Mavic 3 Standard dynamic range in video mode

SmilingOgre · Dec 29, 2021

I've looked everywhere I can think of and can't find the answer to this question. I see where the Mavic 3 (not 3 cine) is rated at 12.8 stops of DR for still photos. What is the dynamic range for video? Sorry if this could have been done better from an existing thread but I can't find it.

Saladshooter · Dec 29, 2021

The dynamic range should be the same in video..... however to take advantage of it you will need to use D-LOG for filming and and RAW for photos.

SmilingOgre · Dec 29, 2021

SmilingOgre said:
I've looked everywhere I can think of and can't find the answer to this question. I see where the Mavic 3 (not 3 cine) is rated at 12.8 stops of DR for still photos. What is the dynamic range for video? Sorry if this could have been done better from an existing thread but I can't find it.

Ok, that prompted me to try something different in a search and I found a DJI explanation of d-log. Seems as if it may be an "almost" raw format. Maybe the d stands for digital i.e. digital-raw or faux raw? I know in Davinci Resolve the files are not read as raw but they do present a similar initial look and scope reading. I think I need to do some further testing and try to see how much highlight recovery I can achieve.

Roamer105 · Dec 29, 2021

Saladshooter said:
The dynamic range should be the same in video..... however to take advantage of it you will need to use D-LOG for filming and and RAW for photos.

Yes, you should use D-Log mainly because it records in 10-bit rather than 8-bit. 10-bit allows 1024 luminance and color graduations while 8-bit limits to 256. Of course the true benefit is only realized when the final output is a 10-bit product as well (such as HLG or HDR) and viewed on a 10-bit HDR capable display.

SmilingOgre · Dec 29, 2021

Roamer105 said:
Yes, you should use D-Log mainly because it records in 10-bit rather than 8-bit. 10-bit allows 1024 luminance and color graduations while 8-bit limits to 256. Of course the true benefit is only realized when the final output is a 10-bit product as well (such as HLG or HDR) and viewed on a 10-bit HDR capable display.

Yes, I've always shot in d-log for the extended color range/post color grading in Resolve. I just took some test footage in full manual with a portion in zebra stripes to see what kind of highlights I can pull out in resolve. More to come.....maybe.

SmilingOgre · Dec 29, 2021

Ok, I was able to recover a little bit of the overexposed area but not much. It seams like I can do much better with my BMPCC 4k which is rated at 13 stops. Very close in specs but not so close in real world results. I'm kinda doubting the advertised DR but I don't have any way to qualify that with any measurements. At least I have an idea what I can achieve.

CanadaDrone · Dec 29, 2021

Video DR is the same as still image DR (determined by the sensor's capabilities), but it isn't looked at quite the same way as people typically evaluate still photograph RAWs.

The way Log (logarithmic) footage works is a little different than a traditional RAW file. It is a non-linear (hence the term log) gamma curve that tries to give you an ideal midpoint in the DR range, with the greatest balance between shadow detail and highlight detail. Adjusting it from there simply changes the DR distribution either towards the highlights or shadows. On the M3 I believe your choices for Log are ISO 400 or ISO 800. At lower ISOs you will trade highlight DR for shadow DR and at higher ISOs you trade shadow DR for highlight DR. So if you know you are shooting a scene where you will need to try and maintain some bright highlights for example, you would probably choose a higher ISO. If you knew you would be needing to recover shadows in post, you would select the lower ISO.

Similar to a RAW file, Log footage needs to be graded as it (intentionally) looks incredibly flat, thereby giving you the greatest possible leeway in post processing.

SmilingOgre · Dec 29, 2021

CanadaDrone said:
Video DR is the same as still image DR (determined by the sensor's capabilities), but it isn't looked at quite the same way as people typically evaluate still photograph RAWs.

The way Log (logarithmic) footage works is a little different than a traditional RAW file. It is a non-linear (hence the term log) gamma curve that tries to give you an ideal midpoint in the DR range, with the greatest balance between shadow detail and highlight detail. Adjusting it from there simply changes the DR distribution either towards the highlights or shadows. On the M3 I believe your choices for Log are ISO 400 or ISO 800. At lower ISOs you will trade highlight DR for shadow DR and at higher ISOs you trade shadow DR for highlight DR. So if you know you are shooting a scene where you will need to try and maintain some bright highlights for example, you would probably choose a higher ISO. If you knew you would be needing to recover shadows in post, you would select the lower ISO.

Similar to a RAW file, Log footage needs to be graded as it (intentionally) looks incredibly flat, thereby giving you the greatest possible leeway in post processing.

All makes good sense. The video raw file I work with swings from dark to light in regard to recovery as the ISO values change. With this particular camera and file there are two native ISO's so there are basically two sets of variable recovery over two ranges of ISO's. Appreciate the response for sure. Would love to see a chart published ISO vs recovery. Black Magic does this and it is very helpful.

JohnChap · Dec 30, 2021

CanadaDrone said:
Video DR is the same as still image DR (determined by the sensor's capabilities), but it isn't looked at quite the same way as people typically evaluate still photograph RAWs.

The way Log (logarithmic) footage works is a little different than a traditional RAW file. It is a non-linear (hence the term log) gamma curve that tries to give you an ideal midpoint in the DR range, with the greatest balance between shadow detail and highlight detail. Adjusting it from there simply changes the DR distribution either towards the highlights or shadows. On the M3 I believe your choices for Log are ISO 400 or ISO 800. At lower ISOs you will trade highlight DR for shadow DR and at higher ISOs you trade shadow DR for highlight DR. So if you know you are shooting a scene where you will need to try and maintain some bright highlights for example, you would probably choose a higher ISO. If you knew you would be needing to recover shadows in post, you would select the lower ISO.

Similar to a RAW file, Log footage needs to be graded as it (intentionally) looks incredibly flat, thereby giving you the greatest possible leeway in post processing.

I would have thought that the better way to maintain bright highlights is not to change the ISO but to underexpose. I am finding the white of waves bleached out too much with my M3, (I'm sure much more than M pro), but anyway, to avoid such bleaching I usually have to shoot at -1 stop. I prefered the controls of my Mavic pro because there was a thumb wheel to change the exposure, so one could make changes while filming. Now with the M3 touch screen method, one has to release one of the controls to make a change.

Serio · Feb 16, 2022

SmilingOgre said:
Ok, I was able to recover a little bit of the overexposed area but not much.

Similarly, I have not found the Mavic 3 to be great when recovering highlights. The preview LUT doesn't seem to be an option or work, the zebras don't seem to work in DLog at all, and the histogram doesn't seem reliable either. I've continued to use a Mavic 2 as well, and found the colour there more reliable.

SkywalkerFeng · Feb 16, 2022

SmilingOgre said:
I've looked everywhere I can think of and can't find the answer to this question. I see where the Mavic 3 (not 3 cine) is rated at 12.8 stops of DR for still photos. What is the dynamic range for video? Sorry if this could have been done better from an existing thread but I can't find it.

For still images, the dynamic range is closely tied to ISO. Usually you get the highest DR at the lowest ISO. The dynamic range drops as you increase ISO.

There has been review suggesting the 4/3" sensor inside the main camera for Mavic 3 is Sony IMX 272, the same sensor for Panasonic GH5. Now if you check the dynamic range chart for GH5, it achieves ~12.8 stops of DR at ISO 100. The DR drops to ~11.2 stops at ISO 400, and ~10.3 stops at ISO 800.

I suspect these are the dynamic range you can get when shooting D-Log video (~11.2 stops at ISO 400, or ~10.3 stops at ISO 800).

SmilingOgre · Feb 16, 2022

SkywalkerFeng said:
For still images, the dynamic range is closely tied to ISO. Usually you get the highest DR at the lowest ISO. The dynamic range drops as you increase ISO.

There has been review suggesting the 4/3" sensor inside the main camera for Mavic 3 is Sony IMX 272, the same sensor for Panasonic GH5. Now if you check the dynamic range chart for GH5, it achieves ~12.8 stops of DR at ISO 100. The DR drops to ~11.2 stops at ISO 400, and ~10.3 stops at ISO 800.

I suspect these are the dynamic range you can get when shooting D-Log video (~11.2 stops at ISO 400, or ~10.3 stops at ISO 800).

View attachment 144016

Looks reasonable.

Black Magic cameras handle DR quite differently. DR remains constant to 8000 ISO. It shifts, offering more range under middle grey at lower ISO and more range over middle grey at higher ISO. Actual usable ISO goes up to about 3200 before it becomes too noisy. Counter intuitive as it is, that is how they maintain DR. It is also worth noting that this is true raw and parameters like ISO, white balance, and highlight recovery can be altered in post from file metadata.

ianwood · Feb 17, 2022

To the best of my knowledge no one has actually tested the Mavic 3 dynamic range in RAW stills, standard or D-LOG video, H.264 or ProRes. Until that happens, it is all speculative. Someone convince CineD to do it!