DJI Matrice 210 lost at sea. It even happens to the big boys.

[JAW]

This is not the first incident involving Pender County EMS and their drones. Last summer one of their drones interfered with a North Carolina forestry airplane over a forest fire. Both probably had the correct reason for being there, but apparently they never talk to each other.

 

[Deleted member 114292]

Drone Lost During Training Exercise Over The Atlantic Ocean

Pender EMS And Fire Matrice 210 Ran Out Of Battery

A DJI Matrice 210 valued at $26,000 was lost in the Atlantic ocean during a training exercise last month. The aircraft, which belonged to Pender EMS and Fire, ran out of battery while fighting high winds over the ocean off Wrightsville Beach, NC.

The Port City Daily newspaper reports that the aircraft was providing aerial surveillance during an exercise for first responders, including the U.S. Coast Guard, the New Hanover County Sheriff’s Office, Pender County Sheriff’s Office, Wilmington Police Department, and Wrightsville Beach Fire and Police, who were practicing rescues of stranded swimmers on February 27.

Pender EMS and Fire Chief Woody Sullivan said that the drone has an estimated flight time of 24 minutes. However, winds in the area where the exercise was being conducted were around 15 miles per hour, and there was not enough power left in the battery to return the drone to shore. "The bird went down in 14 minutes," Sullivan said.

Sullivan said it was safer to ditch the drone in the water than to try to land it on one of the boats. He said that the company will be reviewing its protocols as part of an internal investigation. "The return home will have to be much sooner, we will have less flight time over the water," he said.

Pender EMS and Fire Deputy Chief Scott Sills said that there is an inherent risk involved when operating such expensive, high-tech equipment while learning to use them for potentially life-saving missions.

All you can really say is Lesson Learned.
If it was taxpayers money 24k is nothing. One f35, entry level model, will by 3000 of those.

 

[Rodders]

Did He or She Get the Sack. ???

 

[RayOZ]

Where was their sense of adventure? Surely they had practiced hand-catching the 210 on a moving platform in high winds. Easy¡

I suppose they might have to add this as part of their training. But might have to do it on land first, or they might lose a few more.

 

[steve495]

Now this is a log file I would enjoy seeing sar104 review. Wonder if someone would be willing to put in a FOI request to get the file.

 

[RotoRanger]

An old man once said; Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and i'm not sure about the universe!

ps: what is the bowser?

Another well used aviation maxim: “Aviation in itself is not inherently dangerous. But to an even greater degree than the sea, it is terribly unforgiving of any carelessness, incapacity or neglect.” Here, I believe, we have both aspects covered.

 

[old man mavic]

An old man once said; Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and i'm not sure about the universe!

ps: what is the bowser?

@iglou7 and just for your edification, this old man is saying a bowser, is a mobil fuel carrier that aircraft use to refuel from on an airfield

 

[Chanctonbury]

ps: what is the bowser?

Fuel delivery vehicle - (basically a large fuel tank on wheels)

 

[Donnie Frank]

Drone Lost During Training Exercise Over The Atlantic Ocean

Pender EMS And Fire Matrice 210 Ran Out Of Battery

A DJI Matrice 210 valued at $26,000 was lost in the Atlantic ocean during a training exercise last month. The aircraft, which belonged to Pender EMS and Fire, ran out of battery while fighting high winds over the ocean off Wrightsville Beach, NC.

The Port City Daily newspaper reports that the aircraft was providing aerial surveillance during an exercise for first responders, including the U.S. Coast Guard, the New Hanover County Sheriff’s Office, Pender County Sheriff’s Office, Wilmington Police Department, and Wrightsville Beach Fire and Police, who were practicing rescues of stranded swimmers on February 27.

Pender EMS and Fire Chief Woody Sullivan said that the drone has an estimated flight time of 24 minutes. However, winds in the area where the exercise was being conducted were around 15 miles per hour, and there was not enough power left in the battery to return the drone to shore. "The bird went down in 14 minutes," Sullivan said.

Sullivan said it was safer to ditch the drone in the water than to try to land it on one of the boats. He said that the company will be reviewing its protocols as part of an internal investigation. "The return home will have to be much sooner, we will have less flight time over the water," he said.

Pender EMS and Fire Deputy Chief Scott Sills said that there is an inherent risk involved when operating such expensive, high-tech equipment while learning to use them for potentially life-saving missions.

I would make the pilot replace it. Monitoring one's battery and NOT running out is drone 101. MAINTAINING one's batteries properly so you don't run out unexpectedly is drone 102.

D

 

[Ty Pilot]

To me this is clearly pilot error, but in reading through the story you can see how the attitude from the chief and deputy chief probably set up an environment where the pilot's focus is more mission oriented at any cost than flight completion.

From the story:

“The ability of these things is amazing, and yes we had an incident, but what we have done and have been able to do with these things outweighs one incident,” Sills said.

In the end, Sullivan viewed the drone incident as a necessary cost of training for his department as it is adapting to new unmanned technology.

I don't do SAR and I am not a first responder but I do recognize this as a hazardous attitude to one degree or another and if that is the attitude that is 'baked' into their pilots they're going to loose more aircraft. I do understand that had that been a real life saving event then if staying on station meant the difference, well then the cost is verified but this was a training exercise. To me this distinction should be part of their training but I get the sense its not.

 

[Deleted member 114292]

To me this is clearly pilot error, but in reading through the story you can see how the attitude from the chief and deputy chief probably set up an environment where the pilot's focus is more mission oriented at any cost than flight completion.

From the story:

“The ability of these things is amazing, and yes we had an incident, but what we have done and have been able to do with these things outweighs one incident,” Sills said.

In the end, Sullivan viewed the drone incident as a necessary cost of training for his department as it is adapting to new unmanned technology.

I don't do SAR and I am not a first responder but I do recognize this as a hazardous attitude to one degree or another and if that is the attitude that is 'baked' into their pilots they're going to loose more aircraft. I do understand that had that been a real life saving event then if staying on station meant the difference, well then the cost is verified but this was a training exercise. To me this distinction should be part of their training but I get the sense its not.

He was tasked to fly a mission the batteries were not his to maintain one way or the other.
Whoever created the mission thought they had 24 minutes.
A failure in mission planning? Yes

But that’s why you do training missions.

 

[Ty Pilot]

Here is a screen shot from that story, did I misread? I went back and did not see 24 minutes mentioned.






Even if the pilot is not tasked with batteries maintenance and installation, the PIC is responsible to know what his fuel load is.

Had this been a real emergency where the aircraft actually was needed for a 24 minute duration and the pilot failed to grasp he only had 14 minutes; that would still be pilot error.

 

[sar104]

Here is a screen shot from that story, did I misread? I went back and did not see 24 minutes mentioned.



View attachment 96569


Even if the pilot is not tasked with batteries maintenance and installation, the PIC is responsible to know what his fuel load is.

Had this been a real emergency where the aircraft actually was needed for a 24 minute duration and the pilot failed to grasp he only had 14 minutes; that would still be pilot error.

Depends which article you read. That's obviously a typo in the one that you found:

Pender loses $26,000 drone to the ocean in joint Masonboro Inlet training exercise | Port City Daily

A DJI Matrice 210 drone at the Pender Emergency Operation Center, identical to the one lost during a training exercise last week. (Port City Daily photo/Mark Darrough) WRIGHTSVILLE BEACH — During a…

portcitydaily.com

 

[Deleted member 114292]

Depends which article you read. That's obviously a typo in the one that you found:

Pender loses $26,000 drone to the ocean in joint Masonboro Inlet training exercise | Port City Daily

A DJI Matrice 210 drone at the Pender Emergency Operation Center, identical to the one lost during a training exercise last week. (Port City Daily photo/Mark Darrough) WRIGHTSVILLE BEACH — During a…

portcitydaily.com

Thank you for helping me know I’m not going crazy I read the first one and posted a link to the second one.

If they had a high capacity battery it’s possible it would be 24 minutes and it’s hard to believe they planned a 15 minute flight with 14 minute battery.
With no load in the high capacity battery it’s 30 minutes.

In military training missions it’s not unusual for someone to lose their life. Not to mention millions of dollars worth of taxpayers equipment.

 

[sar104]

Thank you for helping me know I’m not going crazy I read the first one and posted a link to the second one.

If they had a high capacity battery it’s possible it would be 24 minutes and it’s hard to believe they planned a 15 minute flight with 14 minute battery.
With no load in the high capacity battery it’s 30 minutes.

In military training missions it’s not unusual for someone to lose their life. Not to mention millions of dollars worth of taxpayers equipment.

The M210 with twin batteries is quite capable of 24 minutes. They thought that they had a 10 minute buffer, but didn't account for wind. Pilot error.

 

[Ty Pilot]

Ah okay, I did read from a different source

I still maintain my position that the Pilot should know his aircraft thoroughly and he should know what his fuel load is.

Does anyone know how they are operating? 107 or COA? It looks like they've not got a cohesive structure for training and management either way but, reading this new article at least they are going to let some outside help look into the incident and see what measures can be taken to avoid similar in the future. To me it sounds as if the Chief is operating as the 'PIC' and Hoffer was just the person manipulating the controls and neither knows all of the duties of a true PIC.

According to Sills, the internal investigation will involve two drone pilots outside of the department looking at “what we could’ve done better.”

 

[Deleted member 114292]

The M210 with twin batteries is quite capable of 24 minutes. They thought that they had a 10 minute buffer, but didn't account for wind. Pilot error.

Of course it is pilot error but anyone can make a mistake and it doesn’t mean he was untrained or a bad pilot.
For all we know perhaps he thought he could land on a ship if that happened and was ordered not too.

Even the best of us make mistakes and that’s why we train. So when the real thing comes we’ve lean from our mistakes.

Easy to sit from your arm chair and be out raged at others mistakes. There’s always more to the story than is reported.

 

[sar104]

Of course it is pilot error but anyone can make a mistake and it doesn’t mean he was untrained or a bad pilot.
For all we know perhaps he thought he could land on a ship if that happened and was ordered not too.

Even the best of us make mistakes and that’s why we train. So when the real thing comes we’ve lean from our mistakes.

Easy to sit from your arm chair and be out raged at others mistakes. There’s always more to the story than is reported.

I'm not outraged in the slightest, nor judging his training. But unless he was instructed to do a one-way mission then it's still pilot error.

 

[Ty Pilot]

I'm also not making a judgement call on the person that was flying, other than to look at the situation precisely as the FAA would. You can't have a pilot that is neither part of mission planning or execution while at the same time having another person calling the shots without this happening. Flight regulations as established by the FAA are there for a reason.

 

[Deleted member 114292]

I'm not outraged in the slightest, nor judging his training. But unless he was instructed to do a one-way mission then it's still pilot error.

Well I didn’t mean you but I do mean to say there could be way more to the story than we know perhaps it was his plan to land on the ship if his battery went low and at the last minute they said - no ditch it.

Perhaps one of the batteries had gone bad and he wasn’t responsible for maintenance so he had no idea.

Perhaps they put a new and different payload and did not give him a chance to practice with it.

He definitely was ordered to ditch it. At least according to the article.