Visual Observer...

R.Cowan · Jul 5, 2023

I personally use a VO on almost every job or recreational flight. My wife enjoys going out with me and has kept me out of a tree or a power line more than once.

TigersFan · Jul 6, 2023

I really benefit from having my visual observer with me every time I fly. She has better eyes than I do and is always able to tell me where the drone is when I look down at my controller for an instant. Lights do little good over the marsh in broad daylight but she can always spot the drone (she never looks away from it). It looks like VO's may be hard to come by, so I count myself a lucky man.

Droning on and on... · Jul 6, 2023

@TigersFan you are very lucky. Most people I've dealt with on this issue find the VO activity about as boring as watching paint dry.

Is your VO willing to perform this duty for an hour or two, 3-4 times a week?

Torque · Jul 6, 2023

mightypilot2000 said:
Is your VO willing to perform this duty for an hour or two, 3-4 times a week?

Yes.
MP2000: "wow, you are really fortunate! Is your VO willing to stand in the sun with no shade for 2-4 hours 2-4 days per week?"

Yes.

MP2000: "Well you are truly blessed!. But..is your VO willing to stand barefoot in a bed of fire ants for 3 hours to 4 hours even one day a week?"

LOL, you just going to continue to change the parameters until you get the answer you want?

TigersFan · Jul 6, 2023

mightypilot2000 said:
@TigersFan you are very lucky. Most people I've dealt with on this issue find the VO activity about as boring as watching paint dry.

Is your VO willing to perform this duty for an hour or two, 3-4 times a week?

Yes. She is very devoted and enjoys our time together. She is my lovely wife! I will admit I usually can only get one battery's flight before she has had enough. But, that's better than not doing it at all. Even so, she is willing to go go several times a week. I am lucky.

Gary C · Jul 8, 2023

GregS said:
Mid June I bought the white goggles for my P4P and Mavic Pro. Have yet to fly with them due to not having anyone to be my VO. The people I know are just not interested in doing such a thing. Not even my wife. I haven't asked, so maybe I should. Might be surprised.

Take her out to dinner afterwards?

JoelP · Jul 8, 2023

tuliofotos said:
Well, usually paid jobs may require a VO. For example: when you do a visual examination of an exterior of a building, you can't be running around chasing the drone, so you'll put someone on the other side of the building just to make sure you'll don't crash it when the pattern you designed is run by the app. I think most of the VO will be paid people for jobs where you'll need to protect your gear...

If my memory serves me correctly from when I studied for my Part 107 ticket a VO needs to be able to communicate with the PIC without any device like a phone or radio. Am I mistaken? That would make such a flight around a building impossible. The only work around that seems legal is to have a VO near you and a second crew member on the other side of the building.

JoelP · Jul 8, 2023

mightypilot2000 said:
...is a bigger fable than The Emperor Wears No Clothes.

Discuss.

My solution is to fly with a partner. We never fly at the same time and can easily be a VO for each other. When flying in remote locations over a long distance it can be a challenge to keep our drones in sight even with binoculars, but a strobe helps.

tuliofotos · Jul 24, 2023

JoelP said:
If my memory serves me correctly from when I studied for my Part 107 ticket a VO needs to be able to communicate with the PIC without any device like a phone or radio. Am I mistaken? That would make such a flight around a building impossible. The only work around that seems legal is to have a VO near you and a second crew member on the other side of the building.

I'm in Brazil, so Part 107 doesn't apply here, we have our local aircraift rules. But most rules are international, so I thought it would be strange not to allow this on the US and did a quick search:

Advisory Circular 107-2 on Section 107.33 Visual observer.
(...)
To make this communication possible, the remote PIC, person manipulating the controls, and VO must work out a method of effective communication, which does not create a distraction and allows them to understand each other. The communication method must be determined prior to operation. This effective communication requirement would permit the use of communication-assisting devices, such as a hand-held radio, to facilitate communication from a distance."

https://www.faa.gov/documentlibrary/media/advisory_circular/ac_107-2.pdf

Droning on and on... · Jul 24, 2023

@tuliofotos correct about the use of radios. However, in the US the VO must be able to see everywhere the PIC can see – the VO is not allowed to be an observer down in a canyon standing on the rim, while the PIC can not directly see where the VO can.

There are very few environments where the VO can see everywhere the PIC can while far enough away to need a radio to communicate. Pretty much only flat, open terrain.

tuliofotos · Jul 24, 2023

mightypilot2000 said:
@tuliofotos correct about the use of radios. However, in the US the VO must be able to see everywhere the PIC can see – the VO is not allowed to be an observer down in a canyon standing on the rim, while the PIC can not directly see where the VO can.

There are very few environments where the VO can see everywhere the PIC can while far enough away to need a radio to communicate. Pretty much only flat, open terrain.

Here in Brazil the focus of the legislation is on the drone itself. So you don't need to see the VO, but at anytime one of the two must have the drone in sights, without visual aids (other than regular glasses, if it's the case.

So if you fly to the border of the canyon and the VO confirms that he is seeing the drone, you go on flying with the screen aid and the VO will be in charge of notifying traffic, harms and other stuff. There are more uses here...

Droning on and on... · Jul 24, 2023

tuliofotos said:
So if you fly to the border of the canyon and the VO confirms that he is seeing the drone, you go on flying with the screen aid and the VO will be in charge of notifying traffic, harms and other stuff. There are more uses here...

Can't do that here.

VOs are used when the PIC may need to be focused on what the drone is doing to the exclusion of proper scanning of the skies, FPV being a special case. At no time should the VO call out the need to react to something in the area should the pilot not be able to fully see the drone and the hazard and react.

The VLOS requirement in the US rules out having the drone out of sight of the PIC. The VO provision doesn't change that, and seems mostly aimed at FPV.

Robert Prior · Jul 24, 2023

mightypilot2000 said:
The VLOS requirement in the US rules out having the drone out of sight of the PIC. The VO provision doesn't change that, and seems mostly aimed at FPV.

The Canadian rules are somewhat different, mandating both VLOS and a maximum horizontal distance of 500 m. There are exceptions if you have a SFOC:

Fly your drone beyond visual line-of-sight

How to fly your drone beyond visual line-of-sight

tc.canada.ca

The role of the visual observer is defined in section 3.2.8 of the Aeronautical Information Manual:

https://tc.canada.ca/sites/default/files/2020-10/aim-2020-2_rpa-e.pdf

I assume the FAA has similar documentation.

Mazdaman323lx · Aug 31, 2023

Ok can I jump in here with a question ? If I fly 2km away , can I use a visual observer(s) , and heres the kicker , does said visual observer(s) have to be clearly viewable in the video ?

tuliofotos · Sep 5, 2023

Mazdaman323lx said:
Ok can I jump in here with a question ? If I fly 2km away , can I use a visual observer(s) , and heres the kicker , does said visual observer(s) have to be clearly viewable in the video ?

I don't know... There is an american, a canadian and a brazilian discussing different laws right now... Just saw that you are irish! I don't know if it's much use what we figured out