Definitely range issues with Mini 3 pro

[Skybuyer]

I am currently on vacation in beautiful rural Vermont. I was trying to capture early morning light and fly out towards one of the small mountains. As I live in a suburban area with lots of potential interference and inability to keep my eye on my drones very far I don’t push range at home, at all.

I am at a home, launching from an elevated deck with only a few sparse trees in front of me. I took my Mini 3 Pro up to 300 feet so I could have a clear vision of it as I flew.

As I made my first sortie, straight ahead, at 2500 feet the controller lost the drone’s signal. I brought it back and tried again in another direction. Only 3500 feet before completely losing signal. But at 2500 feet again the signal was spotty and fine control was lost.

One of the great things about the extended battery is that I never worry about running out of juice, not being able to bring my Mini 3 home. But that’s not an issue at all when the range is so very limited. I have to guess the mistake that DJI made with the Mini 3 Pro was to amputate the front legs which is where the antennae reside in their other drones. One thing is for sure; When I go to FL next month I’m taking my Mavic 2 Pro, possibly my Mini2. The Mini 3 Pro can stay at home. Bah. Humbug!

 

[ExEvo]

I am currently on vacation in beautiful rural Vermont. I was trying to capture early morning light and fly out towards one of the small mountains. As I live in a suburban area with lots of potential interference and inability to keep my eye on my drones very far I don’t push range at home, at all.

I am at a home, launching from an elevated deck with only a few sparse trees in front of me. I took my Mini 3 Pro up to 300 feet so I could have a clear vision of it as I flew.

As I made my first sortie, straight ahead, at 2500 feet the controller lost the drone’s signal. I brought it back and tried again in another direction. Only 3500 feet before completely losing signal. But at 2500 feet again the signal was spotty and fine control was lost.

One of the great things about the extended battery is that I never worry about running out of juice, not being able to bring my Mini 3 home. But that’s not an issue at all when the range is so very limited. I have to guess the mistake that DJI made with the Mini 3 Pro was to amputate the front legs which is where the antennae reside in their other drones. One thing is for sure; When I go to FL next month I’m taking my Mavic 2 Pro, possibly my Mini2. The Mini 3 Pro can stay at home. Bah. Humbug!

And yet some M3P owners are reporting much greater range. 3000ft is about the max I can get in the UK across flat, empty farmland on a windless day flying at 300ft altitude. This was using the 2.4GHz band which was a bit stronger than 5.8GHz. I might get a bit further if I flew higher - but nowhere near the claimed "up to" range. My tests so far suggest that trees and hedges, even in winter and even if they aren't obstructing LOS, are hurting the signal.

 

[slup]

... with only a few sparse trees in front of me. I took my Mini 3 Pro up to 300 feet ... straight ahead, at 2500 feet the controller lost the drone’s signal.

Now I no nothing about how it actually looked where you flew... was it just one row of trees with nothing behind or was it a forrest or other obstacles like higher houses behind them. The keyword is penetration... the further you fly away horizontally the more the signal need to penetrate if the height is constant.

Here's a sketch I made for an earlier post... easy to see that the height needs to increase gradually the further out you fly to keep LOS.

 

[ExEvo]

Now I no nothing about how it actually looked where you flew... was it just one row of trees with nothing behind or was it a forrest or other obstacles like higher houses behind them. The keyword is penetration... the further you fly away horizontally the more the signal need to penetrate if the height is constant.

Here's a sketch I made for an earlier post... easy to see that the height needs to increase gradually the further out you fly to keep LOS.

View attachment 160683

Nothing in front of me at all - as you can see from this screen recording (I subsequently pushed through the amber and red signal alerts and got to just over 3000ft before being disconnected and sent home. Imho, this is close to perfect terrain and flying conditions so I would have hoped to get a longer range (even though I will probably never use it again).
Screen recording
My range was much shorter - 1200ft - when I tried to overfly the dense woodland you can see in this recording. Only a flat empty field and approx 600ft between me and the trees which are up to 100ft tall. How does the geometry work out? I believed I had LOS flying at an altitude of over 300ft (although presumably not when I tried previously at a height of 150ft).
My main reason for questioning the M3P's ability to penetrate tree branches and foliage is that I've watched a lot of tracking videos from M3P users whose signal often seemed to break up on pretty minimal tree obstacles. And yet I can stand behind a tall wooden fence with no LOS at all and the signal doesn't break up. Go figure.

 

[Skybuyer]

I had nothing in front of me but one sparse row of barren trees. Nothing but open farm land as far as the eye can see. Alt= 300-400 ft.

I got as much or more range from my Mini 1 even with heavy tree cover in front of me in suburbia.

 

[slup]

Nothing in front of me at all - as you can see from this screen recording...approx 600ft between me and the trees which are up to 100ft tall. How does the geometry work out? I believed I had LOS flying at an altitude of over 300ft

Out from the screen recording, I see something else actually... When you come in & land you have trees just in the upper left of the screen, it looks to be right in the direction you flew & where the drone was when you turned around. The trees also seems to be very close to where you stood with the RC. The closer you have taller obstacles & the higher they are the shorter out horizontally you will reach without gaining a lot of altitude. If you aim, from where you stand, to the top of the highest obstacle in the transmission path, the drone needs to follow that angle & stay on the upper side of that aimed path. Look at the fat black arrow in my picture in post #3, put in a tree there instead of that house & you will understand. In my example you're standing just 20m away (65ft) from a 10m tall object (33ft)... & the max distance horizontally you can fly at 120m height (400ft) is just 246m (807ft) before the house starts to cover the drone up in the sky.

...signal often seemed to break up on pretty minimal tree obstacles. And yet I can stand behind a tall wooden fence with no LOS at all and the signal doesn't break up. Go figure.

It's the water in living trees that's the culprit... radio transmission wont go through water, when the trees becomes fully leafed it will be even more water in the transmission path & you will not be able to go as far behind trees as during late autumn or winter.

 

[ExEvo]

Out from the screen recording, I see something else actually... When you come in & land you have trees just in the upper left of the screen, it looks to be right in the direction you flew & where the drone was when you turned around. The trees also seems to be very close to where you stood with the RC. The closer you have taller obstacles & the higher they are the shorter out horizontally you will reach without gaining a lot of altitude. If you aim, from where you stand, to the top of the highest obstacle in the transmission path, the drone needs to follow that angle & stay on the upper side of that aimed path. Look at the fat black arrow in my picture in post #3, put in a tree there instead of that house & you will understand. In my example you're standing just 20m away (65ft) from a 10m tall object (33ft)... & the max distance horizontally you can fly at 120m height (400ft) is just 246m (807ft) before the house starts to cover the drone up in the sky.


It's the water in living trees that's the culprit... radio transmission wont go through water, when the trees becomes fully leafed it will be even more water in the transmission path & you will not be able to go as far behind trees as during late autumn or winter.

Thanks for taking a look. I think you're right that in extending my flight eastwards I brought into play the close hedgerow trees which also appear at left on take-off. I took them out of the equation for the first part of the flight by positioning myself in an uncomfortable gap in that tree line (as you can see from my movement in the compass display at 1 minute in) but I then withdrew to my driveway at around 2m33s in. However, the trees in question are rather sparse at this time of year and had no foliage. When I try that mission again I will stay forward of the nearby trees for the duration and see what difference that makes.

 

[slup]

...However, the trees in question are rather sparse at this time of year and had no foliage. When I try that mission again I will stay forward of the nearby trees for the duration and see what difference that makes.

In general you should count on that "everything" in the transmitting path will degrade the signal... if being out on the edge where the connection becomes jumpy, it can make a huge difference stepping away from anything that blocks a complete free LOS. Everything in the way will both shatter the transmission & degrade the transmission power.

If trying out the max distance, be sure to always have a totally clean LOS. If you can't try it over water (usually nothing there like trees, hedges or houses)... then check the map for possible obstacles & their height & do the trigonometry calculation before going out to fly.

If you theoretically would fly out to 5000m (3,1 miles) on a 120m height (400ft)... a hedge row 200m (656ft) in front of you will start to cover the transmission path if the hedge is 4,8m high (15,7ft). The transmission path will only be 1,37 degrees above horizontal... so you nearly aim the RC parallell to the ground.

 

[a2tomm]

My 2 cents,I live in the middle of a mountain range in Pa ,I can get 12000 feet but I am high on a bald hill .Also tree's are full of water (LEAVES DON'T MATTER)so bottom line it NOT the drone it's where you are .Mikey on Youtube got much further than a mile and he is in the middle of Philly .The Mini 3 rocks

 

[Reginald E Johnson]

I am currently on vacation in beautiful rural Vermont. I was trying to capture early morning light and fly out towards one of the small mountains. As I live in a suburban area with lots of potential interference and inability to keep my eye on my drones very far I don’t push range at home, at all.

I am at a home, launching from an elevated deck with only a few sparse trees in front of me. I took my Mini 3 Pro up to 300 feet so I could have a clear vision of it as I flew.

As I made my first sortie, straight ahead, at 2500 feet the controller lost the drone’s signal. I brought it back and tried again in another direction. Only 3500 feet before completely losing signal. But at 2500 feet again the signal was spotty and fine control was lost.

One of the great things about the extended battery is that I never worry about running out of juice, not being able to bring my Mini 3 home. But that’s not an issue at all when the range is so very limited. I have to guess the mistake that DJI made with the Mini 3 Pro was to amputate the front legs which is where the antennae reside in their other drones. One thing is for sure; When I go to FL next month I’m taking my Mavic 2 Pro, possibly my Mini2. The Mini 3 Pro can stay at home. Bah. Humbug!

I feel the same way about my Skydio 2! I won’t let fly any distance unless I’m under it!

 

[Skybuyer]

When I get home I’m going to do an extended experiment. I will launch from a 2nd floor balcony, past a single row of trees which are adjacent to a golf course. I will fly my Mini 3 out with the DJI RC. Then I will fly my Mini 2 out in the same course to see if there is any distance difference between the two birds. Then I will pair the RCN1 with the Mini 3 and repeat. I hope to see how much of the issue is the Mini 3 drone itself and how much each controller contributes to the lack of range. Perhaps I will do the same test again with my Mavic 2 Pro.

I suspect that the Issue with the Mini 3 pro and the DJI RC is that neither has external antennae. No legs on the Minin 3 pro and no arms on the DJI RC. Consequently with the DJIRC there isn’t even how of installing a temporarily mounted range extender.

This range limitation really negates most the benefits of the “plus” batteries. The only good thing with the plus batteries is that if not charged in several days, they discharge to a point, but there is still plenty of juice to fly, presumably the same time/distance as a fully charged regular battery.

 

[Suzygs1000]

I have no trouble getting out to 3.5 kms, about 12000 feet, with still good video and signal ... I live in the middle of cane paddocks, so I need to be around 300 metres at least to get good distance ... I live on the bank of the river at the top of the picture .... Yes, I could see it, I have very good eye sight ...

 

[ExEvo]

When I get home I’m going to do an extended experiment. I will launch from a 2nd floor balcony, past a single row of trees which are adjacent to a golf course. I will fly my Mini 3 out with the DJI RC. Then I will fly my Mini 2 out in the same course to see if there is any distance difference between the two birds. Then I will pair the RCN1 with the Mini 3 and repeat. I hope to see how much of the issue is the Mini 3 drone itself and how much each controller contributes to the lack of range. Perhaps I will do the same test again with my Mavic 2 Pro.

I suspect that the Issue with the Mini 3 pro and the DJI RC is that neither has external antennae. No legs on the Minin 3 pro and no arms on the DJI RC. Consequently with the DJIRC there isn’t even how of installing a temporarily mounted range extender.

This range limitation really negates most the benefits of the “plus” batteries. The only good thing with the plus batteries is that if not charged in several days, they discharge to a point, but there is still plenty of juice to fly, presumably the same time/distance as a fully charged regular battery.

Interested to see your test results - but clearly some folk can fly long distances with their M3P so the antenna design/location can't be hurting them much. I tend to subscribe to the view that the type of terrain you're flying over has a big impact on range. I'm intrigued by @a2tomm's assertion that water is the main culprit but again, there are plenty of Youtube long-range flights quite low over oceans/lakes where the moisture in the air must be quite high - and some folk have even managed long range in the rain. Your tests will be helpful.

 

[wollins]

When I get home I’m going to do an extended experiment. I will launch from a 2nd floor balcony, past a single row of trees which are adjacent to a golf course. I will fly my Mini 3 out with the DJI RC. Then I will fly my Mini 2 out in the same course to see if there is any distance difference between the two birds. Then I will pair the RCN1 with the Mini 3 and repeat. I hope to see how much of the issue is the Mini 3 drone itself and how much each controller contributes to the lack of range. Perhaps I will do the same test again with my Mavic 2 Pro.

I suspect that the Issue with the Mini 3 pro and the DJI RC is that neither has external antennae. No legs on the Minin 3 pro and no arms on the DJI RC. Consequently with the DJIRC there isn’t even how of installing a temporarily mounted range extender.

This range limitation really negates most the benefits of the “plus” batteries. The only good thing with the plus batteries is that if not charged in several days, they discharge to a point, but there is still plenty of juice to fly, presumably the same time/distance as a fully charged regular battery.

Can't wait to hear the results of these tests cause this will definitively narrow down the range issue to if its the drone or not. Its all well and good to say it's the trees, the water, the buildings, the obstacles ... where you live etc etc ... but if another drone is flying in the same conditions (water, tress etc etc etc... ) and gets better results then its obviously the drone. This is the main reason that I haven't yet pulled the trigger on the M3P yet ... these nagging range issues keep coming up again and again and you never hear/heard about these issues (generally speaking) with the earlier Minis. (my 1 and 2 were excellent in terms of range)

 

[spsphotos]

1/2-3/4 mile range is fine for me. Honestly, can't keep VLOS even at that range sometimes unless I have strobes on.

 

[a2tomm]

Interested to see your test results - but clearly some folk can fly long distances with their M3P so the antenna design/location can't be hurting them much. I tend to subscribe to the view that the type of terrain you're flying over has a big impact on range. I'm intrigued by @a2tomm's assertion that water is the main culprit but again, there are plenty of Youtube long-range flights quite low over oceans/lakes where the moisture in the air must be quite high - and some folk have even managed long range in the rain. Your tests will be helpful.

I pick local churches to fly around and in the middle of farm land .A big ole honkin tree behind one of the churches has always in the summer been a pain ,i thought that once all the leaves were gone that it would not be in the way ,,,,however leaves or not the results were the same it hindered my flight connection

 

[ExEvo]

I pick local churches to fly around and in the middle of farm land .A big ole honkin tree behind one of the churches has always in the summer been a pain ,i thought that once all the leaves were gone that it would not be in the way ,,,,however leaves or not the results were the same it hindered my flight connection

Is the tree in your LOS? Are you saying that you can fly around a church spire/tower in your LOS but not a tree? And is that sufficient evidence to prove that water is the culprit?

 

[minipro3]

My Mini 3 Pro normally only gets out about 2500 feet with trees and houses in the way, but got out 3700 feet one day.

 

[Arnold LeVine]

IMHO, watching your video, you are overreacting to the loss of ONE bar. That is NOT a total loss of connection, it is merely a lessening of the connection. When the video stops or freezes, or you get an Actual warning, then it's time to skedaddle back towards the homepoint, and you will see the bars increasing as you get closer.
If I am wrong, please, another more expert user should correct me.

 

[Skybuyer]

When I see the yellow it isn’t long before I begin to lose video signal. I know that DJI has made a big deal of Ocusync 3, but I have not experienced any difference whatsoever over Ocu 2. But the Mini 3 pro isn’t a good instrument for evaluation.