3rd party charging hub? Filters? How long until they show up?

Ben_McPhee · Nov 13, 2021

CHARGING
Does anyone know how long it usually takes for a 3rd party charging hub to be made available for a new drone? And are they safe for the battery? Do any have advantages? (Such as charging 3 at once rather than in sequence? Or higher power to charge faster, or more things at once?). I'm not trying to save money so much as get back in the air ASAP.

Also, if they still charge in sequence, I'm kind of favouring having 2-3 chargers rather than a hub, even if it's a little more expensive. 3 batteries in a hub takes 4.5 hours (Probably longer if a controller is also charging), vs (hypothetically) 1.5 hours if charged separately.

QUESTION:
Do DJI batteries (Mavic 3 specifically if you know), charge in a linear fashion? Or Will 30 mins (1/3 charge time) give you 50% of the flight time? So that it's not worth charging the batteries to 100% in 1.5 hours if 30-60 mins gets you 20-35 mins flight time? (This shouldn't be harmful based of what I know about other LI-ION Batteries).

BATTERY BANKS
Can anyone recommend a Battery Bank that might be capable of fully charging a Mavic 3 battery (Preferably a few times, and possibly simultaneously)? ALSO... If it can Charge/Run a MacBook Pro M1 X... even better.

Looking for 2 versions.
- Airline approved (100wh), and portable.
- Beast (High Capacity), can be larger.

FILTERS
Regarding Filters, I asked this elsewhere, but how long until we see Polar Pro (Or similar) ND filters, and are they optically better than DJI, and worth the price?

Now my Rant...
The included charger (and car charger) will charge the remote and the batteries in 1.5 hours each. BUT... "longer" if you charge them together. Not sure if a higher capacity charger could have shorted charging times (safely), but surely it could have allowed the controller and a battery to charge together in roughly the same time?

I was really excited to be able to charge the batteries in the drone until I read the fine print. I thought the USB was on the battery itself. Should have known better. :/ I thought I could charge a battery on the ground while the other was in the sky, and then use 2 chargers/ports to charge 2 batteries at once (Faster than 2 batteries charging sequentially in the hub).

Using USB on the chargers is... handy, but actually a downgrade in that respect. And... there must be faster USB chargers out there anyway. At least the Cine could have gotten a solution for charging batteries faster/separately, and/or higher output chargers...

jonatious · Nov 13, 2021

Here is the list of ND filters links. They have the release date in them. Freewell ships end of this month, PolarPro seems to launch on Dec 13

Mavic 3 third party Cases & ND Filters list

I am compiling a list of third party cases and ND filters for everyone’s reference. Will update this when I find more. Post a comment if you find any that this thread doesnt have. Note that this is a US only list thread Cases Amazon FPVtosky hard shell case - $110 + $6 shipping - Amazon.com...

mavicpilots.com

slup · Nov 13, 2021

Here you have some info addressing your questions regarding charging, fast charging, charge time, single/parallel charge & 3:rd party chargers ... in general & how it applies to the DJI batteries.

First starting off with a general LiPO or LiIon battery without a BMS board ... (not a M3 battery)

Charge speed:
In order to get out max charge cycles out of a battery it should be charged with 1C ... meaning that the battery is charged with a max current equal to it's capacity, & that charge to full will take 60min. So for the M3 battery that would mean 5A charge current (the batteries capacity is 5000mAh, 77Wh) ... it will then reach full in about 60min. Usually an ordinary LiIon cell can be charged up to nearly 2C (which would require 10A & they would be full after 30min) ... but as a LiIon usually have a higher internal resistance than a LiPo battery, charging with a higher C rating than 1 will create a lot of heat which significantly shortens the batteries service life ... giving it less charge cycles. In order to care for a LiIon battery a slower charge is recommended (a below 1C charge) ... meaning that it will take longer than 60min to get it full.

Single charge vs. parallel charge:
From the above regarding charge speed & charge amperage it's no problem to parallel charge ... if you put 2 batteries, each with 5000mAh in parallel on a charger you effectively have a battery with 10000mAh capacity from the chargers view point. This means that it will require 10A charge current in order for the charger to get both batteries simultaneously to full at 60min. This is still a 1C charge from the batteries point of view.

Charger:
When charging a battery without a BMS board all pressure is on the charger ... to deliver the correct amperage, voltage & regulate both accurately & throttle down the amp towards the end of the charge cycle & balance the individual cells in the battery during the whole charge cycle ... simply put, it's not enough with a charger that only deliver enough & constant amperage & voltage, the charger needs to be more advanced than that.

Then if we look at a battery with a built in BMS board... (like you have in a M3 battery)

Charge speed:
The same applies as earlier for a battery with a BMS board regarding the charge C rating ... the exception is that the BMS decides which C rating the battery will be charged at ... you as a user can't decide that you will care more for the battery & go for a 0,5C charge (will take 2h for a full charge) or a quick charge with 2C (would reach full after 30min.) All is pre-programmed into the BMS. If a full charge on the original charger takes 1,5h ... DJI have decided to go with a slower charge below 1C to put less strain on the battery & make it last longer.

Single charge vs. parallel charge:
The same applies, with or without BMS ... more batteries in parallel only means that the charge require more amps to keep the same C rating.

Charger:
As the BMS is taking care of everything during the charge cycle... nothing besides a constant voltage & being able to deliver enough & required amperage through out the charge cycle is needed. Meaning that in order to charge a DJI battery no more than a "dumb" charger is needed.

So the take away from all this is ... in order to charge a BMS equipped DJI battery no advanced charger is needed, the only task the charger have is to deliver a constant & required voltage & being able to feed in enough amperage to keep up with the programmed C rating. If a 3:rd party charger can deliver over 20A charge current it can parallel charge 4xM3 batteries to full during 60min. And ... all talk about "Fast charging" is false, that is pre-programmed into the BMS & can't be changed by a charger.

waternut13134 · Nov 13, 2021

slup said:
Here you have some info addressing your questions regarding charging, fast charging, charge time, single/parallel charge & 3:rd party chargers ... in general & how it applies to the DJI batteries.

First starting off with a general LiPO or LiIon battery without a BMS board ... (not a M3 battery)

Charge speed:
In order to get out max charge cycles out of a battery it should be charged with 1C ... meaning that the battery is charged with a max current equal to it's capacity, & that charge to full will take 60min. So for the M3 battery that would mean 5A charge current (the batteries capacity is 5000mAh, 77Wh) ... it will then reach full in about 60min. Usually an ordinary LiIon cell can be charged up to nearly 2C (which would require 10A & they would be full after 30min) ... but as a LiIon usually have a higher internal resistance than a LiPo battery, charging with a higher C rating than 1 will create a lot of heat which significantly shortens the batteries service life ... giving it less charge cycles. In order to care for a LiIon battery a slower charge is recommended (a below 1C charge) ... meaning that it will take longer than 60min to get it full.

Single charge vs. parallel charge:
From the above regarding charge speed & charge amperage it's no problem to parallel charge ... if you put 2 batteries, each with 5000mAh in parallel on a charger you effectively have a battery with 10000mAh capacity from the chargers view point. This means that it will require 10A charge current in order for the charger to get both batteries simultaneously to full at 60min. This is still a 1C charge from the batteries point of view.

Charger:
When charging a battery without a BMS board all pressure is on the charger ... to deliver the correct amperage, voltage & regulate both accurately & throttle down the amp towards the end of the charge cycle & balance the individual cells in the battery during the whole charge cycle ... simply put, it's not enough with a charger that only deliver enough & constant amperage & voltage, the charger needs to be more advanced than that.

Then if we look at a battery with a built in BMS board... (like you have in a M3 battery)

Charge speed:
The same applies as earlier for a battery with a BMS board regarding the charge C rating ... the exception is that the BMS decides which C rating the battery will be charged at ... you as a user can't decide that you will care more for the battery & go for a 0,5C charge (will take 2h for a full charge) or a quick charge with 2C (would reach full after 30min.) All is pre-programmed into the BMS. If a full charge on the original charger takes 1,5h ... DJI have decided to go with a slower charge below 1C to put less strain on the battery & make it last longer.

Single charge vs. parallel charge:
The same applies, with or without BMS ... more batteries in parallel only means that the charge require more amps to keep the same C rating.

Charger:
As the BMS is taking care of everything during the charge cycle... nothing besides a constant voltage & being able to deliver enough & required amperage through out the charge cycle is needed. Meaning that in order to charge a DJI battery no more than a "dumb" charger is needed.

So the take away from all this is ... in order to charge a BMS equipped DJI battery no advanced charger is needed, the only task the charger have is to deliver a constant & required voltage & being able to feed in enough amperage to keep up with the programmed C rating. If a 3:rd party charger can deliver over 20A charge current it can parallel charge 4xM3 batteries to full during 60min. And ... all talk about "Fast charging" is false, that is pre-programmed into the BMS & can't be changed by a charger.

I think what he was referring to is something like the Hanatora or something similar that can charge all batteries simultaneously vs the DJI dock that charges 1 battery at a time.

slup · Nov 13, 2021

waternut13134 said:
I think what he was referring to is something like the Hanatora or something similar that can charge all batteries simultaneously vs the DJI dock that charges 1 battery at a time.

As said ... DJI batteries with a BMS only require a "dumb" charger ... Hanatora & several similar is dumb chargers, only providing enough current. They will not "fast" charge but they will get you ready faster as you can have several batteries full during a 1C charge time.

If Hanatora have one for the M3 batteries out already it will be fully sufficient & will not do anything unsafe ...

UAVquadman · Dec 4, 2021

slup said:
Here you have some info addressing your questions regarding charging, fast charging, charge time, single/parallel charge & 3:rd party chargers ... in general & how it applies to the DJI batteries.

First starting off with a general LiPO or LiIon battery without a BMS board ... (not a M3 battery)

Charge speed:
In order to get out max charge cycles out of a battery it should be charged with 1C ... meaning that the battery is charged with a max current equal to it's capacity, & that charge to full will take 60min. So for the M3 battery that would mean 5A charge current (the batteries capacity is 5000mAh, 77Wh) ... it will then reach full in about 60min. Usually an ordinary LiIon cell can be charged up to nearly 2C (which would require 10A & they would be full after 30min) ... but as a LiIon usually have a higher internal resistance than a LiPo battery, charging with a higher C rating than 1 will create a lot of heat which significantly shortens the batteries service life ... giving it less charge cycles. In order to care for a LiIon battery a slower charge is recommended (a below 1C charge) ... meaning that it will take longer than 60min to get it full.

Single charge vs. parallel charge:
From the above regarding charge speed & charge amperage it's no problem to parallel charge ... if you put 2 batteries, each with 5000mAh in parallel on a charger you effectively have a battery with 10000mAh capacity from the chargers view point. This means that it will require 10A charge current in order for the charger to get both batteries simultaneously to full at 60min. This is still a 1C charge from the batteries point of view.

Charger:
When charging a battery without a BMS board all pressure is on the charger ... to deliver the correct amperage, voltage & regulate both accurately & throttle down the amp towards the end of the charge cycle & balance the individual cells in the battery during the whole charge cycle ... simply put, it's not enough with a charger that only deliver enough & constant amperage & voltage, the charger needs to be more advanced than that.

Then if we look at a battery with a built in BMS board... (like you have in a M3 battery)

Charge speed:
The same applies as earlier for a battery with a BMS board regarding the charge C rating ... the exception is that the BMS decides which C rating the battery will be charged at ... you as a user can't decide that you will care more for the battery & go for a 0,5C charge (will take 2h for a full charge) or a quick charge with 2C (would reach full after 30min.) All is pre-programmed into the BMS. If a full charge on the original charger takes 1,5h ... DJI have decided to go with a slower charge below 1C to put less strain on the battery & make it last longer.

Single charge vs. parallel charge:
The same applies, with or without BMS ... more batteries in parallel only means that the charge require more amps to keep the same C rating.

Charger:
As the BMS is taking care of everything during the charge cycle... nothing besides a constant voltage & being able to deliver enough & required amperage through out the charge cycle is needed. Meaning that in order to charge a DJI battery no more than a "dumb" charger is needed.

So the take away from all this is ... in order to charge a BMS equipped DJI battery no advanced charger is needed, the only task the charger have is to deliver a constant & required voltage & being able to feed in enough amperage to keep up with the programmed C rating. If a 3:rd party charger can deliver over 20A charge current it can parallel charge 4xM3 batteries to full during 60min. And ... all talk about "Fast charging" is false, that is pre-programmed into the BMS & can't be changed by a charger.

DJI decided to cheap out and not include what the battery is set up to be charged at. I picked up a nice 100w that you plug into a home outlet for $69 that is so much better than what is included. But when I am in no rush.... I will use the DJI charger.

Broomy · Feb 1, 2022

For any UK flyers I've just got one of these. At £35 they seemed to be a cheap option, although as we know..'buy cheap buy twice'! So early days re reliability, but it the spec is correct and they can take a hammering I might get a couple along with the DJI charge blocks and gang charge when out working.

USB C Wall Charger - 100W 2 Port Type C Charger PD 3.0 GaN Tech Foldable PD Charger Adapter Compatible with - MacBook Pro/Air, iPad Pro, iPhone 12 Pro Max/XR/XS/SE,Dell XPS, Nintendo, Galaxy etc: Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories

Shop USB C Wall Charger - 100W 2 Port Type C Charger PD 3.0 GaN Tech Foldable PD Charger Adapter Compatible with - MacBook Pro/Air, iPad Pro, iPhone 12 Pro Max/XR/XS/SE,Dell XPS, Nintendo, Galaxy etc. Free delivery and returns on eligible orders.

www.amazon.co.uk

JohnC · Feb 1, 2022

Broomy said:
For any UK flyers I've just got one of these. At £35 they seemed to be a cheap option, although as we know..'buy cheap buy twice'! So early days re reliability, but it the spec is correct and they can take a hammering I might get a couple along with the DJI charge blocks and gang charge when out working.

USB C Wall Charger - 100W 2 Port Type C Charger PD 3.0 GaN Tech Foldable PD Charger Adapter Compatible with - MacBook Pro/Air, iPad Pro, iPhone 12 Pro Max/XR/XS/SE,Dell XPS, Nintendo, Galaxy etc: Amazon.co.uk: Computers & Accessories

Shop USB C Wall Charger - 100W 2 Port Type C Charger PD 3.0 GaN Tech Foldable PD Charger Adapter Compatible with - MacBook Pro/Air, iPad Pro, iPhone 12 Pro Max/XR/XS/SE,Dell XPS, Nintendo, Galaxy etc. Free delivery and returns on eligible orders.

www.amazon.co.uk