The Frustration with Search and Rescue

[Phantomrain.org]

When I first bought a drone, it was to find UFOs in the clouds and for search, help, and rescue. I went as far as to create a life ring that could be dragged across the water with my drone to provide a flotation device to save a life. It all sounded good, but the reality was far different than I had imagined.

Anyone with a private helicopter or large truck to take goods were on their way, but many found their search and rescue very frustrating and many helicopter pilots were threatened with going to jail, which surprised me as I thought they were at the top of the food chain but apparently they are not.

I think the reason why I am posting this is that I could have easily been one to get a helicopter, thinking maybe then I could be a superhero one day. lol

The reality is the systems they have in place really have no room for truckers and helicopters to come in and save the day, that's not how it works. There is a very strict system put into place for both drone pilots and Helicopter Pilots as well.

Somehow knowing this makes me feel better about my drone and what is really possible. I should mention many of the pilots were police, fire, and rescue and still denied its seems were more equal than I thought.

Phantomrain.org
Gear to fly in the Rain, Land on the Water , and Capture the Adventure of the storm.

Here is the Video but there is a learning curve that needs to be understood.

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[mavic3usa]

Follow up story, a million or more people have seen this:

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[Yorkshire_Pud]

I have seen the life guards on "BondiRescue" trial a drone for dropping possibly an inflatable floatation device to guinea pig struggling swimmers. I don't know if they adopted it.
I also think a drone would be useful to them in searches for lost swimmers, bodies and sharks.
I say lost swimmers because one went missing whilst a life guard was paddling out to assist them, the life guards weren't certain whether he had swum off or sunk, it turned out he had presumably sunk, he drowned. Quite tragic circumstances really. A drone might have spotted him in time for them to resuscitate him.

 

[HoozierDroneDaddy]

The helicopter pilot was helping when there was no TFR in place at that location and with knowledge of the local airport that provided the pilot with fuel (at the time they only provided fuel to those involved with supporting the disaster). The TFR did not go in place until after the incident with the local Sheriff. The Sheriff was in charge at the location and had the authority to do what he did. Now was that a good decision, that is debatable. However, as he was in charge of operations, he should have been evaluating the situation, determining needed resources, and directing action plans. This is was his mistake in my opinion. Until a TFR was implemented and air craft was controlled by Disaster Operations, the Sheriff should have asked if the pilot had approval to be in the area, and if so, said thought have a valuable resource at my disposal. Then authorized the pilot to continue with help in LOCATING, and when possible recovery of stranded people. He made a decision which WAS his to make, IMO it could have been the other way as lives are dependent on time in a disaster.

FWI: In my previous career in the military I was a Peacetime and Wartime Disaster planner, so I do have some knowledge on disaster operations.

 

[Phantomrain.org]

The helicopter pilot was helping when there was no TFR in place at that location and with knowledge of the local airport that provided the pilot with fuel (at the time they only provided fuel to those involved with supporting the disaster). The TFR did not go in place until after the incident with the local Sheriff. The Sheriff was in charge at the location and had the authority to do what he did. Now was that a good decision, that is debatable. However, as he was in charge of operations, he should have been evaluating the situation, determining needed resources, and directing action plans. This is was his mistake in my opinion. Until a TFR was implemented and air craft was controlled by Disaster Operations, the Sheriff should have asked if the pilot had approval to be in the area, and if so, said thought have a valuable resource at my disposal. Then authorized the pilot to continue with help in LOCATING, and when possible recovery of stranded people. He made a decision which WAS his to make, IMO it could have been the other way as lives are dependent on time in a disaster.

FWI: In my previous career in the military I was a Peacetime and Wartime Disaster planner, so I do have some knowledge on disaster operations.

Excellent point about the TFR not being in place until after the fact, Who has the ability to ask for a TFR to be put into place ?

Phantomrain.org
Gear to fly in the Rain, Land on the Water.

 

[mavic3usa]

The helicopter pilot was helping when there was no TFR in place at that location and with knowledge of the local airport that provided the pilot with fuel (at the time they only provided fuel to those involved with supporting the disaster). The TFR did not go in place until after the incident with the local Sheriff. The Sheriff was in charge at the location and had the authority to do what he did. Now was that a good decision, that is debatable. However, as he was in charge of operations, he should have been evaluating the situation, determining needed resources, and directing action plans. This is was his mistake in my opinion. Until a TFR was implemented and air craft was controlled by Disaster Operations, the Sheriff should have asked if the pilot had approval to be in the area, and if so, said thought have a valuable resource at my disposal. Then authorized the pilot to continue with help in LOCATING, and when possible recovery of stranded people. He made a decision which WAS his to make, IMO it could have been the other way as lives are dependent on time in a disaster.

FWI: In my previous career in the military I was a Peacetime and Wartime Disaster planner, so I do have some knowledge on disaster operations.

Obviously we don't know the exact story but there are conflicting details and we can only go by what is said. When you have a disaster, *anybody* can be in charge and in this case, I heard it was not the Sheriff but the Assistant Fire Chief on site. Apparently this is the guy who told the pilot to go away and even though he had no arrest powers, he told the pilot if he flew his helicopter for even one more flight to try to help somebody, he would have him arrested. In other words, he would speak to law enforcement and convince the sheriff that this pilot was "interfering" since there was no TFR in place when he said that.

It was shortly after that incident that the TFR when up and into place and the assumption is this was implemented to *block* this pilot from flying to go back and pickup his stranded co-pilot or rescue another known person who was in imminent danger. The assistant fire chief and/or whomever called in the TFR appeared to care very little for the safety of the people in need (when he refused to listen) or more about his own apparent authority is the prevailing opinion from the people on the ground, one of the rescued party, and/or the other officials in the rescue organization who actually gave this pilot the permission to fly. Somebody at the top overruled this! But it didn't take long to figure out this was a colossal mistake and shortly after, not only was the TFR lifted but also this pilot and other volunteer pilots were begged to return and help rescue people and provide aid under coordination.

So ultimately, only a few people's lives were put at risk for a short period of time not including the possible days and days of this nonsense that probably occurred earlier, we just don't know. I wasn't there on the ground but my opinion is since my people around me have been somewhat coordinating with this pilot, if I had an overriding safety concern, at least I would have said ok go back and get the people you left behind only if they are imminent danger and then ground your helicopter (until we can safety integrate you if necessary). Absolutely ridiculous that threaten to jail this pilot, let's call it for what it is.

-----

But I still would have put up the TFR for the next 2 weeks because I can make exceptions for rescue pilots but I absolutely want to stop any drones from flying around anywhere in this part of the state trying to get pictures, that's for sure. You want to fly a drone, come talk to me!

 

[SethB]

There’s a lot that could be further debated about who did what, when, and why. A pilot who is freelancing and not part of incident command and airspace management is a potential liability. I myself am sympathetic to the emergency responders who are trying to make the best decisions they can under extremely challenging conditions with no sleep. Thank you to all of them, including the asst fire chief in Lure cnty. From news reports WE HAVE NO IDEA of what they were dealing with. Maybe it was a bad decision to exclude a particular helo and maybe it wasn’t. Maybe there just wasn’t time or resources to attempt to integrate this pilot when he demanded access.

The costs of untrained and unintegrated freelancers in emergency response are well known. All too often people themselves become casualties. If the TFR came into effect an hour later (than the helo pilot’s contact with responders) then attempts to control the airspace were already being made. If your county went from 2to 20 to 200 aircraft in a short time you need local air traffic control, and fast.

If you want to be involved in search and rescue operations there is a clear path. Find the local/regional SAR teams, volunteer, take the training, learn about incident command, learn about airspace management during emergency operations, and get involved the right way - before the callout. Don’t become a casualty yourself, and don’t distract managers and responders from their vital work.

 

[Phantomrain.org]

One of the best Videos I have seen, far surpassing that of the Media, as to Search and Rescue.

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Phantomrain.org
Gear to Fly in the Rain. Land on the Water.

 

[DARKSeifer]

Whenever someone gets missing in my town I just swipe the area with the drone, just in case. It's hard without thermal, but the sooner you start the better.

Once and old man went lost, I searched him for a few hours through the fields with the M3 or the Evo Lite +, don't remember the exact drone I was flying then, and I didn't find him. Official search & rescue, with helicopter (without camera or thermal), scuba divers, dogs, volunteers and so on (but no drones) started a week later. They never found him, and obviously it was too late anyway.

I have some money saved for a thermal drone for hobby and to find missing dogs and people locally. It can also be used to make money easily to find leaks and, specially, to check solar panels.

Depending on how the new M4 Thermal costs, I'll pick that or a second hand M3T (waiting for the M4 for the second hand price of the M3T to drop). The M2 Enterprise Advance with the thermal is quite affordable now second hand, but it doesn't have a telephoto and has the design flaw where the battery can pop up midflight, so I decided to skip it, same for the Dual, which has only a low res thermal camera.

Just don't wait for bureaucracy, if your son/father/mother/whatever goes missing, what would you prefer, a drone pilot that complies with the overregulation and don't fly, a S&R team that comes a week later, or that one guy that just gets the job done?

 

[hank970]

Whenever someone gets missing in my town I just swipe the area with the drone, just in case. It's hard without thermal, but the sooner you start the better.

Once and old man went lost, I searched him for a few hours through the fields with the M3 or the Evo Lite +, don't remember the exact drone I was flying then, and I didn't find him. Official search & rescue, with helicopter (without camera or thermal), scuba divers, dogs, volunteers and so on (but no drones) started a week later. They never found him, and obviously it was too late anyway.

I have some money saved for a thermal drone for hobby and to find missing dogs and people locally. It can also be used to make money easily to find leaks and, specially, to check solar panels.

Depending on how the new M4 Thermal costs, I'll pick that or a second hand M3T (waiting for the M4 for the second hand price of the M3T to drop). The M2 Enterprise Advance with the thermal is quite affordable now second hand, but it doesn't have a telephoto and has the design flaw where the battery can pop up midflight, so I decided to skip it, same for the Dual, which has only a low res thermal camera.

Just don't wait for bureaucracy, if your son/father/mother/whatever goes missing, what would you prefer, a drone pilot that complies with the overregulation and don't fly, a S&R team that comes a week later, or that one guy that just gets the job done?

Have you contacted local authorities and informed them of your interest and capabilities? Reaching an understanding with them ahead of time and securing blanket permission to participate in searches under their supervision might be a good thing.

 

[Droning on and on...]

This is very simple.

Don't stop me from rescuing people with the, "it's my job, and I'm in charge!" if you're not rescuing people.

I disagree with those defending the authorities to the extent that their "authority" is an obstacle, which it was in this case.

If there were S&R copters, planes, and drones flying around the area, the chief would have had some reason for his stopping the private S&R.

There was not. The skies were clear. He should have handed him a radio and told him to stay in constant contact and coordinate. People's lives are at risk, right now, as I write this.

All hail the Cajun Navy!!!!!

 

[Riteguy]

The helicopter pilot was helping when there was no TFR in place at that location and with knowledge of the local airport that provided the pilot with fuel (at the time they only provided fuel to those involved with supporting the disaster). The TFR did not go in place until after the incident with the local Sheriff. The Sheriff was in charge at the location and had the authority to do what he did. Now was that a good decision, that is debatable. However, as he was in charge of operations, he should have been evaluating the situation, determining needed resources, and directing action plans. This is was his mistake in my opinion. Until a TFR was implemented and air craft was controlled by Disaster Operations, the Sheriff should have asked if the pilot had approval to be in the area, and if so, said thought have a valuable resource at my disposal. Then authorized the pilot to continue with help in LOCATING, and when possible recovery of stranded people. He made a decision which WAS his to make, IMO it could have been the other way as lives are dependent on time in a disaster.

FWI: In my previous career in the military I was a Peacetime and Wartime Disaster planner, so I do have some knowledge on disaster operations.

In situations where a county is overwhelmed by a disaster, the local agency creates their own fiefdom without regard to the needs of the people they serve. This Asst Chief Chris Melton who issued the threat to arrest the helicopter pilot was protecting his turf, so to speak. Rather than having a conversation with the pilot as a valuable resource, he reacted improperly by separating the husband and wife and turning away a life saving tool. I'm happy to learn this pilot returned the following day and was able and willing to continue what he came their to do, serve the people of the area. I think we both are in agreement. Hopefully, the Sheriff and Fire Authorities can work out a future plan to incorporate volunteer resources.

I too served as an Asst Chief of Search & Rescue in California.

 

[Riteguy]

There’s a lot that could be further debated about who did what, when, and why. A pilot who is freelancing and not part of incident command and airspace management is a potential liability. I myself am sympathetic to the emergency responders who are trying to make the best decisions they can under extremely challenging conditions with no sleep. Thank you to all of them, including the asst fire chief in Lure cnty. From news reports WE HAVE NO IDEA of what they were dealing with. Maybe it was a bad decision to exclude a particular helo and maybe it wasn’t. Maybe there just wasn’t time or resources to attempt to integrate this pilot when he demanded access.

The costs of untrained and unintegrated freelancers in emergency response are well known. All too often people themselves become casualties. If the TFR came into effect an hour later (than the helo pilot’s contact with responders) then attempts to control the airspace were already being made. If your county went from 2to 20 to 200 aircraft in a short time you need local air traffic control, and fast.

If you want to be involved in search and rescue operations there is a clear path. Find the local/regional SAR teams, volunteer, take the training, learn about incident command, learn about airspace management during emergency operations, and get involved the right way - before the callout. Don’t become a casualty yourself, and don’t distract managers and responders from their vital work.

Victims of the hurricane were heard crying out for help on communications equipment and this is why he felt compelled to help. So, in your humble opinion, it is better to keep out rescue aircraft from this airspace than to allow this chopper into the area and rescue victims? Helicopters often fly under VFR and are used to it. I'm not sure how many days had gone by since the the hurricane left the area, but it was my understanding people were crying out for help up to 2 weeks after. Sure, it would be nice to be a part of a well integrated disaster action plan administered by a regional authority, but in the absence of such, I wouldn't hesitate to sit down with this pilot for 20 minutes and discuss his abilities and use him however possible.

 

[SethB]

Victims of the hurricane were heard crying out for help on communications equipment and this is why he felt compelled to help. So, in your humble opinion, it is better to keep out rescue aircraft from this airspace than to allow this chopper into the area and rescue victims? Helicopters often fly under VFR and are used to it. I'm not sure how many days had gone by since the the hurricane left the area, but it was my understanding people were crying out for help up to 2 weeks after. Sure, it would be nice to be a part of a well integrated disaster action plan administered by a regional authority, but in the absence of such, I wouldn't hesitate to sit down with this pilot for 20 minutes and discuss his abilities and use him however possible.

As I wrote above, no amount of armchair quarterbacking after the fact will be definitive in the absence of information from Lure County emergency management, who were way too busy in total mobilization to provide their side of the story in the brief “gotcha government“ news cycle. Yeah, that local investigative reporter gave the county spokesperson a real on-camera grilling in the middle of all of it.

As I also wrote above, it might have been a good decision or a bad one in the context of what else was happening! We don’t know. That emergency management did recruit volunteers the next day speaks to their engagement and awareness of needs and resources. These folks were dealing with a clusterf*** of unimaginable proportions. Cut them some slack. The wife was rescued. The couple was reunited. The helo pilot was back in the air the next day. Those are all good outcomes in this particular case.

I hope nobody reading this is ever involved in a disaster on this scale. Such an event breaks plans, structures, and decision-making.

…I too served as an Asst Chief of Search & Rescue in California.

I was part of a federally funded outreach to provide incident command training to agencies, cities, counties, and states for large scale disaster management. Events of this scale are once-in-a-career, they are multi-agency, they are managed in an Incident Command Structure in which many decisions are made in an emergency operations center.

Our training specifically addressed the difficulties of creating and executing plans for events that no one had previously experienced.

 

[BigAl07]

From someone who was ACTIVE (and sadly still am ACTIVE) during all of this and in the DISASTER area, some of these comments are infuriating to say the least.

During a DISASTER is the worst possible time for "self deploy" any AIR RESOURCES! A LOT of the details being "published" by YT Creators is wrong and very SELF SERVIING! That's a whole new level of sad and disgusting! Granted the ideas and GENEROSITY is AWESOME but with the amount of Air Assets we have been funneling into the area I'm amazed we have not YET had an AIR INCIDENT (that I'm aware of).

There were some mistakes made on the EM side of things but it's not nearly as cut & dried as our fellow YT Creators make it out to be. I'm not surprised some of yall's "Hero" with the initial KH hasn't made a video proclaiming he was there in person trying to HERO and got grounded . . .

If you want to HELP with your Drone/Helicopter/WHATEVER ASSET then get involved during NON-DISASTER and learn how to INTEGRATE safely into the Incident Management System (IMS). Anything less becomes a RESOURCE DRAIN and, to put it frankly, can put lives on the GROUND and in the AIR in harms WAY!