After TikTok ban passage, the prospect of a DJI ban is looking more likely
- Thread starter rickmurray1989
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They are assembled in Malaysia and distributed in Delaware to get around the "China thing"---the bad news is they are double the price of a Mavic and marketed to the first responders who need DJI quality NOW! Not especially made for recreational guys like me.
This is an example of what you better hope for should the DJI ban go into effect one day. This is not language or verbiage from the ban but from something similar which could be made I suppose:
"The bill also establishes the Secure and Trusted Communications Networks Reimbursement Program to supply small communications providers (i.e., providers with 2 million or fewer customers) with funds to offset the cost of removing prohibited equipment or services from their networks and replacing it with more secure communications equipment or services."
"The bill also establishes the Secure and Trusted Communications Networks Reimbursement Program to supply small communications providers (i.e., providers with 2 million or fewer customers) with funds to offset the cost of removing prohibited equipment or services from their networks and replacing it with more secure communications equipment or services."
I've read of some flyers having a problem with it, but it's never affected my flying.What do you think about the periodic forced login?
Droning on and on...
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Because I'm not the drooling simpleton this question implies.
If the US government passed a law saying I couldn't take pictures with my smartphone, I'd ignore that too. I suspect most other citizens would as well.
Look up a concept called, "civil resistance". It's come into play in history before, like when there were "whites only" drinking fountains.
There are times when democratic governments so grossly overreach that defiance is the appropriate response. Resistance carries some risk, we all must decide for ourselves if we want to incur that risk.
To me, this is one of those circumstances where the overreach is great enough and the risk small enough that I'm going to ride at the front of the bus despite the law passed by the morons in DC.
I expect I'll have a lot of fellow passengers. So many I'm not really worried about meaningful consequences.
Ok, I get your point. I consider myself an activist (into many causes) so I am well aware of civil disobedience. While I don't consider continuing to fly a Chinese drone against National Security risks to be a "right" that I personally would fight for, I can respect when others want to push back against their government based on their own viewpoints regarding overreach, etc. I guess you gotta pick your battles....
TheRock
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I pointed this out years ago and everyone scoffed. Reality doesn't count. There's a chunk of people in the House and also some in the Senate who work on the optics only. If they can be seen "protecting" America from the dastardly Chinese spying with a DJI drone, then they can claim to be heroes and garner votes. But it isn't national security, it is a couple of American-owned manufacturers pushing this for their personal financial gain. DJI has appeared many times and has produced convincing arguments and evidence that it is not an arm of the Chinese spy corps. DJI's lobbying efforts have drawn on grass-roots support from users who fear that a ban of the company's drones would be disruptive and expensive, especially since U.S. suppliers have not proven they can compete on cost or quality.
This is a big deal. This bill would add DJI to a list of companies prevented from using any federal resources. In this case the resource is the federally controlled wireless communications spectrum. If passed by the senate and signed into law, this would immediately restrict DJI from using any spectrum for control of their drones in the entire United States and territories. It would be full stop for everyone. So far, representative Stefanik's bill is basically ridiculous as no evidence of espionage has been presented in the commission's evaluation. What's next, banning Hasselblad cameras because it is owned by DJI? She has no real background in this matter. She is one of the front runners in being the vice president on the Trump ticket. So she is just doing this to appear to be tough on China and pro-America. It's all politics for her. My guess is she could care less about all the drone owners H.R. 2864 affects. Still, since the House is run by Republicans, amazingly bill recently cleared committee with a 43-0 vote.
It's all personally driven by the senator to give US companies a chance to get a better foothold in the market, which is a pipe dream! The proposal is flawed in many ways. DJI drones such as the Agras T40 are used for agricultural purposes, the AG industry and farmers alike are a huge lobbying entity that need to be enlisted! Plus, DJI thermal drones saved the lives of at least 380 people in the past year. Besides, American made drones are not using current technology. And drones aren't collecting any information for China that it doesn't already have!
The best bet would be to hope if it does somehow get to the floor and pass the House and get to the Senate, senators will realize this is all pap and toss it. Take action. You can join The Drone Advocacy Alliance here that deal with proposed bans on consumer and commercial. Click here: About – Drone Advocacy Alliance
This is a big deal. This bill would add DJI to a list of companies prevented from using any federal resources. In this case the resource is the federally controlled wireless communications spectrum. If passed by the senate and signed into law, this would immediately restrict DJI from using any spectrum for control of their drones in the entire United States and territories. It would be full stop for everyone. So far, representative Stefanik's bill is basically ridiculous as no evidence of espionage has been presented in the commission's evaluation. What's next, banning Hasselblad cameras because it is owned by DJI? She has no real background in this matter. She is one of the front runners in being the vice president on the Trump ticket. So she is just doing this to appear to be tough on China and pro-America. It's all politics for her. My guess is she could care less about all the drone owners H.R. 2864 affects. Still, since the House is run by Republicans, amazingly bill recently cleared committee with a 43-0 vote.
It's all personally driven by the senator to give US companies a chance to get a better foothold in the market, which is a pipe dream! The proposal is flawed in many ways. DJI drones such as the Agras T40 are used for agricultural purposes, the AG industry and farmers alike are a huge lobbying entity that need to be enlisted! Plus, DJI thermal drones saved the lives of at least 380 people in the past year. Besides, American made drones are not using current technology. And drones aren't collecting any information for China that it doesn't already have!
The best bet would be to hope if it does somehow get to the floor and pass the House and get to the Senate, senators will realize this is all pap and toss it. Take action. You can join The Drone Advocacy Alliance here that deal with proposed bans on consumer and commercial. Click here: About – Drone Advocacy Alliance
Take a BIG clensing breath sports fans. A similar ban for DJI just isn't in the cards. I say this with some confidence based on 45 years as a news anchor/reporter, 25 of those years in Washington DC, Capitol Hill, etc. Some legislators I've spoken with believe TicTok is an existential threat to the well being of our youth and the American way. The claim that the app is somehow transmitting secrets back to China was just a 'beard' to get bill on the floor. Unless half naked 19 year old start posing with Mavics for views and likes on Twitch, legislators won't care. The folks on the 'Select Committee for Intellegence' and 'Ways and Means', know there are many other more sophisticated methods that China uses to extract intel and a company that sells drones and pays a crap load of corporate tax to the treasury ain't one of them...rest easy kids.
No disrespect but taking a "big clensing breath" is not a winning strategy. I think we all know the odds of this passing are very small but pretending like it is a nothing burger or no big deal is only part of larger threat drones face across the country over the next decade. Now is not the time to take our eye off the ball. If there won't be any legislative action anytime soon, why not take the opportunity to get a few judicial wins under our belt (i.e. go on the offensive)?
Check out my previous 2 posts on this thread..also, the podcast with Anzu CEO on pilot institute's youtube channel - ton of info there..
The only 2 drones that Anzu has licensed from DJI are the M3E and M3T, and they are definitely NOT double the price! They are $1000 - $1500 more than their respective counter parts..the Raptor (M3E) is approx $5100 and the Raptor T (M3T) is $7k. They are a little more expensive, but what you get is an American company with American employees and the same up-to-date tech DJI has right now, but without the worry of getting banned because they're technically not a chinese product or company. I believe that is worth the small premium for protection and peace of mind that you wont be out of business immediately if the DJI ban goes thru. Also, yes they are marketing to public safety and gov't agencies now because they have the greatest need to fill, but anyone with the money can buy the Raptor and Raptor T RIGHT NOW, regardless of any affiliation with the gov't/public sector.
This may not be an absolutely perfect option for everyone, but its pretty **** good for the majority of people that NEED this technology and need it now (enterprise users)! It's definitely the best solution we have available, and it will obviously be some time before a totally new American drone company can come up with a whole line of different drones to suit all the niches that DJI currently owns in the marketplace. I for one, am very grateful for Anzu's entrance into the market. Oh did i forget to mention - Anzu has NO GEOFENCING whatsoever!! Also, their customer service dept is IN AMERICA with American employees!! If they keep providing DJI level tech, but without the usual DJI headaches and with the features we all want, I can definitely see making an Anzu purchase over DJI. Time will tell.
So basically, what you're saying is that the Raptors, (which ARE the Mavic 3E and T in plain clothes) are on average fifteen hundred bucks more for exactly the same thing but without the DJI logo..... somehow the logic of paying that much over the odds for already overpriced drones escapes me. Especially when a 'deep dive' into the control code still reveals the proprietary DJI copyright information all over the place, rendering the argument that it ISN'T a DJI drone utterly redundant from the outset.
I could dress up as Mahatma Ghandi but I'll bet you a buck most Indians would just laugh themselves silly.
My thoughts about it is this! Even though they may pass a law banning DJI, is the Government going to reimburse us? And if we’re banned, what are we going to replace it with? Skydio? Don’t make me laugh!
Buddy if you cant see the value in what Anzu (and DJI) is doing and what it means for the future of the industry(especially here in the US), when i have literally spelled it out for you, then I'm not sure I can do any more to help you see the light. We all see what we want to see.
If DJI products are so "overpriced" then why do you use them? And then go so far as to actively participate on a user forum? I'm getting mixed signals here...
I'm not sure where you're getting this idea that it's a big secret that the Raptors are "actually" Mavics and nobody's supposed to know...? It's actually the opposite - Anzu wants people to know exactly where the Raptors come from because everyone equates DJI with the highest quality/best functionality drones on the market. If it were a secret, Anzu would have a very difficult time generating sales. This is why they made NO effort to change the appearance of the Raptor, beyond just painting it a different color.
The design heritage and R&D are Chinese, but that is where the Chinese influence stops with the Raptor. The drones are manufactured AND assembled in Malaysia, not China. Again, we all see what we want; I'm sure you'll still say "But they're Chinese!" regardless of what i write here or what the truth actually is.
Also, really not sure your "analogy" about dressing up as Ghandi applies here, but feel free to 'enlighten' me. Are you saying the dji drones will laugh at the anzu drones because they know the truth about the disguise? Or maybe that you like to play dress up? I think the Indians would only laugh AT you if you thought you really were fooling everyone and you thought that you really were Ghandi himself. The key difference here is that no one thinks anyone is fooling or being fooled; the relationship is transparent specifically because they are trying to solve the ban issue, legally and cooperatively. The last thing DJI wants is for their products to be banned in the gigantic consumer market that is the US.
As far as them being identical products, I've already explained how Anzu will have zero geofencing and their own software (not dji's) with their own programming etc. The Raptors and Mavics have more common DNA now than they ever will in the future. The seperate technologies will develop independently, diverging more and more as time goes on, until one day (fairly soon) they will be unrecognizable even as distant cousins.
I'm not sure what solutions you are offering up that are better than all of our current choices, but it would be nice if you would let everyone else in on all your great knowledge. Usually perfect solutions only exist in math and fantasy, so we have to make do with compromises here in reality. That starts with one good move, then another, etc. Or we could just poopoo everything and sit on our hands and cry about it. I know which one I will choose, and I think i know which one you'll pick as well.
Ps - i may be misremembering, but isn't your location in the UK? If so, could it be possible that you aren't acutely aware, firsthand, of exactly what we want and need here in the US versus what you all want and need in the UK? Wouldn't you say the same to me if our roles were reversed? If I got your location wrong I apologize. Cheers mate
It seems as though that is how it worked as a one man band took on the FAA for changing the rules which specifically stated that they couldn't requiring drone registration. He won the case and the FAA ate crow. Then a few months later in some obscure bill, the FAA slipped in their changes within. In a blink of a eye all that fighting with the FAA over years and the win was overturned without anyone really knowing who signed what and why that FAA insert was slid into that bill and now we have extended that to the recent remote ID. You older pilots know of what I am talking about and the case. It was a David and Goliath win for us in the UAS/Drone hobby, only to get a slap in the face by our government.
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A good vent is good for the soul. Feel better?Buddy if you cant see the value in what Anzu (and DJI) is doing and what it means for the future of the industry(especially here in the US), when i have literally spelled it out for you, then I'm not sure I can do any more to help you see the light. We all see what we want to see.
If DJI products are so "overpriced" then why do you use them? And then go so far as to actively participate on a user forum? I'm getting mixed signals here...
I'm not sure where you're getting this idea that it's a big secret that the Raptors are "actually" Mavics and nobody's supposed to know...? It's actually the opposite - Anzu wants people to know exactly where the Raptors come from because everyone equates DJI with the highest quality/best functionality drones on the market. If it were a secret, Anzu would have a very difficult time generating sales. This is why they made NO effort to change the appearance of the Raptor, beyond just painting it a different color.
The design heritage and R&D are Chinese, but that is where the Chinese influence stops with the Raptor. The drones are manufactured AND assembled in Malaysia, not China. Again, we all see what we want; I'm sure you'll still say "But they're Chinese!" regardless of what i write here or what the truth actually is.
Also, really not sure your "analogy" about dressing up as Ghandi applies here, but feel free to 'enlighten' me. Are you saying the dji drones will laugh at the anzu drones because they know the truth about the disguise? Or maybe that you like to play dress up? I think the Indians would only laugh AT you if you thought you really were fooling everyone and you thought that you really were Ghandi himself. The key difference here is that no one thinks anyone is fooling or being fooled; the relationship is transparent specifically because they are trying to solve the ban issue, legally and cooperatively. The last thing DJI wants is for their products to be banned in the gigantic consumer market that is the US.
As far as them being identical products, I've already explained how Anzu will have zero geofencing and their own software (not dji's) with their own programming etc. The Raptors and Mavics have more common DNA now than they ever will in the future. The seperate technologies will develop independently, diverging more and more as time goes on, until one day (fairly soon) they will be unrecognizable even as distant cousins.
I'm not sure what solutions you are offering up that are better than all of our current choices, but it would be nice if you would let everyone else in on all your great knowledge. Usually perfect solutions only exist in math and fantasy, so we have to make do with compromises here in reality. That starts with one good move, then another, etc. Or we could just poopoo everything and sit on our hands and cry about it. I know which one I will choose, and I think i know which one you'll pick as well.
Ps - i may be misremembering, but isn't your location in the UK? If so, could it be possible that you aren't acutely aware, firsthand, of exactly what we want and need here in the US versus what you all want and need in the UK? Wouldn't you say the same to me if our roles were reversed? If I got your location wrong I apologize. Cheers mate
Your original post states "good for America.... Jobs for Americans..." Just as a matter of interest, how many jobs do you reckon a service centre will create? The donkey work is being done in Malaysia by Malaysians trained by DJI personnel.
If a lack of active geofencing is what it takes to make a Mavic NOT a Mavic, then obviously (barring all the boards, the motors, the moulds for the plastics, the chips, the ancillary electronic components, the firmware, the camera, the gimbal.... etc....) the raptors and the spectas definitely AREN'T DJI drones in 'dress-up' disguise (hence the Ghandi similie just to clarify matters) and I'll happily stand corrected. The control firmware (software) coding still contains references to the DJI brand (perhaps more so with the spectas) and will continue to do so until it has been thoroughly edited out, so even a cursory look through the code will reveal what it is: a DJI Mavic wearing a false moustache, which might not matter too much.... unless the person looking is doing so to ensure those evil old commie tools: DJI don't sneak their nefarious spy tech past those dedicated to banning it.
The reason I use DJI kit is because it is currently peerless, and yes, at the consumer level, it is overpriced.
Well spotted.... I am indeed in the U of K and it will be a relatively short period of time before THIS side of the Atlantic falls foul of exactly the same brand of mindless knee-jerk paranoia.
It is perhaps arrogant to assume that a dumb furriner can't grasp the needs and wants of the average American.... I can assure you it really isn't that different from the needs and wants of your average European... the only real difference being that you have something called 'constitutional rights' that are supposed to protect your individual freedoms. We just have the Magna Carta which was written a long time ago and has rarely been updated since.
I'm hoping we can keep this civil, because I genuinely enjoy reasoned debate.
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EssenYVR
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I'm just going to point out that the United States isn't the only country that have banned Tik Tok. There's a wide and growing consensus around the globe that it's a security risk that needs to be addressed.
What that means for DJI drones I have no idea.
What that means for DJI drones I have no idea.
Droning on and on...
Well-Known Member
No TikTok on DJI drones.
Doesn't really have to mean anything at all for it to have been fun to merge the two in this thread
Just to be fair and just so we are clear, the vast majority of those are specific bans meaning someone in charge has told the people or groups they are in charge of not to use the app. Such as the central government tells the employees not to install the app on central government phones. That's a bit difference than the government telling the people not to use the app. Plenty of places do that for plenty of reasons for example, the government in Austria bans government workers from installing p-hub on government devices. Even in America, the federal government has a ton of similar restrictions and so do many states. America is the only real free country in the world so it is no surprise that other country will ban things it objects to for various reason. The only places where countries have banned apps for *all* the people are oppressive dictatorial regimes for moral reasons, because they object to the content, and it's likely yt is banned as well. That's nothing to celebrate or hold up as praise. This is going to be the first time in my lifetime that my country has ever told me (and the people) that you cannot use a mobile phone app for national security reasons and I consider this a huge blow to freedom because one day that could be the excuse/reason for millions of apps Hope this goes to SCOTUS.
What does this mean for DJI drones, what would happen if the DJI Fly app was banned?
This thread had become argumentative. Stay civil and keep politics out!
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