2 Pro Tibet Images

Dale D · Nov 5, 2020

I was just going through some old images. I shot these images several years ago while on a trip to Tibet.Unfortunately, drones were not even available at that time.

Phantomrain.org · Nov 5, 2020

I think that why they invented the do over and a great excuse to go back. . Hope you get back there dale,

Jack43 · Nov 6, 2020

Dale D said:
I was just going through some old images. I shot these images several years ago while on a trip to Tibet.Unfortunately, drones are not even available at that time.

Wow amazing photos Dale! As you say, unfortunately drones were not yet "born"

But even without a drone you shot some fantastic pics! Thumbswayup

cheers Paul

Heindrich1988 · Nov 6, 2020

Wonderful pics

Tibet is a harsh land, but partly thanks to it, it's also one of the most pristine natural environments in the world. I have a niece working in Lhasa, had a video call with her a few months ago whilst she was on a road trip with friends. Even a random stretch of the highway was stunning. I hope to visit one day.

By the way, flying drones there can be a bit tricky. The average elevation of the Tibetan plateau is 4500m. That's higher than the operating ceiling of the Mini 2. The Air 2 operating ceiling is 5000m, so you're fine until you actually climb some mountains.

That said, I know people who have flown drones there. They say the main problem is battery life. The cold and elevation seriously drains the batteries.

Drumsagard · Nov 6, 2020

Stunning images Dale! Thumbswayup

Dale D · Nov 6, 2020

Phantomrain.org said:
I think that why they invented the do over and a great excuse to go back. . Hope you get back there dale,

I doubt that I will be returning to Tibet. It is a huge country, extremely beautiful, but extremely poor and rough for traveling. We started in Lhasa, stayed at sparse Holiday Inn ( they have better hotels now), then started to drive westward, finally to Shigatse. In Shigatse, we slept in a non-heated room on plywood boards and a thin blanket. Finally exited Tibet through the "Friendship Bridge" into Nepal and drove to Kathmandu (our second visit there). Very friendly people who have been taken over by the communists Chinese. I won't go into the politics any further as the story is well known.

The elevations there were consistently around 9,000 to 10,000 feet above sea level and some of the passes were over 11,000 feet. My wife and I took Diamox (acetazolamide) to reduce brain swelling (HAPE,high altitude pulmonary edema) etc.

Heindrich1988 · Nov 7, 2020

Dale D said:
I doubt that I will be returning to Tibet. It is a huge country, extremely beautiful, but extremely poor and rough for traveling. We started in Lhasa, stayed at sparse Holiday Inn ( they have better hotels now), then started to drive westward, finally to Shigatse. In Shigatse, we slept in a non-heated room on plywood boards and a thin blanket. Finally exited Tibet through the "Friendship Bridge" into Nepal and drove to Kathmandu (our second visit there). Very friendly people who have been taken over by the communists Chinese. I won't go into the politics any further as the story is well known.

The elevations there were consistently around 9,000 to 10,000 feet above sea level and some of the passes were over 11,000 feet. My wife and I took Diamox (acetazolamide) to reduce brain swelling (HAPE,high altitude pulmonary edema) etc.

Hey Dale, I've been meaning to ask you about the trip that you mentioned on a previous thread. I put it to one side and forgot about it!

I'm guessing that the trip described above was separate to the one mentioned in this map? How long ago were these trips? Did you have any issues with getting permits to travel to Tibet as an American?

I think infrastructure in Tibet has improved a great deal over the last two decades. One of my uncles was a truck driver who regularly drove from Xi'an to Lhasa. He said the trip used to be quite perilous and took well over a week (one way). Recently my cousin drove the same trip in two days to deliver a car to his daughter. It's also been connected to the high speed rail network.

As for the politics, yeah, this isn't a political forum, so I'll steer clear, except to say that there's two sides to every story, and the "well known" story in the West doesn't paint the full picture due to China being on the wrong side of the Cold War, and more recently, being perceived as a threat to the US. As with most entrenched issues in the world, it's complicated.

Dale D · Nov 7, 2020

Heindrich1988 said:
Hey Dale, I've been meaning to ask you about the trip that you mentioned on a previous thread. I put it to one side and forgot about it!

I'm guessing that the trip described above was separate to the one mentioned in this map? How long ago were these trips? Did you have any issues with getting permits to travel to Tibet as an American?

I think infrastructure in Tibet has improved a great deal over the last two decades. One of my uncles was a truck driver who regularly drove from Xi'an to Lhasa. He said the trip used to be quite perilous and took well over a week (one way). Recently my cousin drove the same trip in two days to deliver a car to his daughter. It's also been connected to the high speed rail network.

View attachment 116672

As for the politics, yeah, this isn't a political forum, so I'll steer clear, except to say that there's two sides to every story, and the "well known" story in the West doesn't paint the full picture due to China being on the wrong side of the Cold War, and more recently, being perceived as a threat to the US. As with most entrenched issues in the world, it's complicated.

Hi Heindrich1988:

The trip was in November, 2009. At the time, the only decent hotel was the Holiday Inn, and we ate pizza, the best choice on the menu. The drive was quite arduous. We made stops in all of the famous monastery towns along the way from Lhasa to Shigatse. As we traveled westward, each of the hotel and road conditions deteriorated. I am sure that with the amazing progress of China that the infrastructure in dramatically improved now. We were in Shanghai in the 1970's and then recently in the past several years and there is absolutely no comparison. Shanghai was a dreary town with many hutongs or neighborhood villages. Now, of course, those have all been torn down and amazing elevated expressways with blue lighting have been erected. The architecture is spectacular as viewed from the Bundt.

A simple Google search revealed this comment as the first of millions of comments. "The peaceful buddhist country of Tibet was invaded by Communists China in 1949. Since that time, over 1.2 million out of 6 Tibetans have been killed, over 6000 monastaries have been destroyed, and thousands of TIbetans have been imprisoned. "

I am nearly certain that this comment will be deleted by the moderator.

Heindrich1988 · Nov 7, 2020

Dale D said:
Hi Heindrich1988:

The trip was in November, 2009. At the time, the only decent hotel was the Holiday Inn, and we ate pizza, the best choice on the menu. The drive was quite arduous. We made stops in all of the famous monastery towns along the way from Lhasa to Shigatse. As we traveled westward, each of the hotel and road conditions deteriorated. I am sure that with the amazing progress of China that the infrastructure in dramatically improved now. We were in Shanghai in the 1970's and then recently in the past several years and there is absolutely no comparison. Shanghai was a dreary town with many hutongs or neighborhood villages. Now, of course, those have all been torn down and amazing elevated expressways with blue lighting have been erected. The architecture is spectacular as viewed from the Bundt.

A simple Google search revealed this comment as the first of millions of comments. "The peaceful buddhist country of Tibet was invaded by Communists China in 1949. Since that time, over 1.2 million out of 6 Tibetans have been killed, over 6000 monastaries have been destroyed, and thousands of TIbetans have been imprisoned. "

I am nearly certain that this comment will be deleted by the moderator.

2009 was not that long ago. My uncle retired from lorry driving well before that. It's crazy to think of how awful Chinese infrastructure was just 20 years ago. In fact, even as a kid, I remember the drive to my Mum's village (in the 90s) was a long and bumpy ride that took most of an afternoon, maybe 4 hours or much longer, depending on the weather, because the majority of the way was just dirt tracks shortly after leaving the city. These became nearly impassable after heavy rain. Roads were built to the village in the 2000s. Today, that journey takes 1hr20mins by car. I guess in 2009, Tibet was still quite underdeveloped compared to the Han Chinese heartland and coast.

I am actually quite curious that you seem quite friendly towards China (you've visited three times and you like Mavic drones) whilst simultaneously believing the most extreme and biased version of events with regards to Tibet. I don't think the mods would appreciate a political debate here, so I will limit my response to pointing out that in 1950, there were only 1.2 million Tibetans living in Tibet in total, so if 1.2 million were killed in the decades since , it's hard to see how there are 12 million Tibetans living all over China today. The website you quoted from is literally called Free Tibet and is obviously a dissident/activist group. That's hardly a source of fair information.

Not saying there's nothing wrong in Tibet, but as I said, it's not that simple.

Dale D · Nov 7, 2020

Heindrich1988 said:
2009 was not that long ago. My uncle retired from lorry driving well before that. It's crazy to think of how awful Chinese infrastructure was just 20 years ago. In fact, even as a kid, I remember the drive to my Mum's village (in the 90s) was a long and bumpy ride that took most of an afternoon, maybe 4 hours or much longer, depending on the weather, because the majority of the way was just dirt tracks shortly after leaving the city. These became nearly impassable after heavy rain. Roads were built to the village in the 2000s. Today, that journey takes 1hr20mins by car. I guess in 2009, Tibet was still quite underdeveloped compared to the Han Chinese heartland and coast.

I am actually quite curious that you seem quite friendly towards China (you've visited three times and you like Mavic drones) whilst simultaneously believing the most extreme and biased version of events with regards to Tibet. I don't think the mods would appreciate a political debate here, so I will limit my response to pointing out that in 1950, there were only 1.2 million Tibetans living in Tibet in total, so if 1.2 million were killed in the decades since , it's hard to see how there are 12 million Tibetans living all over China today. The website you quoted from is literally called Free Tibet and is obviously a dissident/activist group. That's hardly a source of fair information.

Not saying there's nothing wrong in Tibet, but as I said, it's not that simple.

I, too, would love to sit down with you at dinner and have a conversation. Yes, I love visiting China. It is the most amazing country. It's beauty is spectacular, and its people are wonderful. I viewed China when entry was forbidden from an overlook in Hong Kong. We did a complete tour of eastern China on our first full trip, on our 2nd time there including Beijing, Shanghai, Chengdu,terra cotta soldiers, etc. On our third trip, we entered from Myanmar, and stayed in Kunming, then Dali Lake, and up to Lijiang and Diquing Prefecture Tibetan border.

And I do love my drone!

I would truly like to learn the full story of Tibet from your viewpoint, but this forum is not the appropriate place. I tried very much to query my Tibetan guides repeatedly but they became very fearful, lowering their voices and looking over their shoulders before speaking to me. They were not allowed, according to our US tour over-seer to have political discussions. There is certainly a human rights issue regarding China and Tibet and Huigers, and again, would love to discuss with you face to face but that is not possible. So we shall have to leave it there and just enjoy our drone issues. The US has its troubles also, I will admit as do many other nations. However, on a people to people basis, most of us wish to just get along. It is the governments who often drive these issues, and who have the power to heal these issues.

Heindrich1988 · Nov 7, 2020

Dale D said:
I, too, would love to sit down with you at dinner and have a conversation. Yes, I love visiting China. It is the most amazing country. It's beauty is spectacular, and its people are wonderful. I viewed China when entry was forbidden from an overlook in Hong Kong. We did a complete tour of eastern China on our first full trip, on our 2nd time there including Beijing, Shanghai, Chengdu,terra cotta soldiers, etc. On our third trip, we entered from Myanmar, and stayed in Kunming, then Dali Lake, and up to Lijiang and Diquing Prefecture Tibetan border.

Wow... you've traveled around China way more than I have.

I was born in Xi'an, near the Terracotta Army. I've lived in Beijing and Dongguan (kind of) since coming back to China last year. Other than that, I've been to Yunnan (Dali, Lijiang, Kunming) on a trip in 2007 and had a brief stay in Shanghai in 2001 enroute to Xi'an to visit relatives. I hope to tick Hainan island off in December if my girlfriend manages to join me from Japan. (It's pretty tedious due to COVID). We definitely want to visit Tibet at some point too, though sadly budget won't allow for both.

As for the politics, yeah, let's not test the mods too much.

Maybe we can talk in private, but definitely not suitable here.

Dale D · Nov 7, 2020

Frankly , of all of the places in China I have been to, Yunnan Province was my favorite. I loved the Impressions Lijiang Outdoor Ethnic Show so much and still listen to the CD's and sound track I purchased there. You probably can still find it on You Tube.
(Jade Dragon Snow Mountain,ethic groups,folk songs and dances
Ganhaizi Meadow,Jade Dragon Snow Mountain Scenic Area,Lijiang, Yunnan,China). The Old Town of Lijiang with the water wheel and old shops was amazing. Loved photographing the NAXI,Bai, and Yi women in their blue dresses.

Here is a You Tube I found for you. I especially love the beautiful song at 16:14. I will never forget this spectacle and the Jade Snow Dragon Mountains in the back drop.