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Best and worst aspects of drone flying

The good: Its fun flying drones and its a welcome change from RC planes I've been flying for over fifty years
The Bad: Wish I had more time to fly drones, make amazing videos like so many here have done; I'm a long way from that. I need to fly more.
 
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Yes. rather too narrow in my opinion. I don't know why people in National Parks are expecting silent skies. Manned aviation faces no additional restrictions here to ensure that, public roads often go right through them, and other visitors all make a reasonable amount of noise, to which drones would contribute hardly anything. We all know how quiet (for example) a Mini series drone can be, to the extent that it's not really hearable from the ground at all once it gets to around 200 ft or so, so I find it quite hard to take seriously rules based on drone noise disturbing people's peace and quiet. So why have these regulators, in their 'wisdom', not simply confined us to 200 ft+ except while launching or landing ? or limited our numbers so there are never more than say 5 in the sky at a time ? Or ring fenced a few days a month / season drones are freely allowed to film ? Where is the justification or mandate for banning the entire hobby from access to the land ?
With a very few exceptions, the NPS prohibits the taking off, landing, and operation of aircraft on national parklands (36 CFR 2.7). The FAA recognizes the authority of the NPS to establish such prohibitions and restrictions (14 CFR 107.45).

Neither agency, however, expressly prohibits flight over national parklands. And so, a loophole large enough to fly a drone through.

At least for now, you could launch and operate a drone outside the boundaries of a park, fly it over parklands, land outside the boundaries, and be in compliance with the letter of the law. You would, however, be thumbing your nose at the spirit of the law. Is that the kind of reputation you'd like to have?

As a practical matter, if you were to fly over parklands from a launch point outside the boundaries, and you were to comply with FAA regulations under Part 107 as regards altitude, VLOS, and other restrictions, how far could you penetrate the airspace over a park before losing sight of your drone, exhausting your battery, or encountering terrain that would block your control signals? How gratifying would such an experience be?

Many parks are vast. Yellowstone, for example, is about 50 X 60 miles and comprises about 2.5 million acres. Dinking around its hundreds of miles of rugged and largely inaccessible boundary isn't going to yield any shots of the more celebrated and spectacular features located in its interior. They're way beyond the range of a consumer drone.

Scofflaws, of course, have violated regulations and operated their drones inside parks. One idiot crashed his drone in Yellowstone's Grand Prismatic Spring. Removal of the drone from that thermal feature was difficult and expensive. So were the fine and costs levied against him. Do you suppose, in retrospect, that he thought his actions were worth it?

Just fly somewhere else.
 
One idiot crashed his drone in Yellowstone's Grand Prismatic Spring. Removal of the drone from that thermal feature was difficult and expensive. So were the fine and costs levied against him. Do you suppose, in retrospect, that he thought his actions were worth it?

Just fly somewhere else.
I think this last point is why we cannot in National Parks, there have been too many fools who, have lost or crashed their drones without an=y recovery leave that debris behind, especially in the early days before all the obstacle sensors of today. There are others that have harassed wildlife. It is no different that the rules i need to follow with my Jeep when offroad in some park, no trail breaking stay on established trails. with out the rule that small minority of idiots destroy a lot of stuff.
 
In 1986 I bought a pair of Honda ATV 200 three wheelers.
I bought them because they looked like a lot of fun. (and they were).
What I discovered as an owner of a pair of ATV three wheelers is that you can't really ride them in as many places as you'd like.

Owning a drone is similar.

All the places that seem like it would be fun to fly the drone seems to be off limits. I am specifically referring to parks. And the most important ones being the National Parks.
I'd also like to fly near the waterfalls. Guess what? They're off limits. I'd like to fly near the river I used to go to a lot. Guess what.
And I'd love to fly at a few of the lakes I used to go to. And, you guessed it... off limits.
For sure, I feel exactly the same. It's almost as if they want you to take your drone and fly it from the corner of 5th and Main Street. If some of these remote places were opened to drone, it's hard to find a reason to fly often in the city when there are welcoming places abound. But who wants to travel to a nice park a couple hours away only to find NO DRONES signs posted all over the entrance. It's frustrating.

This weekend, I think I'm going to put my red and green and blue and white strobe lights all over my Mavic 3 Pro and practice my night flying around the neighborhood since they won't let me into the county park.
 
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Flying a drone now falls into the "don't ask, don't tell" category of activities! LOL!
Don't share it, and don't fly from home!
Otherwise, be discreet, enjoy it privately when others aren't around, and don't get caught!
Sadly I cannot fly casually from my neighborhood; don't want to rile up the neighbors.
 
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If you own a bullhorn, don't expect to be greeted with nods of approval if you take it to the opera and decide to sing along with the performers. If you aren't allowed to fly your drone in a park, fly it somewhere else.
There are already laws against misusing a bullhorn. I would only get upset if they created new laws just because I got a bullhorn.

The parks (in my AO) belong to the People. The government shouldn't get to decide where the drone can fly and where it cannot. If there is a good reason, like safety concerns, that's understandable. Years ago, the county didn't understand drones so they had a blanket policy of no drones....just because. Now they have a drone policy. That's all we are asking for, just like with anything else. Can you imagine if a state has a "no fishing allowed in any state park" rule? That would be insane because it's not what the People want. All too often, the government forgets who they are responsible to. We shouldn't have to go beg our government to let us enjoy freedom. If it's not illegal, it should be permitted.
 
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I respect the reasons for which it was established more than a century ago, and I respect the rights of other visitors to enjoy it without having to see my drone or hear it buzzing in their ears.
if there was a way to fly the drone in the park without visitors seeing it or "buzzing" in their ear, would you agree to allow drones? What happens one day when drones go completely silent and no one on the ground can hear them? What happens one day when drones look like birds and no one can distinguish them? Will these still be the excuses or will there be new excuses?

All we are asking for is reasonable rules, not a blanket NO. you might not know this but the rules and regulations in NPs have evolved tremendously over the years. Unlike most people think, they DO adapt and change over time and drones will become one of those....for sure. I can't talk about it hear but they used to tell me NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT for a certain thing and it was for the safety of ALL visitors and guess what today....it's my right now fully recognized; just like that, practically overnight.

BTW, I could hear a hundred motorcycles blazing through the canyons in the Badlands, it was the loudest thing I had heard all week. Anyone who thinks they can go to Badlands during Sturgis for peace and quiet, they are sadly mistaken. All NP are not 100% peace and quiet 100% of the time; that should be a "wilderness" thing. Have you not been to Yosemite, that's a circus.
 
Just fly somewhere else.
Not picking on you and your AI generated response but "somewhere else" is always going to end up being "not in my backyard." the NPS are for everybody, not for some of everybody. Accomodations.
 
I think this last point is why we cannot in National Parks, there have been too many fools who, have lost or crashed their drones without an=y recovery leave that debris behind, especially in the early days before all the obstacle sensors of today. There are others that have harassed wildlife. It is no different that the rules i need to follow with my Jeep when offroad in some park, no trail breaking stay on established trails. with out the rule that small minority of idiots destroy a lot of stuff.
I think you made the point "some parks" and their limitations. Have you encountered a blanket NO JEEPS rules? What if the BLM said "no off-road vehicles" in any BLM locations nationwide, how would you feel about that? Bad enough you have to deal with the rules which we can all live with but drones aren't even given the option to comply with strict rules.

I get it, no flying period at Mount Rushmore NP. But Theodore Roosevelt NP, what the hell? The entire park is empty, it should be an official NPS drone park with rules. We don't want a run over the entire park, the parking lot, the geysers, the scenic spots, etc but there are remote places in Yellowstone and the Tetons where you can carve off 500 square miles away from 99% of the visitors where I can go visit the lands I pay for and fly my drone in peace. This is going to happen one day.
 
All we are asking for is reasonable rules, not a blanket NO. you might not know this but the rules and regulations in NPs have evolved tremendously over the years. Unlike most people think, they DO adapt and change over time and drones will become one of those....for sure. I can't talk about it hear but they used to tell me NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT for a certain thing and it was for the safety of ALL visitors and guess what today....it's my right now fully recognized; just like that, practically overnight.
Filming rules in general have changed in NP in the last few years, while some are very upset with the need for permits. I do not see an issues as long as there is a reasonable path to obtain them. Most of the complaints have come from YouTube content creators because for some reason they do not see their filming as a business venture, in the end not really any different other than impact than a commercial shoot.
 
Filming rules in general have changed in NP in the last few years, while some are very upset with the need for permits. I do not see an issues as long as there is a reasonable path to obtain them. Most of the complaints have come from YouTube content creators because for some reason they do not see their filming as a business venture, in the end not really any different other than impact than a commercial shoot.
Yes, I know that story and I'm familiar with the battle. I really really wish there was a similar system for drones and I know it's there but it's unrealistic. Someone will tell you, just drive up to the GC gate and ask if you can fly your drone, they might say yes? But we all know it's not that simple.

Right now, we don't have the fight on our side like the land camera folks who take their "rights" seriously. Drone flyers still feel they fly their drone solely with the permission from their government. The vast majority of drone flyers agree the NP is no place to fly drones, period. But they will be the first ones to fly there once the restrictions are lifted.
 
You would, however, be thumbing your nose at the spirit of the law. Is that the kind of reputation you'd like to have?
Yes, thanks , entirely happy with that. And more so, rather proud of my continued efforts to circumvent existing regulations, which I consider my civic duty to pursue ! No, this is excellent behaviour :)

American Parks don't have anything to worry about with me - I am in the UK, so it's NT and EH that bear the brunt of my ire on the subject and are the main focus of my incursions - not because I am targeting them specifically or maliciously, but simply because they manage SO MUCH of the open countryside here that it is almost impossible to avoid, if your aim is to capture spectacular British viewpoints from above. It is my highest priority when flying in such places that I do so considerately of people and wildlife and above all safely. It is possible to foster a complete disdain for the spirit of the law (where it is not about safety) and yet maintain cordial relations with officials and general public alike.

One idiot crashed his drone in Yellowstone's Grand Prismatic Spring. Removal of the drone from that thermal feature was difficult and expensive.
And most likely entirely unnecessary ! They know how acidic that pool is. If they'd just left it it would have been gone in a week ! It wouldn't surprise me if that whole operation was only carried out to provide some sort of warped justification for the unnecessarily large fines levied at the pilot ! And it is obvious to all of us that the pilot should have known better, and that there are sensible reasons for forbidding flight there, in the one of the most populated and busy areas of the park and with such evidently hazardous conditions for drones.
 
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There are already laws against misusing a bullhorn. I would only get upset if they created new laws just because I got a bullhorn.

The parks (in my AO) belong to the People. The government shouldn't get to decide where the drone can fly and where it cannot. If there is a good reason, like safety concerns, that's understandable. Years ago, the county didn't understand drones so they had a blanket policy of no drones....just because. Now they have a drone policy. That's all we are asking for, just like with anything else. Can you imagine if a state has a "no fishing allowed in any state park" rule? That would be insane because it's not what the People want. All too often, the government forgets who they are responsible to. We shouldn't have to go beg our government to let us enjoy freedom. If it's not illegal, it should be permitted.
Yes, the parks belong to the people, and the people decided more than a century ago, through laws enacted by their elected representatives, that management of the parks should be entrusted to an agency with the expertise necessary to ensure their protection in perpetuity. And, in accordance with your wishes, the national parks have a drone policy. There are also policies and regulations regarding all manner of extractive uses and other destructive and intrusive activities.

I should hope you wouldn't want a sign at the entrance to each park which states "Anything Goes. Do want you want without regard for resource values or for the rights of anyone else."

National parks are a uniquely American idea that's been adopted by virtually every other nation in the world. In Old World Europe, there were no national parks or the equivalent. The best places were reserved only for royalty and the aristocracy. Common folks didn't have access to those lands or a say in how they were managed. Robin Hood, according to legend, was declared an outlaw for hunting the king's royal deer in Sherwood Forest.

Respect your parks, enjoy them responsibly, and fly somewhere else.
 
I think you made the point "some parks" and their limitations. Have you encountered a blanket NO JEEPS rules? What if the BLM said "no off-road vehicles" in any BLM locations nationwide, how would you feel about that? Bad enough you have to deal with the rules which we can all live with but drones aren't even given the option to comply with strict rules.

I get it, no flying period at Mount Rushmore NP. But Theodore Roosevelt NP, what the hell? The entire park is empty, it should be an official NPS drone park with rules. We don't want a run over the entire park, the parking lot, the geysers, the scenic spots, etc but there are remote places in Yellowstone and the Tetons where you can carve off 500 square miles away from 99% of the visitors where I can go visit the lands I pay for and fly my drone in peace. This is going to happen one day.
Yes but like I said people have crashed and left their debris behind in sensitive areas, I cannot tell you how many Mylar balloons I have picked up in the desert besides other trash. Even when someone does something stupid with their truck or Jeep in say Death Valley they rarely leave it behind unlike the drones with lithium batteries left on the floor. If people took more responsibility for their actions maybe we would have less restrictions on our use of drones. I would be in favor of a permit system for a limited use by a limited number on a given day, not unlike the permits for some of the restricted use ares for hikers and backpackers.
 
Yes but like I said people have crashed and left their debris behind in sensitive areas, I cannot tell you how many Mylar balloons I have picked up in the desert besides other trash. Even when someone does something stupid with their truck or Jeep in say Death Valley they rarely leave it behind unlike the drones with lithium batteries left on the floor. If people took more responsibility for their actions maybe we would have less restrictions on our use of drones. I would be in favor of a permit system for a limited use by a limited number on a given day, not unlike the permits for some of the restricted use ares for hikers and backpackers.
Agreed. You take one drone in the park when you check in and when you check out, you bring one drone back. If you don't, heavy fines. You can't leave a lithium battery behind. However, a person driving thru the front gates in their car, they can toss a car battery in the parking lot, right? Nobody checks them. I don't mind the strict rules in NP but at least they are allowed. In my opinion, the Red Rocks area is a good test, let's see how that goes as far as allowing drones and the problems that come with. I suspect the issue is overblown and it will be determined that drones are not a problem and restrictions will be lifted.

As I mentioned in my previous post to Hank, even the NP has to evolve. They used to have some people outlandish rules over the decades and frankly, I'm glad they saw the light. I still shocked they allow cars to drive through the NP, that's how the fires are started. But nobody seems to care about the fires, it's those pesky drones.
 

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