.com

 

[Harro]

ND filters are used on bright days to reduce the amount of light, and so affect the shutter speed, ISO and aperature setting.

 

[GadgetGuy]

I chose the 16 based solely on the light level.

How did you measure the light level?
What was the resulting shutter speed of the video with the ND16?
If you are only shooting in Auto, you'll never know which ND value will result in 1/120 sec shutter speed for 60fps.

 

[3rdof5]

How did you measure the light level?
What was the resulting shutter speed of the video with the ND16?
If you are only shooting in Auto, you'll never know which ND value will result in 1/120 sec shutter speed for 60fps.

Agreed and I really appreciated that response, so, what I've learned so far is the best ratio of FPS to shutter speed and to monitor the settings in the Pro menu instead of Auto. Now I need to apply the correct filter in high light scenarios to stay as close to that shutter speed while having an appropriate ISO level. Any tips on ISO in this scenario?

 

[GadgetGuy]

Agreed and I really appreciated that response, so, what I've learned so far is the best ratio of FPS to shutter speed and to monitor the settings in the Pro menu instead of Auto. Now I need to apply the correct filter in high light scenarios to stay as close to that shutter speed while having an appropriate ISO level. Any tips on ISO in this scenario?

Keep ISO as low as possible in all scenarios, and use 30fps instead of 60fps to gain another full stop, even when not using any ND filters. You can also adjust the aperture to adjust shutter speed even without an ND.

 

[FelixW]

My recommendation is not to use Auto. settings if you would like your shots to appear more "Pro". Keep your shutter at double your frame rate i.e. 60fps=1/125th or 24fps=1/48th keep your ISO a low as possible (Auto will change your ISO to maintain "correct" exposure and in low light settings MAY raise it to a level that makes the video too noisy). Use your aperture to fine tune exposure, when your aperture can't open wide enough (small numbers) to get a correctly exposed image, increase ISO and when the environment is too bright to get a correctly exposed image with the smallest aperture (*high numbers) use ND's. Additionally and equally important do not have your WB (white balance) setting on Auto. as this will shift color temperature mid shot making your shot shift from a neutral tone to blue or orange depending on the circumstances which is not desirable. Good luck : )

* aperture numbers higher than 11 will generally start to soften the entire image and are best avoided.

 

[3rdof5]

My recommendation is not to use Auto. settings if you would like your shots to appear more "Pro". Keep your shutter at double your frame rate i.e. 60fps=1/125th or 24fps=1/48th keep your ISO a low as possible (Auto will change your ISO to maintain "correct" exposure and in low light settings MAY raise it to a level that makes the video too noisy). Use your aperture to fine tune exposure, when your aperture can't open wide enough (small numbers) to get a correctly exposed image, increase ISO and when the environment is too bright to get a correctly exposed image with the smallest aperture (*high numbers) use ND's. Additionally and equally important do not have your WB (white balance) setting on Auto. as this will shift color temperature mid shot making your shot shift from a neutral tone to blue or orange depending on the circumstances which is not desirable. Good luck : )

* aperture numbers higher than 11 will generally start to soften the entire image and are best avoided.

Excellent advice, Thank You!
I did a test flight in the evening with the sun behind some cloud, 4K 60FPS, SS 120, ISO (starting at 200 then switched to 100 to see the difference) aperture left on Auto but it never changed from 2.8 and white balance on auto (didn't think of that till now that you mentioned it). This was also with the wide angle lens attached. Have a look.

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[FelixW]

I see the ISO chang to 100 but one would think the AUTO aperture would kick in right away to compensate. If the WB was on AUTO I don't see much if any color temp. shifting. On the occations when my Air 2S was in Auto it took a while before I noticed. The software inplimentation at DJI is quite good in making the transitions smooth. Not that I am an expert on that setting as I rarely use it on any of my cameras. The movements/conditions you are using are quite gentle to really see the changes I think you would need to have more extreme lighting transitions. I'm not anti Auto., in some circumstances it is a viable option but in most conditions the consistent/predictable results of manual setting are a great way to go, it just takes practice, getting to know how your sensor responds to the extremes of highlights and shadows and using the highest bit depth color profiles always ; ) Happy shooting.

 

[3rdof5]

I see the ISO chang to 100 but one would think the AUTO aperture would kick in right away to compensate. If the WB was on AUTO I don't see much if any color temp. shifting. On the occations when my Air 2S was in Auto it took a while before I noticed. The software inplimentation at DJI is quite good in making the transitions smooth. Not that I am an expert on that setting as I rarely use it on any of my cameras. The movements/conditions you are using are quite gentle to really see the changes I think you would need to have more extreme lighting transitions. I'm not anti Auto., in some circumstances it is a viable option but in most conditions the consistent/predictable results of manual setting are a great way to go, it just takes practice, getting to know how your sensor responds to the extremes of highlights and shadows and using the highest bit depth color profiles always ; ) Happy shooting.

Thanks! You comment on the smooth movements, tbh, most of that flight was using Cruise Control.