Strategy for EU Open Category from 2024 on

[wco81]

Starting in 2024, the EU will restrict the types of drone flights unless you have a drone with a certified class label.

The lighter the drone, the fewer restrictions. For instance, drones under 250 grams can operate in the A1 Open Subcategory, the least restrictive. These drones can also get the C0 label.

Open Category - Low Risk - Civil Drones | EASA

The ‘open’ category is the main reference for the majority of leisure drone activities and low-risk commercial activities.

www.easa.europa.eu

The next weight threshold is 900 grams or below, which also qualifies for A1 Subcategory.

So that means the Mavic 3, Mavic 3 Cine and the Mavic 3 Classic can get a C1 label for drones under 900 grams but the Mavic 3 Pro is over the limit at like 950 grams or something like that.

I have a Mavic 2 Pro and have been holding off on the upgrade until we saw a full array of which products would have a certified Class label.

Now that the Air 3 is out, that would also get a C1 label presumably, but as expected, it's missing features out of the box and the sensor is a downgrade compared to the previous top end Air model -- please don't derail this thread with talk about how the smaller sensor is "better" than the newest 1-inch sensor they could have used.


So do you think DJI or any other vendor has plans for more releases over the next 6-12 months or so, which would not only comply with C1 weight requirements but be worth considering compared to the M3 series (all except the Pro) and the Air 3? There's been some talk of the Air 3S or Air 3 Pro so maybe if they can release within a year from now, that might be a better option for those who want a C1 label drone.

 

[js47]

The Air 3 does have the C1 label.

To clarify, you can’t just “get” a C label for any drone that meets the weight requirements — there are many other requirements that must be met in addition to weight and the certification process can only be undertaken by the manufacturer of the drone. A Mini 2 will never get a C0 label (though it is eligible to fly in A1 anyway). An Air2/Air2S/Mavic2/etc will never get a C1 label and will have to fly in A3 (unless you hold an EU A2 certification).

If you are looking for image quality above everything else, get a Mavic 3 or Mavic 3 Classic. It seems like the Mavic series is only getting heavier from here so no more C1 labels (and they are unlikely to update it for a while now anyway). I very much doubt the Air series will have a 4/3” sensor until they put something bigger into the Mavic (though DJI currently seems to be intent on cramming in more cameras instead a bigger sensor).

Even if they put a future-gen 1” sensor in the hypothetical Air 3S, it will still get slapped by the "old" 4/3” sensor of the Mavic 3. The size difference between 1" and 4/3" is similar to the difference between Micro Four Thirds and APS-C — you need many generations of sensor tech improvement to get them on the same level. And the size difference between 1/1.3" and 4/3" is nearly like jumping from Micro Four Thirds to full frame.

 

[wco81]

Right, I meant new drones differentiated by weight, not legacy drones.

Obviously DJI want to sell you new products, probably wouldn't try to get older drones certified even if that option was possible.

That is why I made this thread, for people who don't yet have a certified drone for the A1 Subcategory yet. I'm in that situation, so I wanted to see how other people are approaching this question, if they want to fly in Europe and UK. My understanding is the UK and other European countries are likely to go along with the EU regs, even if they aren't in the EU officially.

 

[js47]

The UK completely ignores the EU regulations at the moment so I would not lump them in with other countries. Hopefully they'll change their mind but I would not say it is looking promising. Unlikely to be anytime soon, at any rate.

For the reasons I listed above, DJI is unlikely to ever come out with any new C1 drones with image quality better than their current offerings — even if there is an Air 3S in the pipeline. Based on their current trajectory, I'd expect the future Mavic 4 to be C2 rated, but surely that is 2+ years away.

The (C1) image quality pecking order is very clearly defined:

1. Mavic 3 and Mavic 3 Classic
2. [Hypothetical Air 3S, 1+ years away]
3. Air 3
4. Mini 3 and Mini 3 Pro

I'd say start at the top of that list and stop when your budget tells you to. Unless you plan to fly in towns in the UK, in which case your only option is the Mini. Also note that only the Mavic 3 has an adjustable aperture.

 

[wco81]

Really, no drone over 250 grams in the UK?

I'm going in September and was planning to take my M2P.

 

[js47]

Really, no drone over 250 grams in the UK?

I'm going in September and was planning to take my M2P.

You can fly whatever you want if you are far from buildings and people, or if the drone is <250g. I live in the UK and own one drone: the original Mavic 3. I don't need to fly near people so it is not an issue for me.

If you want to fly a Mavic closer than 150m to buildings or closer than 50m to people then you will need the A2 CofC (the UK version, which is not the same as the EU version). Then you can fly close to buildings but must still maintain 50m (+1:1 rule) from any uninvolved people. You are only allowed to fly closer than 50m to people (even with a low speed mode activated) with drones weighing less than 250g. Without a UK A2 certificate you must follow the same rules with your Mavic 2 as someone with an Inspire.


I posted this breakdown elsewhere but it might be useful here as well:

UK
It should be noted that the rules for the UK are different than the rules for the EU. The UK is much more restrictive than the EU since the UK CAA does not recognize the EASA Class Labels (C0, C1, C2, etc). In the UK everyone needs an Operator ID (even for a Mini since it has a camera). It is easy and quick to get an Operator ID (costs £10). If the drone weighs >250g then you also need a Flyer ID (also easy and quick to get, and the Flyer ID is free. This is comparable to the basic EU A1/A3 test). This page breaks down those rules: https://register-drones.caa.co.uk/drone-code/getting-what-you-need-to-fly

• Note that by CAA rules you are only required to have insurance if the drone weighs more than 20kg or if you are working commercially.
• Note that all separation distances listed below are the minimum and you must always factor in the 1:1 rule.
• If your drone weighs <250g (ie, the Mini series only) then you can overfly people. You must have an Operator ID since the drone has a camera.
• If your drone weighs >250g but less than 500g then you must not fly closer than 50m to uninvolved people. This category comprises I think exclusively of the Spark and original Mavic Air(not 2 or 2S or 3 — those are all >500g). You must have both an Operator ID and a Flyer ID.
  • If you have the A2 CofC certification, which is pretty easy but takes a few days to obtain (all online), then you can overfly people, but not intentionally and it must be brief. Costs about £70.
• If your drone weighs over 500g (and up to 25kg) then you must stay >50m away from any uninvolved people and >150m away from any structure at all times. This category includes all of the Mavic series drones (except for the Mavic Mini), all of the Air series drones (except for the original), and all of the Inspire series drones. You must have both an Operator ID and a Flyer ID.
  • "Structure" is very broadly defined by the CAA and includes basically everything you can imagine: individual residential buildings, small groups of residential buildings, housing estates, villages, cities and towns, schools, tourist attractions, sports facilities, beaches and parks, theme parks, shopping centres, warehouses, business parks, factories, docks, rail and transport hubs, etc. Source for this list: https://register-drones.caa.co.uk/drone-code/where-you-can-fly
  • If you have the A2 CofC certification, which is pretty easy but takes a few days to obtain (all online), you can fly near structures with a drone >250g and <2kg, but you still must maintain 50m separation from uninvolved people (even in low speed mode). Costs about £70.
  • Drones >2kg (ie Inspire) must still maintain 150m from buildings and 50m from people, even with an A2 CofC.
• This official PDF from the CAA breaks these rules down: https://publicapps.caa.co.uk/docs/33/Drone Rules Factsheet.pdf

 

[wco81]

Thanks for the run down.

I don't expect to fly in any cities or towns. I saw some drone maps so obviously one wouldn't expect to be able to fly over central London.

But incredibly, the map I saw didn't show any NFZ in central Bath or a lot of the Cotswold villages, which are the areas I plan to visit.

Of course I don't know if there are national parks or nature reserves, which tend to have drone restrictions to protect wildlife.


That's interesting, one wouldn't expect UK to adopt any of the EASA regs explicitly since Brexit but I got the sense from other UK members that they'd more or less adopt the class label scheme, so as to not expend effort to make their own category definitions and such.

 

[js47]

London is basically one big NFZ as far as I know. Bath and the Cotswold villages are fair game though (I am right near there in Bristol), as long as you follow the relevant rules regarding minimum distances to structures and uninvolved people. Realistically you can only fly a Mini near towns since with heavier drones you need to maintain 150m from structures (and 50m from people). Even with an A2 CofC, staying 50m from people is difficult in towns.

Nature Reserves and Sites of Special Scientific Interest are typically NFZs. National Parks all have their own rules, some allow it and some don't. Additionally, National Trust, English Heritage, Cadw, etc all prohibit taking off and landing on their property. But it is important to note that that is the extent of it — you can overfly their property so long as you don't take off or land on it. Same thing with the National Parks which prohibit drones. If you take off and land from the road (which is usually owned by the Crown, which does not prohibit flying drones) then you are legal. Doesn't mean you won't get accosted for it, though!

The CAA's original intent was to adopt the EASA class ratings, but they abruptly changed their mind 8 months ago. So anything you read that was posted before then would reflect that.

 

[wco81]

So in less than a month, people will need the class labels and for people who reside outside the EU, it appears DJI isn't going to send you the class label, even if you have a C1-certified drone like the Air3 or the Mavic 3 Classic.

Hopefully we will get reports from members who our non-EU residents but visiting EU with their drone, to see what the enforcement is like.

If the enforcement is aggressive, we may have to find workarounds.

#3

 

[Redmondo]

New drone flyer here and recently picked up a DJI Mavic 2 Pro. Am I correct in thinking that if I have my A2 C of C I can still fly the Mavic 2 Pro drone within the A2 sub category until 2026 based on the CAA guidance in the UK?

Or will I be restricted to A3 only e.g. over 150m away from people and buildings?

I'm looking to use the drone for creating photometric models and building inspection works so the A3 category wouldn't be suitable for my use.

 

[YRauste]

An Air2/Air2S/Mavic2/etc will never get a C1 label and will have to fly in A3 (unless you hold an EU A2 certification).

Air 2S is planned to get the C1 label in the coming months (retrospectively about the same way as they did with Mavic 3) according to the DJI forum. Air 2 is not included despite earlier plans or promises, unfortunately.
And legacy drones cannot be flown outside the A3 airspace (150 m from residential, trafic, ... and recreational areas) even with the A1/A2/A3 CoC (the A2 CoC made a difference only in the transition period). In EU that is.

 

[wco81]

Not sure about the UK but the EU requires labels to operate in the A2

Air 2S is planned to get the C1 label in the coming months (retrospectively about the same way as they did with Mavic 3) according to the DJI forum. Air 2 is not included despite earlier plans or promises, unfortunately.
And legacy drones cannot be flown outside the A3 airspace (150 m from residential, trafic, ... and recreational areas) even with the A1/A2/A3 CoC (the A2 CoC made a difference only in the transition period). In EU that is.

Is Air2S the only legacy drone that is getting retroactively certified?

Problem is you must have an EU address to which they'd mail you the label.

 

[YRauste]

Is Air2S the only legacy drone that is getting retroactively certified?

No, DJI started the retroactive C-marking with some of the Mavic 3 models. The Mavic 3 Classic was the first drone to come with the C1 label in the box, but DJI had already introduced at least "Mavic 3" and "Mavic3 Pro".

I would not like to call this process certification. No DJI drone is in the certified category in EU. As far as I know, there are no certified-category drones in EU yet. The DJI drones are mainly open-category drones.

And between the open and certified categories there is the specific category (with more bureaucracy than in open category).

Problem is you must have an EU address to which they'd mail you the label.

An EU address may be a problem for some pilots but the most of those needing the C-label live within EU.

 

[Robert Prior]

For instance, drones under 250 grams can operate in the A1 Open Subcategory, the least restrictive.

So my Mini 3 Pro would fit into that category, but because it has a camera I need to register the drone? I gather if I register the drone in one EU country that is valid for all countries?

I'm hoping to visit France and the Netherlands next year and want to take pictures of the countryside. If anyone knows of some flight maps for those countries (usable by a nearly monolingual English speaker) so I know what areas to avoid (other than the obvious) that would be lovely.

 

[wco81]

No, DJI started the retroactive C-marking with some of the Mavic 3 models. The Mavic 3 Classic was the first drone to come with the C1 label in the box, but DJI had already introduced at least "Mavic 3" and "Mavic3 Pro".

I would not like to call this process certification. No DJI drone is in the certified category in EU. As far as I know, there are no certified-category drones in EU yet. The DJI drones are mainly open-category drones.

And between the open and certified categories there is the specific category (with more bureaucracy than in open category).

An EU address may be a problem for some pilots but the most of those needing the C-label live within EU.

Sure but they sell drones worldwide and EU attracts visitors from all over the world, including many drone owners.

How is the Mavic 3 Pro going to get a C1 label? It's over 900 grams.


I mixed up the terminology. What I meant was getting the C1 label to operate in the category which is most like what you were allowed to do before 2024.


In any event, a lot of visitors taking their drones to Europe probably are unaware of these rule changes.

So we should get some accounts on whether they were subject to fines or whatever, if there is indeed greater enforcement. Law just changed and I would think police departments deal with more immediate problems than hunting down drone hobbyists, unless they're blatant, like flying right on top of famous monuments, with hundreds or thousands of people right below.

 

[YRauste]

How is the Mavic 3 Pro going to get a C1 label? It's over 900 grams.

C2 label in the case of Mavic 3 Pro (my mistake).

In any event, a lot of visitors taking their drones to Europe probably are unaware of these rule changes.

I would not talk about rule changes, just rules coming into force. DJI (on the DJI forum) is eager to talk about rule changes in EU even though the drone directives have not been cancelled or changed. The interpretations of some things may have changed.

The way DJI treats customers outside EU in this C-label thing is strange and unfriendly in my opinion. The most straightforward approach would include the C label in all drones regardless the market they are sold in. The same way as the chargers have the CE marking (meaning the charger complies with electricity laws and standards in EU) and nobody gets upset with those labels. The drone should then adapt to the regulations of various countries (or unions of countries like EU) and maybe tell the pilot what to do to comply with the rules in effect. The latest DJI Fly version tells these things, I think.

... subject to fines or whatever, if there is indeed greater enforcement.

Enforcement of the drone rules seems a bit academic to me. Are police the right authority to control aviation rules and are they even trained to that. Do they do anything to enforce the rules of drone flying ? Maybe in crowded places with lots tourists or busy streets. The real test of rule compliance maybe when you publish something on public Youtube or similar channels.

 

[wco81]

I'm going to visit Malta next month and happened to find a store there that sells DJI drones. They even have a FAQ on their site about flying drones in Malta.

So I emailed them, asked if the drones they got in included the Class labels in the box. I asked specifically about Air 3 and Mavic 3 but he suggested I look at a Mini Pro 4 instead because it would have fewer restrictions (though as long as it has a camera, it might be subject to A1 subcategory rules).

He said that he couldn't guarantee that a box would contain the labels. But people who buy drones from them or any other EU retailer would be able to order the labels via the DJI app. Of course that doesn't help people who don't have a mailing address in the EU. Also implied is that if you buy a drone from them and the box didn't contain the labels, you were out of luck, they probably wouldn't refund an open bxo.

He also claimed that there's some grace period right now where they're not really enforcing the 2024 laws. The main thing was to get insurance and comply with their (Malta's) drone laws, which including registering with their civil aviation authority, which requires 10 or 25 Euros for a couple of months or 1 year.

 

[Aerophile]

Why all this concern about whether or not there's some label in the box? Most of us have printers at home, making labels is not particularly difficult...

 

[Droning on and on...]

Now that the Air 3 is out, that would also get a C1 label presumably, but as expected, it's missing features out of the box and the sensor is a downgrade compared to the previous top end Air model -- please don't derail this thread with talk about how the smaller sensor is "better" than the newest 1-inch sensor they could have used.

I would suggest that in the future a much better way to avoid such a discussion is to NOT state your view and than tell everyone else not to discuss it.

Asserting your view on a debatable controversy invites debate, and demanding others hold their fire is kind of unfair.

 

[wco81]

So I just returned from a trip to Malta and Italy, specifically Sicily.

I did a few flights with my Mavic 2 Pro.

Mostly tried to go to areas away from towns and in a couple of cases, were along coastal cliffs with nobody around nor a lot of buildings.

So I could easily comply with A2 restrictions, which would mean not fly within 150 meters of people or buildings.

That wasn't my intent though, just happen to go to scenic locations and at the time I flew, there were few people around.

Though in one of those cases, I took off and landed where there wasn't anyone and flew a few hundred meters to a spot over a small village, with all kinds of hiking paths so it's possible that I could have flown over people as well as some buildings, so I'd have been within 150 meters, since the most I flew was 120 meters AGL.

Unfortunately it got very windy in places I visited, winds in the high teens, gusts of 30-40 MPH so I didn't get to fly as much as I wanted.

I did fly in some more built up areas, over a couple of small towns. One of those, the DJI 4 Go app prompted me for an authorization code, as detailed in this thread.

Remote Authorization

OK, I've never encountered this with my M2P. I get a warning that a local agency would authorize the flight. I'm in Italy so it lists local Carabinieri or police. It prompts me for a phone number and I get a 6-digit code. Does that mean DJI communicated with a local authority here in Italy...

mavicpilots.com

Otherwise, I didn't see any evidence of greater enforcement or any kind of attempts to enforce these A1 vs. A2 category flying.


That isn't to say there isn't greater enforcement efforts in other EU countries but unless they get local police to proactively look out for drone fliers and they're aggressively checking for CE labels, see what kind of drones you have, where you flew from and using tools like Aeroscope constantly to look for drone flights which don't conform to these new rules, it's hard to see what has changed since these new rules took effect at the start of this year.

Maybe it's kind of like the authorities trying to cut down drunk drivers, like put in more traffic stops to do more random checks. But it's not something they can do all the time, just pick times when people are known to drink and possibly drive, such as during the Christmas/New Year's holidays and other times of the year like St. Patrick's Day.

Certainly they would have more monitoring for illegal drone flights around big events, like football matches and other events involving stadiums and big assemblies of people. But again, those are special circumstances during which they can deploy more manpower to try to look out for certain activity.

Will they do that all the time, to try to enforce these new drone laws, especially smaller towns which don't have as many resources?