Suggestion to DJI.. Min Alt Setting..

[LoudThunder]

With the Mini 3 Pro yes that will be being displayed by DJI Fly.

Wow, Cool!!! How high will the sensors provide feedback before they don't issue this notice? How responsive is the warnings. Is it responsive enough to use while flying?

For example, One of the areas that I fly in has a gentle uphill rise, perhaps two feet per 100'. Before I realized this the first time, I was flying there at about 5' AGL and did not realize that the ground had this gentle rise and due to the play of the shadows on the ground I did not realize that I was about to clip grass. Luckily I did notice the screen was practically all grass and stopped before I turned my little bird into lawn shears…

Finally, do the sensors work over water as I believe that is what started this thread…

 

[dirkclod]

My Mini2 with the DJI Fly App does not give such a warning. In your signature, it says you are now flying a DJI Mini 3. Did that RED Warning, "Downward 6.5 ft" come from the Mini 3's Fly App, some additional software you may be using (like Litchi), or did you edit your photo to show the distance?

Yes it does.No it’s there I didn’t edit it in. Shows it when I first left off and landing. I made a screen recording and will look
back at it to be sure.

Edit..it shows this when I took off but not when I landed back at truck.

 

[dirkclod]

Yes it does.No it’s there I didn’t edit it in. Shows it when I first left off and landing. I made a screen recording and will look
back at it to be sure.

Edit..it shows this when I took off but not when I landed back at truck.
View attachment 155718

Now it might have shown it if I had got that low in that hollow but didn’t get that low.

 

[Elthree]

Wow, Cool!!! How high will the sensors provide feedback before they don't issue this notice? How responsive is the warnings. Is it responsive enough to use while flying?

I don't fly with one of those myself, but I would not rely on it.
It's showing the ESTIMATE of distance available to APAS.
But how precise it is can depend on tiny details such as the shape of the obstruction it's close to. This is going to affect "ground" surfaces as much as trees in front, etc.

Finally, do the sensors work over water as I believe that is what started this thread…

I think the consensus is that they're not reliable.
It's going to depend on the surface patterns/reflectivity if nothing else. Do keep in mind that it's not relying on the visible light spectrum, but even so sometimes tech being "smart" gets it into a hole.

 

[dirkclod]

Yes it does.No it’s there I didn’t edit it in. Shows it when I first left off and landing. I made a screen recording and will look
back at it to be sure.

Edit..it shows this when I took off but not when I landed back at truck.
View attachment 155718

LT after I just relooked at the screen recording it did show when I was landing. I’d have to transfer this to my iMac Editer to really catch it where it started but this is when I was landing.

So it does show. Need to go back and do it again and try to land on a shooting house down there but if I mess up walking back up that hill will kill me

 

[lookout]

I don't fly with one of those myself, but I would not rely on it.
It's showing the ESTIMATE of distance available to APAS.
But how precise it is can depend on tiny details such as the shape of the obstruction it's close to. This is going to affect "ground" surfaces as much as trees in front, etc.


I think the consensus is that they're not reliable.
It's going to depend on the surface patterns/reflectivity if nothing else. Do keep in mind that it's not relying on the visible light spectrum, but even so sometimes tech being "smart" gets it into a hole.

Even though the quad should fit in a small landing space, it can vary as much as 5 feet or that you need to guarantee at least that much in case of error or misjudgement of surroundings. Water does tend to suck the quad down into it.

 

[vandemonian]

The first response in post #2 by @old man mavic says it all.

These drones do not have the capability to do anything like what you envision nor will they ever. As with all of the safety features such as vision sensors, sonar, cameras and whatever else - these are not capable of keeping your drone 100% safe in leu of a pilot being keenly aware of their drones' surroundings.

Not to turn this thread into a VLOS discussion (there are 100s already), but VLOS does not require you to stare at the drone constantly. In your case, a quick look around with the camera could/should have been performed to make the determination that your drone was close to the ground.

I do real estate photography and many times, to get the shot we have to place our cameras (drone), in places like between branches under trees, between powerlines or next to other structures and more just to get the framing right - without seeing the obstruction we are flying next to. There is simply no tech I would trust to do this currently on any commercial drone, indeed the current tech would prohibit and limit my access - so for this reason we never use any OA other than what our owns eyes can see directly or through the camera, and sometimes both.

View attachment 155708

It seems it not for you then.
And your described own use (Real Estate) is a long way from the "use situation" I described which leads me to believe you didn't read much more than the first line of either of my posts.

Also, the idea was not to obtain a 100% security.. it was about assistance not Automation!

And there are sufficiently accurate barometric altitude sensors onboard already along with GPS referencing that is constantly being updated in the logs (I know because I have spent enough time reading them to understand the incident) to know relative height to Take Off Point and indeed a reasonably accurate altitude.

With these "current knowns" the processing power to compare those readings against a known or SET (T.O.P. height) integer is minuscule and easily programed to alert IF the value falls below the set point and create an alert. This already happens when your drone reaches Max (set) Altitude so that would appear to refute your claim that its beyond capability and always will be. It is simply an inverse of that existing capability.. it may have to come with a caveat that it can not be relied upon for all situations and has limitations to only provide Pilot Assistance in specific situation but if you READ FULLY the existing caveats in the DJI manual on Obstacle Avoidance it is clear assistance is only assistance and not 100%.

Chris

 

[TwoSticks]

I think you have a valid idea that would be helpful to avoid unexpected contact with the ground. You tell the drone, without confirmed input, never get closer than a foot above the surface. If it did that, you could hold the stick in the downward position and run along the surface 12" above following the contour of the ground.

You would think the current proximity sensors would do that and to some extent they do but even with those, you may still contact something. They are not powerful enough at this time to reliably avoid everything you encounter and I dont think DJI would claim they are with a setting limiting minimum ground clearance. I get where you're going through and think it's possible to do just not with what we have available.

As it is, the zero point in elevation is your takeoff point. The rules for elevation are not based on elevation but height above the surface. At 1000' elevation when you take off you are allowed up to 1400' (1000' plus the allowed 400') baring any other rules for the area. The display will only show 0-400 in my example because it's counting from take off so you cannot count on that reading for what you want. Likewise, if you take off from a cliff and fly over a canyon, you might only see 50' in the display but be breaking the 400' rule because you are more than 400' above the canyon floor.

Bottom line. Yes, your idea is a good one and if possible I have a feeling would already be implemented. It's included somewhat in the Avata but I can still fly it right into the ground without too much complaint from the drone. A warning on the display about elevation but it does not stop me because it does not assume to know if that is exactly right.

 

[Ty Pilot]

It seems it not for you then.
And your described own use (Real Estate) is a long way from the "use situation" I described which leads me to believe you didn't read much more than the first line of either of my posts.

Also, the idea was not to obtain a 100% security.. it was about assistance not Automation!

And there are sufficiently accurate barometric altitude sensors onboard already along with GPS referencing that is constantly being updated in the logs (I know because I have spent enough time reading them to understand the incident) to know relative height to Take Off Point and indeed a reasonably accurate altitude.

With these "current knowns" the processing power to compare those readings against a known or SET (T.O.P. height) integer is minuscule and easily programed to alert IF the value falls below the set point and create an alert. This already happens when your drone reaches Max (set) Altitude so that would appear to refute your claim that its beyond capability and always will be. It is simply an inverse of that existing capability.. it may have to come with a caveat that it can not be relied upon for all situations and has limitations to only provide Pilot Assistance in specific situation but if you READ FULLY the existing caveats in the DJI manual on Obstacle Avoidance it is clear assistance is only assistance and not 100%.

Chris

Chris, I did indeed read everything in both posts and you're right, I'm not a fan of OA on commercial drones.

The point I was making is what I believe to be an over-arching principal when it comes to drones, and is one of the primary reasons for most if not all crashes, and that is loss of situational awareness by the pilot.

Maintaining situational awareness is critical to all phases of flying because we as UA pilots are disconnected from our cockpit and bombarded with distractions. You said:

'I was flying a (long distant but visual) "C" shaped course and had just lost clear vision so started my turn to return to HP but during the turn back I was also unwittingly decreasing throttle but without looking at the screen to see the reducing Alt or the approaching water I was set for disaster'

This is your own description of you loosing SA. We've all done it, and those who haven't, will at some point. In both of your posts you mention that you are flying VLOS and wanting to maintain that, but seem to think checking the screen breaks that rule - it does not. As I mentioned there are many threads where this has been discussed and looking at the screen so as to build or maintain situational awareness is allowed.

As to your idea of having a built-in alarm to notify you if you're going too low? I see why it could be seen as helpful, but I am of the opinion that when we off-load part of our duties as pilots and rely on automation, we loose just a bit of our own skill and ability to do so.

In your first post you asked for others' thoughts and these are mine.