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When the competition plays by their own rules.

The Rolling Drones

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We go through the process of getting our part 107 and follow FAA regs, but what is the advantage when it seems like a such a large percentage of people offering drone service either don’t care about the rules or don’t know there are any. Real estate agents who do their own photos without a Part107, night flying without waiver or lights and the most common flying over people. I was just watching this guy’s wedding reel and he is 5 ft directly above the smiling bride and groom, props artfully blowing the veil.
 

Meta4

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We go through the process of getting our part 107 and follow FAA regs, but what is the advantage .....
There is no "advantage" and it's probably best not to think it might be.
If everyone got their 107, there would still be no advantage.
It's a crowded marketplace and you just have to compete on the quality and price of your work.
 

dirkclod

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. I was just watching this guy’s wedding reel and he is 5 ft directly above the smiling bride and groom, props artfully blowing the veil.
Don’t know as I am not a 107 holder and you didn't post a link to that so don’t know just what you saw but if he was hired by said the couple and wanted that and was aware
would that not be legal ? Just a question as I don’t know.
Maybe @BigAl07 will see this and can add some info on
it.
 

superstarpup

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Don’t know as I am not a 107 holder and you didn't post a link to that so don’t know just what you saw but if he was hired by said the couple and wanted that and was aware
would that not be legal ? Just a question as I don’t know.
Maybe @BigAl07 will see this and can add some info on
it.
are you asking if it’s legal to break regs if someone pays you to? The answer would be “no.”
 

superstarpup

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It's a crowded marketplace and you just have to compete on the quality and price of your work.
same problem with traditional photography, once prosumer equipment became reasonably cheap and easy to operate, every other person with a dslr suddenly became a “photographer.”
 
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dirkclod

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are you asking if it’s legal to break regs if someone pays you to? The answer would be “no.”
Like I said I don’t have a 107 and didn’t know if what I quoted
you was allowed if they like signed a waiver or whatever.
Was just a question and you just gave it to me and sure
BigA will confirm it. Or not.
Nothing personal but I kinda go by what he says on 107 matters as I know he has wayyy more knowledge then anyone I know .
 

Chip

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We go through the process of getting our part 107 and follow FAA regs, but what is the advantage when it seems like a such a large percentage of people offering drone service either don’t care about the rules or don’t know there are any...
Like construction contractors who get the license, insurance and surety bond and pay state payroll taxes and compete against those who don't. But, the penalties seem to be increasing in severity around here and many people now know to ask whether the person they are hiring is licensed and bonded. Might take a while for similar level of regulation and knowledge to develop but my hunch is it will eventually.
 

anzacjack

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also not an expert on your 107. But our rules here apply to a 30m rule from anyone no involved in the opertion of the mission. If the couple being photographed are briefed, and are included within the flightplanning, then i dont see that this is illegal. Maybe not advisable to be in such proximity, but i dont think it automatically seen as a breach of the law. More information would be required to make that claim.
 

BigAl07

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We go through the process of getting our part 107 and follow FAA regs, but what is the advantage when it seems like a such a large percentage of people offering drone service either don’t care about the rules or don’t know there are any. Real estate agents who do their own photos without a Part107, night flying without waiver or lights and the most common flying over people. I was just watching this guy’s wedding reel and he is 5 ft directly above the smiling bride and groom, props artfully blowing the veil.
Whew that's a lot for one post but let's break it down into specific sections:

We go through the process of getting our part 107 and follow FAA regs, but what is the advantage when it seems like a such a large percentage of people offering drone service either don’t care about the rules or don’t know there are any.
It's a complex environment right now to say the least. While the vast majority of Part 107 operators do follow the rules there will always be some who think:

  • A) the rules are over bearing and impossible to follow so why try
  • B) the rules aren't realistic so why follow them
  • C) the FAA isn't properly staffed to be able to handle Part 107 regs so there's no need to bother trying
All of the above are total BUNK and should be avoided across the board.

Also at the same time there are genuinely some people who don't know what the rules/regs are and don't even know they are breaking them. Keep in mind you could literally go to the store, swipe your credit card, go home, read the Quick Start Guide, and be flying in an hour with out ever being exposed to the rules & regulations.

Each and every single one of us (hobby or commercial) need to step up and be Ambassadors for our industry and try to spread the knowledge to those who are new or uneducated.

Real estate agents who do their own photos without a Part107, night flying without waiver or lights and the most common flying over people.
Best thing I can say here is:

Is you think you see someone who is genuinely violating a rule/regulation then you can either try to open a friendly line of communication with them or take the time to report them to the FAA. You can initiate this by going to the following link and selecting the option that best fits the situation:

I am 100% for either (or both) of the options above and have done both.

I was just watching this guy’s wedding reel and he is 5 ft directly above the smiling bride and groom, props artfully blowing the veil.
That sounds like a DIRECT violation of Part 107 regulations and definitely should reported if you have sufficient evidence to it. Here-say isn't enough and a waste of resources.

While I 100% think you should (and I DO this too) report violators, trying to find fault with your competition is honestly taking time and effort away from your business. Spend more time increasing your skill set, improving your processes, and making yourself stand out from the crowd.

Under Part 107 there is no "approval/allowance" for anyone to fly over a person unless:

A) They are part of the flight crew responsible for the SAFETY of the flight
or
B) The RPIC is been issued ~§ 107.39

Nothing else is acceptable under Part 107 (currently)/

 

BigAl07

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Thank you BigA. That’s what I was asking as far as him being over their heads. Thumbswayup
No problem....

It's a common misconception that someone can sign a form and "Waive" your responsibility much like a liability wiaver on a ride or zip line etc. No one can "allow" a Part 107 opertaor to bust the FAR's.

I think some of the confusion comes from back in the Section 333 Exemption where we could apply for a Closed Set Exemption and everyone "On Set" had to have signed a form stating they understood the operation and approved of it. That's not the case under Part 107. Flight Crew and only Flight Crew. For those who want to fly over people you gotta get the waiver, a Public Use COA (like we use for Emergency Services CAN allow flights over people but it has to be written in specifically stating such it's not assumed), or you can still get a Section 333 Exemption for Closed Set Operations in some difficult instances.
 

BigAl07

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But it can be done like in the instance of him over there heads with all the proper paperwork ?
That’s what I was getting at.

If the RPIC holds a 107.39 for that exact instance operating the aircraft in accordance to the details of the 107.39 then yes it can be done.

While yes it's possible they had the proper papers to do such it's also possible I'll be flying to the moon later today but not likely. I'd say it's pretty safe to drop a dime on that photographer with the FAA.
 

pmshop

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RickinWaST

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Unless it was missed...Part 107.39 also stated one can not fly over a moving vehicle.
 

Bigbird48

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I wonder way back about the TED guy future of drones video flying a whole bunch of drone over the audience of a few hundred people. How legal was that. Did all those people sigh a wavier saying its ok :rolleyes::confused::oops:
 

Cymruflyer

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same problem with traditional photography, once prosumer equipment became reasonably cheap and easy to operate, every other person with a dslr suddenly became a “photographer.”
Exactly, as a professional photographer, we have a saying... what's the difference between a Pro photographer and a large Pizza? A large pizza can feed a family of four!
 

dronerdave

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Also at the same time there are genuinely some people who don't know what the rules/regs are and don't even know they are breaking them. Keep in mind you could literally go to the store, swipe your credit card, go home, read the Quick Start Guide, and be flying in an hour with out ever being exposed to the rules & regulations.


That's were I was a few years back. A buddy had a P3 and showed me what it could do. I was totally impressed with the camera and how it flew especially how far he could go. Yes he was way beyond VLOS and my first thought was he's like a horse with blinders on trotting around in the sky. This was outside a small active airport. I asked "you can fly like this by an airport"? His response was "I don't know". Well I had to have one and waited until the Mavic Pro came out. During that time I lurked around here and became more aware of flying in NAS. But back then there were arguments about gray areas in the rules with Recreational flight. Maybe a set of suggestions came with the instructions of my MP about the rules but by the time I had mine, I was a little more savvy. I actually learned more after joining the AMA. Today I wonder about all the parents and kids out flying like my buddy did. If the Mavic Mini pans out to be another quad that flies BVLOS it might add some fuel to the fire. We'll see.
 
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