Near miss with helicopter at South Hollywood beach, Florida.

[sar104]

Fixed wing pilots actually enter stalls for practice. NOBODY auto-rotates to the ground for practice...thats called crashing.

Sure they do. Not all helicopters, especially large ones, are taken all the way to landing in auto-rotation practice, but others are landed.

 

[Weaponized]

Engines off?

Sure they do. Not all helicopters, especially large ones, are taken all the way to landing in auto-rotation practice, but others are landed.

 

[sar104]

Engines off?

Throttle down to idle. Same effect.

 

[Weaponized]

Throttle down to idle. Same effect.

You can recover/abort then?

 

[sar104]

You can recover/abort then?

Abort before the flare or take it all the way to the ground. There are dozens of YouTube videos of autorotation practice landings if you want to watch. It's a required part of getting a pilot license.

 

[Thwyllo]

You can recover/abort then?

For a distance yes, but you've put the machine into a steep dive in order to get airflow through the rotors and this needs to be done from several hundred feet as I said before. There is a point of no return as regards aborting but an experienced pilot can slide it in on its skids like a butterfly.

Everything you've said about the point of a helicopter is correct but there are risky parts of the envelope that are best avoided unless necessary and flying along at 200ft above the coast as if you're Magnum PI is one of them.

 

[Thwyllo]

Just to be clear about how important this height issue is, in the event of no action, an engine failure or tail rotor failure will both result in a very serious accident with injury or loss of life as a consequence. Getting the helicopter into autorotation (like an autogyro) can result in a safe or at least survivable landing in both cases, but you need height (and thus time) to achieve it - usually of the order of several hundred feet.

Fly any lower than that recommended height, which can differ between models, and it's like driving a car at 150mph with no seat belt. Great while you can get away with it...

 

[sar104]

Just to be clear about how important this height issue is, in the event of no action, an engine failure or tail rotor failure will both result in a very serious accident with injury or loss of life as a consequence. Getting the helicopter into autorotation (like an autogyro) can result in a safe or at least survivable landing in both cases, but you need height (and thus time) to achieve it - usually of the order of several hundred feet.

Fly any lower than that recommended height, which can differ between models, and it's like driving a car at 150mph with no seat belt. Great while you can get away with it...

However, in this scenario (450 ft AGL, > 30 knots) he was certainly within guidance for that aircraft:

 

[Thwyllo]

Shush!

 

[Fried Eagle]

Warning timeframe is very situational ... just this morning I was flying over a rocky coastal location, no where near any buildings, infrastructure or people, CAVOK. Flight was probably no more than 20m AGL at any time and VLOS all the time. I had packed up and about to depart, but taking a few iPhone snaps of the landscape / scenery. A Robinson R44 suddenly appeared over a nearby rocky headland, looked like it was flying close to a normal cruise speed, and within 3-4 seconds flew directly over where I had been flying my MP only 5 min before. I estimate the helo was less than 120m AGL - I've had the MP to 120m (max legal alt in Australia) plenty of times, and have flown fixed wing AC at 500' along a coastline, so I feel I have an educated / experienced estimate. There was no significant noise to muffle the sound of the helicopter (minor wind / wave sound), I was actually looking in the relevant direction at the time. My first thought was "geez, if I'd still been flying and up at 120m, that thing would have gone UNDER my MP before I'd have time to react". The simple fact is that aircraft, approaching at the speed and altitude and heading it was, partially hidden by nearby terrain until last few seconds, was impossible to see with adequate warning time to make avoidance manoeuvres if I'd still been flying.

In the states if you collided it would be your fault. Don't know the rules is your beautiful country. The Feds would have said you flew it and you couldn't see over the hills. I know, I know.

 

[Fried Eagle]

Using this same logic... Recreational flying should be banned completely. They fly over property and people don't they? The whole concept of rotary wing aircraft are to be able to operate low, slow, hover, takeoff/land vertically. Again I not questioning whether or not the helicopter was authorized to be where it was but this whole idea is that they must operate only in areas where they can auto rotate is the goofiest thing I've ever heard. It can be argued that flight is an unnecessary risk. I know quite a few guys that survived helicopter crashes but I know of far more that didn't. Auto-rotate is not some kind of magic parachute that prevents the smoking hole.

Fixed wing pilots actually enter stalls for practice. NOBODY auto-rotates to the ground for practice...thats called crashing.

Well then you would have to ban, pipe line patrol aircraft, fire bombers, crop dusters, the list goes on.

 

[Fried Eagle]

This is not a commentary on whether or not the chopper was where it was supposed to be BUT... A helicopter has to fly through the zone you describe as "not safe" every time they take off and land. How do you propose they avoid it?

You don't fly helicopters do you? Are you a licensed pilot?

 

[Fried Eagle]

SAR104, I agree. I checked the location on Google Earth. Based on the buildings and the visible drop-off of the ocean floor shelf, I marked the approx. location of where the UAS was at the time the Helo passed under him. The beach was just over 800 feet away. And based on the operators statement he was 1000 feet away it would most likely place him on the parking garage next to the hotel. See photo. Even if he was on the beach and knowing the visibility of the Mavic Pro, he would have definitely been outside VLOS. This alone would have made this an illegal flight. (Unless he has excellent eyesight)
View attachment 44826

The Helicopter did not pass under him. It passed to the side of him.

 

[Fried Eagle]

They'd need radar for that currently. Would up the weight of the drone somewhat!

Just a tad, maybe a 100 lbs or so.The only aircraft that can pickup other airplanes are military. Commercial jets don't carry that kind of radar.

 

[Fried Eagle]

If only people would read the regs!!

Nothing but net!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[gnirtS]

Just a tad, maybe a 100 lbs or so.The only aircraft that can pickup other airplanes are military. Commercial jets don't carry that kind of radar.

Battery life would be a bit lower as well with a radar.

(TCAS can "see" lots of other aircraft along with ADS-B linking but not all by any means).

 

[Fried Eagle]

Battery life would be a bit lower as well with a radar.

(TCAS can "see" lots of other aircraft along with ADS-B linking but not all by any means).

 

[Fried Eagle]

TCAS or terrain collision and avoidance is not radar. The drone would have to have a transponder which would add a lot of weight.

Keep it up and we will all be required to carry on of these:
UAV Transponders & Tracker Kits | Sagetech Corporation

 

[gnirtS]

TCAS is not terrain collision.

Its Traffic Collision and Avoidance System. Its nothing to do with terrain. Its everything to do with seeing other aircraft and working out the best way to miss them.

An ADS-B transponder would add 5-10g weight maybe. Its a single, simple SOC. But they arent going to want thousands of ADS-B devices taking up the time slice of real planes. So they'll find a lower range alternative at some point.

 

[Fried Eagle]

Battery life would be a bit lower as well with a radar.

(TCAS can "see" lots of other aircraft along with ADS-B linking but not all by any means).

TCAS would never see a drone.