DJI should release a Mavic Mini 2 in 2020!

[DanMan32]

In the case of prohibition though, it was a nightmare to enforce and ended up causing more crime than it was intended to solve.
There is some correlation though. It was supposed to target production and consumption of distilled liquor, and not so much moderate consumption of beer and wine. All were prohibited though, an overreach.

In the case of quads, there's a diverse spectrum of use and capabilities. Yet all the regulations are pretty much under the same umbrella, and some mixed in with manned aircraft.

 

[TDZHDTV]

Yes, DJI will release C2 classification drones not meet the new ESEA European standards coming into force July 2020. If the Mini ‘2’ is certified and rebranded without optional extras, thus maintaining a maximum take off weight of 249g (current Mini is approx 272g MTW) it will be classes as a toy and while still requiring registration due to onboard camera will be able to be flown with much less stringent distances of uninvolved people and property.

 

[old man mavic]

Yes, DJI will release C2 classification drones not meet the new ESEA European standards coming into force July 2020. If the Mini ‘2’ is certified and rebranded without optional extras, thus maintaining a maximum take off weight of 249g (current Mini is approx 272g MTW) it will be classes as a toy and while still requiring registration due to onboard camera will be able to be flown with much less stringent distances of uninvolved people and property.

where do you get your MTW in brackets from

 

[TDZHDTV]

where do you get your MTW in brackets from

It’s the weight of the prop guards and sticker pack, basically any official accessory that can be added to the Mini adds to its maximum take off weigh, 272g is approximate. If DJI rename the Mini, add low speed mode (tripod) don’t sell extras and certify it it will gain C2 status.

 

[kingsnake11]

Does anyone know if Transport Canada is planning to change the rules in regards to MM, are the announcing decisions like that with enough time so people can plan the next steps, like selling drone or getting a licence?

This is a really good question. The 250g limit was a set from some, what I would consider flawed, experiments with collision testing on aircraft. While in Canada indeed it's true that under 250grams does not require registration, you still have to adhere to several rules. The big one is 900.06 which basically states that you have to fly in a safe manner. You still shouldn't fly over people, cars, etc even with small drones. A friend of mine had the RCMP show up while he was flying his 100g whoop in his front yard. He lives 2 miles from the nearest airport, and has 100 ft trees around his property, yet he was reported to the tower by a pilot at 500 feet. The limit of 250g was I believe fairly arbitrary and like all printed regulations, an amendment is just one idiot away. At a recent meeting with a MAAC representative, he did say that the limit is being re-visited by TC so I would not be surprised to see the registration requirement being amended so that they all have to be registered. The other factor that is perhaps fueling this is that of the estimated 140,000 RPAS pilots (and drones) in Canada that should be registered, only around 32000 have bothered to get their registration (29000 basic, and 3000 advanced, but this is misleading because almost all advanced pilots got their basic first, so the real number is probably closer to 30000). Either their estimates were off, or there are a lot of drones collecting dust and people who just gave up the hobby. If their estimates are correct, only 20% or so have registered. I suspect that latter as it seems to be harder to sell drones, at least in my area, with a lot of folks I personally now that fly, have tried to get rid of their drones with little success.

TC also estimated that there are 200,000 drones in Canada that should have been registered, but only 38,000 have. As a matter of interest, 81% or so of the registered drones are DJI, and yes, even mini's have been registered. Of 245 different manufactures, only 4 represent 86% of all registered drones.

The bottom line is that nothing is static and as several countries have done away with the 250g limit, or never had a limit for registration, I wouldn't be surprised if this was done away with by TC, and in the US by the FAA sometime in the near future.

The statistics I mention are directly from TC, but if you want more detail, Don Joyce made a nice video outlining the numbers:

if you're interested.
cheers
ks

 

[Enzobass]

I agree the current Mavic Mini price is sweet! and good entry Drone just Fix the Bug's! and add Follow me! (I really don't mind the Wifi dropping, as one cannot expect to get 1km range out of a $500 drone)

Follow ME can be added via firmware update, and some think that props hitting the body can be fixed by adding a spacer between the motor and prop or a more rigid filler vs foam in the front arms... but are they flexible for a reason?? some mentioned that if they made the arms rigid, then the Mini has some resonance issues? maybe thus why the flexible arms and foam?
WHY ARE FOLKS TRYING TO FIX A DRONE THAT LAUNCHED IN OCT 2019?? AND SHOULD BE STILL UNDER WARRANTY? Not sure what I am missing here?

Back to my original comment, Why would DJI launch a new Mini v2 when this one is doing so well... I go back to my initial observation with the Mavic Pro.... Why did DJI Launch a Mavic Platinum 12months after the Pro? A color change and new Quiet props and we have a new Model! So if they fix the props hitting and update firmware to give the unit follow me...voila Mavic Mini Platinum, and DJI makes $50 more profit!

I agree it's just a matter of time that Canada follows the USA and changes the law and says that all Drones have to follow the same rules of >250grams.… that would suck as right now the only reason I want this drone is that I can fly it in my backyard!

So to all those that own a Mini, should I buy one now? or wait for the Mini Platinum (LOL).

 

[ThorDar]

Does anyone know if Transport Canada is planning to change the rules in regards to MM, are the announcing decisions like that with enough time so people can plan the next steps, like selling drone or getting a licence?

Extremely remote the regulations in Canada will be changing in regards to the Mini in the near future. The regulations as they are now were developed over many years and in consultation with multiple stakeholders and international organizations, including Dji.

The 250g number wasn't picked out of the air. It's based on multiple studies and tests on damage and injury risk. There were several revisions before the final regs were settled on and implemented last year. Among some other basic universal regulations that came out of the consultations, many countries that have or are implementing their own regulations are using the 250g number as the base weight for registration and pilot certification/testing.

Additionally, Dji is a smart company. It's unlikely they would have bothered to invest the time and money developing the Mini to begin with if they thought there was a chance of that number changing anytime soon.

All that said, if you're planning to stay in the hobby, it's probably not a bad idea to go ahead and get your basic pilot's certificate anyway. Odds are if you're like many of us, once you're hooked, you'll want to eventually upgrade to something bigger.

And yes, any changes, as unlikely as they are at this point, will have plenty of lead time.

 

[Deleted member 109934]

Extremely remote the regulations in Canada will be changing in regards to the Mini in the near future. The regulations as they are now were developed over many years and in consultation with multiple stakeholders and international organizations, including Dji.

The 250g number wasn't picked out of the air. It's based on multiple studies and tests on damage and injury risk. There were several revisions before the final regs were settled on and implemented last year. Among some other basic universal regulations that came out of the consultations, many countries that have or are implementing their own regulations are using the 250g number as the base weight for registration and pilot certification/testing.

Additionally, Dji is a smart company. It's unlikely they would have bothered to invest the time and money developing the Mini to begin with if they thought there was a chance of that number changing anytime soon.

All that said, if you're planning to stay in the hobby, it's probably not a bad idea to go ahead and get your basic pilot's certificate anyway. Odds are if you're like many of us, once you're hooked, you'll want to eventually upgrade to something bigger.

And yes, any changes, as unlikely as they are at this point, will have plenty of lead time.

I understand 250g limit was based on kinetic energy calculations. MM is safe for everything and everyone, besides other commercial drones, so regulations might change once commercial drones will hit the market. I'm absolutely hooked, but if they change the regulations I'm out, I have a few other hobbies that require way less sacrifice. I will keep MM and fly in my yard just for fun.

 

[Deleted member 109934]

This is a really good question. The 250g limit was a set from some, what I would consider flawed, experiments with collision testing on aircraft. While in Canada indeed it's true that under 250grams does not require registration, you still have to adhere to several rules. The big one is 900.06 which basically states that you have to fly in a safe manner. You still shouldn't fly over people, cars, etc even with small drones. A friend of mine had the RCMP show up while he was flying his 100g whoop in his front yard. He lives 2 miles from the nearest airport, and has 100 ft trees around his property, yet he was reported to the tower by a pilot at 500 feet. The limit of 250g was I believe fairly arbitrary and like all printed regulations, an amendment is just one idiot away. At a recent meeting with a MAAC representative, he did say that the limit is being re-visited by TC so I would not be surprised to see the registration requirement being amended so that they all have to be registered. The other factor that is perhaps fueling this is that of the estimated 140,000 RPAS pilots (and drones) in Canada that should be registered, only around 32000 have bothered to get their registration (29000 basic, and 3000 advanced, but this is misleading because almost all advanced pilots got their basic first, so the real number is probably closer to 30000). Either their estimates were off, or there are a lot of drones collecting dust and people who just gave up the hobby. If their estimates are correct, only 20% or so have registered. I suspect that latter as it seems to be harder to sell drones, at least in my area, with a lot of folks I personally now that fly, have tried to get rid of their drones with little success.

TC also estimated that there are 200,000 drones in Canada that should have been registered, but only 38,000 have. As a matter of interest, 81% or so of the registered drones are DJI, and yes, even mini's have been registered. Of 245 different manufactures, only 4 represent 86% of all registered drones.

The bottom line is that nothing is static and as several countries have done away with the 250g limit, or never had a limit for registration, I wouldn't be surprised if this was done away with by TC, and in the US by the FAA sometime in the near future.

The statistics I mention are directly from TC, but if you want more detail, Don Joyce made a nice video outlining the numbers:

if you're interested.
cheers
ks

Very interesting facts, thanks for sharing. That pilot reporting whoop had to have superhuman vision

 

[ThorDar]

I understand 250g limit was based on kinetic energy calculations. MM is safe for everything and everyone, besides other commercial drones, so regulations might change once commercial drones will hit the market. I'm absolutely hooked, but if they change the regulations I'm out, I have a few other hobbies that require way less sacrifice. I will keep MM and fly in my yard just for fun.

Not sure what you mean by "once commercial drones will hit the market"?

 

[Deleted member 109934]

Not sure what you mean by "once commercial drones will hit the market"?

The time when we will be getting amazon\wallmart\pizzapizza order in 1h with drone similar to this Home - Drone Delivery Canada

 

[ThorDar]

The time when we will be getting amazon\wallmart\pizzapizza order in 1h with drone similar to this Home - Drone Delivery Canada

Oh drone delivery. That's what confused me. Drones are already being used for dozens of commercial, industrial and enterprise applications.

 

[bcfd29]

You make several strong points, the only one I question slightly is the third paragraph. IMO often once a regulation is in place, it’s easier for the government to let it ride than back it off. There are some exceptions, however, I think it’s best (and safest for us) to get it right the first time.

My only reply would be based on what we are seeing in aviation re: the evolution of more integration of tech into navigation and flight planning/traffic control and how this has changed regs accordingly. The way DC works these days ANY laws will take forever to get passed...

 

[kingsnake11]

Very interesting facts, thanks for sharing. That pilot reporting whoop had to have superhuman vision

No kidding...my old Mk I eyeballs would never have seen it. I had coffee yesterday with my buddy and he confirmed that the RCMP officer told him that it was from a pilot report to the tower. He agrees that he had no idea how the pilot saw the drone, but he did agree with my suspicion that what the pilot saw, was my buddy with his FPV goggles and something in his hand (transmitter) and assumed there was a drone flying. Human nature to assume when you have a prejudice... especially toward drones. That makes more sense to me.

 

[Deleted member 109934]

No kidding...my old Mk I eyeballs would never have seen it. I had coffee yesterday with my buddy and he confirmed that the RCMP officer told him that it was from a pilot report to the tower. He agrees that he had no idea how the pilot saw the drone, but he did agree with my suspicion that what the pilot saw, was my buddy with his FPV goggles and something in his hand (transmitter) and assumed there was a drone flying. Human nature to assume when you have a prejudice... especially toward drones. That makes more sense to me.

There is quite a lot of pilots flying drones, I have a good friend of my flying passenger jets for a living and in free time he flies FPV races and also has mavic pro. In his opinion drone laws in Canada are ridiculous.

 

[Thomas B]

The time when we will be getting amazon\wallmart\pizzapizza order in 1h with drone similar to this Home - Drone Delivery Canada

I won’t! First, I have a property with a lot of trees in excess of 75’ tall, second I have outside dogs front and back, and third I live on a dead end private road ...everyone here is here for the relative quiet of the location. Those delivery drones are huge and very noisy compared to consumer drones.
I have already informed Amazon and UPS that I will not order anything that can’t be delivered by a driver and delivery truck.
Just my $0.02

 

[kingsnake11]

There is quite a lot of pilots flying drones, I have a good friend of my flying passenger jets for a living and in free time he flies FPV races and also has mavic pro. In his opinion drone laws in Canada are ridiculous.

One of my flying buddy is a 737 pilot for a major airline who loves flying his RC and drones with his son... unfortunately, like in everything, there are going to be those opposed to whatever you're doing. As somebody who has gone through the process of getting the basic and advanced certifications here in Canada, I too believe that while the new rules are excessive, it was brought on by people flying like idiots, or the perception of people with drones doing stupid things. YouTube had it's fair share of those moments uploaded...my favourite act of stupidity was a group flying from one pickup to another on a busy highway narrowly missing cars...and then being dumb enough to post it. TC, like all bureaucracies always take the easy way out...and in Canada, it was a measure to what TC believes is a move to get rpas pilots to act more responsibly and professionally. To that end, they added the section 900 to the Canadian Aviation Regulations, or CARS, that govern all aviation rules, manned, and now unmanned. This is what they have done. The exam for the TC advanced certification is harder and broader in scope than the US part 107 exam in my humble view and is very similar to the exam one needs to take for a private pilots certification. One can argue why somebody flying a DJI spark would have to know airport procedures and markings, procedures for uncontrolled airports and radio operations to get the advanced certification, but there it is. Also, to get the advanced certification you have to do a flight test with a flight reviewer (which is what I am working on) where it isn't a matter of just showing you can fly the aircraft, it's demonstrating that you can also follow procedures, including flight and site planning, checklist and logging, execute a flight plan, emergency procedures etc. No different than when I did manned flying. One can argue that they have gone overboard, but the fact is, if you want to continue to fly rpas's in Canada in non G class airspace, you either follow the new laws or risk fines. MAAC fields have exemptions, but that is another issue.
cheers
ks

 

[Deleted member 109934]

I won’t! First, I have a property with a lot of trees in excess of 75’ tall, second I have outside dogs front and back, and third I live on a dead end private road ...everyone here is here for the relative quiet of the location. Those delivery drones are huge and very noisy compared to consumer drones.
I have already informed Amazon and UPS that I will not order anything that can’t be delivered by a driver and delivery truck.
Just my $0.02

good on you, at one point the scale tips and they will say sorry; you can pick up your items from distribution center yourself It might take a while.
Some of my friends they have to pick up their mail form postal office or group mailboxes because Canada post does not provide service in their area to individual houses. Once service stops being financially feasible it will be discontinued.

 

[Thomas B]

good on you, at one point the scale tips and they will say sorry; you can pick up your items from distribution center yourself It might take a while.
Some of my friends they have to pick up their mail form postal office or group mailboxes because Canada post does not provide service in their area to individual houses. Once service stops being financially feasible it will be discontinued.

Sooty to hear about that kind of service from Canada Post.
I may have pick up items... but not if enough folks refuse drone delivery. My action will be never to order the item from an entity using drone delivery.... For instance, Amazon is a reseller or a marketplace.... so I’ll buy direct for example.

 

[ThorDar]

It's turning out that implementing drone delivery on a mass scale, especially in urban areas, is a lot more complicated than initially envisioned. While It's technically possible to use a drone to make a long distance delivery and has been done successfully in some testing, those tests have been very limited in scope. At this point, it's looking like wide scale door to door delivery is a long way off yet. There are still a lot of technical, safety and social issues to overcome yet.

No, drone delivery still isn’t ready for prime time

Despite incremental progress and limited regulatory approval in the U.S. and Australia, drone delivery still isn’t a viable option in the vast majority of use cases.

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