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Mavic Pro Filters/Shutter Speed Question

NJGlover

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I'm flying a Mavic Pro 1 and shooting in 4K30. I know the best shutter speed for 30fps is 60. I am wondering if any multiple of 60 produces the same result. I have a limited supply of filters. ND8 ND16 and CPL by Polar Pro. I like the results I get with the CPL filer, but have to run a higher shutter speed to use it. Is this all just math or is there some magic to it that makes 60 better than 120, 240, 480 etc? I am having a hard time finding NDPL filters or sale for the Mavic Pro 1.

Thanks
 
I'm flying a Mavic Pro 1 and shooting in 4K30. I know the best shutter speed for 30fps is 60. I am wondering if any multiple of 60 produces the same result. I have a limited supply of filters. ND8 ND16 and CPL by Polar Pro. I like the results I get with the CPL filer, but have to run a higher shutter speed to use it. Is this all just math or is there some magic to it that makes 60 better than 120, 240, 480 etc? I am having a hard time finding NDPL filters or sale for the Mavic Pro 1.

Thanks

You can of course set whatever shutter speed you want for any given framerate, but the reason you use 30fps and 1/60 is for a more "cinematic" look which, broadly speaking, produces motion blur most similar to what the human eye sees in day to day life.

Using too high of a shutter speed with a low frame rate makes motion very choppy - for example if you shot some ocean waves at 30fps with a 1/1000 shutter speed, the wave movement would look terrible (not smooth, very jittery).

Matching a higher shutter speed with a higher frame rate (eg. 120fps and 1/240 shutter speed) gives you the ability to capture motion extremely well, without any motion blur, and also the ability to produce buttery smooth slo-mo video down to 25% speed (or 4X slo-mo) assuming a 30fps timeline. This is why sports are often shot at 60fps. The trade off here is you lose the "cinematic" motion blur that the slower 1/60 shutter speed was giving you. It all just depends on what your desired outcome is, or what the intended end usage for the footage is. There is no real right or wrong answer as to what you should be doing.

Unless shooting at higher frame rates (like 60fps or 120fps) you typically don't want to be raising your frame rate much higher than 1/60, but there is some leeway there - if you personally prefer, say, 1/50 or 1/80, or need to set it there to get the desired exposure, it's not going to have any significant negative impact on your footage. Flying very close to something or filming a fast moving subject will usually benefit from a slight increase in shutter speed even at 30fps to avoid excessive blur, but for general footage, 1/60 is a good place to be for 30fps.

The Mavic Pro 1 has an adjustable aperture though, so it should be quite easy for you to get away with the two ND filters that you have. You probably don't want to go much beyond F5.6 before diffraction starts degrading the image quite noticeably, but if you set your starting exposure for example at F4 and the ND8, changing the aperture to F2.8 or F5.6 effectively gives you a ND4 and ND16 respectively. Same deal if you were to set your exposure at F4 and ND16 - changing the aperture to F2.8 or F5.6 effectively gives you a ND8 and ND32 respectively. I hope that makes sense.

CPL filters cut about 1 stop of light, so that is one reason why your exposure changes, but since it's not a NDPL (a combination ND and CPL), it's only cutting one stop of light instead of several like your dedicated ND filters - that is why your shutter speed is much higher. The level of polarization also affects your exposure as the drone's angle to the sun changes. Due to the way CPLs work, your exposure and the level of polarization change the moment your drone changes direction, even slightly. This makes CPLs extremely annoying to use on drones (assuming you want even footage), and you need a very specific pre-planned flight path to use them effectively. Regular CPLs are more suited for still image photography rather than video. If you want to shoot video with a CPL, you will probably want to get a ND/CPL combo filter and very carefully plan your flight path such that the level of polarization does not change during flight. With a drone, you do not have the same luxury as with a "regular" camera where all you have to do is reach forward and adjust the CPL on a lens - with a drone you have to return home and land just to make a slight adjustment to a CPL, which makes them incredibly annoying to use for many applications.
 
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The 180 degree rule (shutter one over 2 times the FPS) is just a recommendation ... no need to be constrained by it especially if you're flying more or equal to 30m away from objects (horizontally or vertically). If you pan with faster speeds or flying fast & close to objects it becomes gradually more & more important with motion blur ... also if you feel that the video looks "sticky & jittery". Using the faster frame rates (from like 60fps & up) is only important if you plan to slow sections of your video down in post ... other wise unnecessary.

Here you have flying in close vicinity to objects (sorry for the FPV:ing :) in this forum section) ... totally according to the 180 degree rule, 4K 25fps & 1/50sec shutter (ND16 on the GoPro) ... & it's on the verge to being too much motion blur ,,, would probably looked a bit better with 1/100sec instead.

 
. Using the faster frame rates (from like 60fps & up) is only important if you plan to slow sections of your video down in post ... other wise unnecessary.
This is actually not true, and is the reason why sports are commonly shot at 60fps, and why movies like The Hobbit trilogy were shot at 48fps. Some entire films have been shot at 120fps. Higher framerates capture motion much better, regardless of whether or not you intend to use the footage on a lower FPS timeline for slo-mo. You get smoother and sharper footage, and although that is not always desirable, it often is for things like sports.
 
This is actually not true, and is the reason why sports are commonly shot at 60fps...
All is said in the context of what the vast majority film with their photo drones ... most will not film faster sports so using frame rates above 60fps will not mean so much more than a opportunity to slow sections down & that you put extra demands on your storage regarding size & speed.
 
All is said in the context of what the vast majority film with their photo drones ... most will not film faster sports so using frame rates above 60fps will not mean so much more than a opportunity to slow sections down & that you put extra demands on your storage regarding size & speed.

Filming anything with action or a fast moving subject would receive the same benefits, it doesn't have to be sports. There are countless other scenarios where the user may want to do so (wildlife, vehicles, cycling, etc.) which are things people commonly film with their drones. Some people just like the look & feel of 60fps footage as well, even for scenes with little movement - it's just personal preference, there is no 'rule' per se.

All I am saying is there are plenty of reasons one might want to shoot above 30fps even if they weren't planning on doing slo-mo.

What is "necessary" depends entirely on the user's intentions and intended end usage case, and that is not the same for everyone.

The OP seemed to be asking if there were scenarios where shooting above 30fps might be worthwhile, and the answer is very much a "yes".
 
I'm flying a Mavic Pro 1 and shooting in 4K30. I know the best shutter speed for 30fps is 60. I am wondering if any multiple of 60 produces the same result.
Other shutter speeds will not produce the same result. "Best" is relative here; it really depends on what effect you want to accomplish. Just like in still photography, a shower shutter speed will give more motion blur per frame (more of a dreamy, floaty quality in video), a faster shutter speed will give less motion blur per frame (more crispy or stuttery video).
I like the results I get with the CPL filer, but have to run a higher shutter speed to use it. Is this all just math or is there some magic to it that makes 60 better than 120, 240, 480 etc?
It's all math. Like CanadaDrone said earlier, a 180 degree shutter angle (in this case 1/60 shutter speed at 30fps) generally feels natural to a viewer, but it's by no means a hard and fast rule. Shutter speed's only one of the ways to control exposure, so instead of using a faster shutter speed, you could also try turning down the ISO or working at a higher f-stop (though closing the iris will give you a wider depth of field, so depending on what you're trying to do as far as focus goes, that might be a bit of a tradeoff).
 
The Mavic Pro 1 has an adjustable aperture though

M1P / MPP has a fixed aperture, can only adjust iso and shutter.
ND filters are handy shooting outside very early / late blue hour.

I would forget the ND/PL, just get ND for the cinematic look.
PL is just a pain to get right, you'll just end up flying with them fitted 'any old how'.

The CPL might be handy to film something special over the ocean, set up right, again a bit of a pain.
That filter should serve similar to an ND partially, my CPL is about 1-1/2 stops.

I have ND4 through to ND64, the ones I use most are ND8, 16, 32.
If you shoot a lot of white beach sand in strong sun, or snow, then the ND64 might be worth considering.
Try getting an ND32 and see how those 3 serve you.

I bought NISI years ago for my M1P, served me fine.
Unfortunately they've stopped making them for the Mavic Pro / Platinum filters, only have the 'natural night' one now (which I added a while ago, hoping to try it sometime).
 
My mistake, thank you for the correction - for some reason I was thinking of the P4P when I was replying.

I thought it might have been a mix up with the M2, which does have the variable aperture.
All good.
Be nice to see more drones with the better camera flexibility and filters only needed for special shots.
 
...there are plenty of reasons one might want to shoot above 30fps even if they weren't planning on doing slo-mo.

I said above 60fps ... going above that for... as I also said, general needs for the vast majority is not necessary. Just take a look at the "Photo & Video Showcase " section here at the forum. Filming landscapes from 50m height doesn't require 120fps. But going with 60fps (if your camera have that possibility) for general needs makes sense as you always have the possibility to slow thing's down slightly without planning for a slow motion shot.

What is "necessary" depends entirely on the user's intentions and intended end usage case...

No one is disagreeing with you there to the degree that you need to state the obvious ... all tools in the toolbox have it's suitable use, but some is more suitable for general use & others for more specialized tasks.

The OP seemed to be asking if there were scenarios where shooting above 30fps might be worthwhile, and the answer is very much a "yes".

Here you totally misunderstands the OP's question ... he's not asking about frame rates, the question is if it's OK to go with multiples of the shutter speed required for 30fps according to the 180 degree rule. He have a Mavic Pro1 & it has 30fps as the highest fps if not going down in resolution to 1080P or 720P.
 
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