FAA Drone ID Proposal:

[sar104]

From how I read this in essence the FAA is grounding all non commercial drones.

If internet is required I guess you can fly in your front yard unless internet is needed all the time. Net no internet connection will allow this over any distance and height.

Also as previously mentioned how will you be able to fly in National Forest or remote areas that currently have no restrictions? You can’t establish a internet connection in the field.

Lastly this implies that all current drones sold by DJI would not work as none have any built in remote id capability that I know of. Sure DJI says this can be added via software but not sure how easily this will happen.

Big issue for me is fact that most folks places currently fly don’t have internet thus no remote id via software or built in would work

Also most internet works are locked. There are not public networks for flying. So you are going to be limited to your front yard.

Sad day.

Paul C

This is getting ridiculous. That is not what the proposal says at all. It does not rely on an internet connection:

a. Standard Remote Identification UAS​

​

For purposes of this proposed rule, a “standard remote identification UAS” is a UAS with remote identification equipment capable of both: (1) connecting to the internet and transmitting through that internet connection to a Remote ID USS; and (2) broadcasting directly from the unmanned aircraft. Standard remote identification UAS are discussed further in section X.A.1 of this preamble. Any person operating a standard remote identification UAS would be required to ensure:​

​

• · The UAS was designed and produced to meet the minimum performance requirements of the rule using an FAA-accepted means of compliance for standard remote identification UAS. Persons would be able to meet this obligation by ensuring that the serial number of the standard remote identification UAS is listed on an FAA-accepted declaration of compliance. A person operating a UAS would be able to read the label on the aircraft indicating whether the UAS is a standard or limited remote identification UAS. Additionally, a person could determine whether the UAS is listed on an FAA-accepted declaration of compliance by verifying the status on the FAA’s website. The standard remote identification UAS broadcasts the remote identification message elements directly from the unmanned aircraft from takeoff to landing.
  • · When the internet is available at takeoff, the standard remote identification UAS connects to the internet and transmits the required message elements through that internet connection to a Remote ID USS.

 

[Drone on]

Well, it was fun while it lasted.
Drones are getting pretty boring anyway

 

[Matriculated01]

Well, it was fun while it lasted.
Drones are getting pretty boring anyway

Noooooooo!
I am just getting into the hobby, it’s still fresh and fun. How come nobody is discussing what is really going on here? The gigantic commercial interests are buying up the airspace all to themselves via the puppets we call politicians/regulators and pushing out us recreational, normal people all under the guise of “safety.” This is regulatory over reach if that phrase has any meaning. You and I can’t fly our drones because Amazon needs the skies for their drone feet to be unobstructed. This is ridiculous.

 

[AMann]

This is getting ridiculous. That is not what the proposal says at all. It does not rely on an internet connection:

a. Standard Remote Identification UAS​

​

For purposes of this proposed rule, a “standard remote identification UAS” is a UAS with remote identification equipment capable of both: (1) connecting to the internet and transmitting through that internet connection to a Remote ID USS; and (2) broadcasting directly from the unmanned aircraft. Standard remote identification UAS are discussed further in section X.A.1 of this preamble. Any person operating a standard remote identification UAS would be required to ensure:​

​

• · The UAS was designed and produced to meet the minimum performance requirements of the rule using an FAA-accepted means of compliance for standard remote identification UAS. Persons would be able to meet this obligation by ensuring that the serial number of the standard remote identification UAS is listed on an FAA-accepted declaration of compliance. A person operating a UAS would be able to read the label on the aircraft indicating whether the UAS is a standard or limited remote identification UAS. Additionally, a person could determine whether the UAS is listed on an FAA-accepted declaration of compliance by verifying the status on the FAA’s website. The standard remote identification UAS broadcasts the remote identification message elements directly from the unmanned aircraft from takeoff to landing.
  • · When the internet is available at takeoff, the standard remote identification UAS connects to the internet and transmits the required message elements through that internet connection to a Remote ID USS.

So essentially, DJI could do this with existing drones using updated software to have the controller ping out the drone’s location and id through a phone, but that would only work if the connection to the drone is stable. Otherwise, one would use a cellular GSM enabled tag like an Trackimo?

 

[HappyHours]

This would result in a huge class action lawsuit against DJI or any other manufacturer that did such a thing. The claimants would handily win.

Yeah not

 

[BigAl07]

Noooooooo!
I am just getting into the hobby, it’s still fresh and fun. How come nobody is discussing what is really going on here? The gigantic commercial interests are buying up the airspace all to themselves via the puppets we call politicians/regulators and pushing out us recreational, normal people all under the guise of “safety.” This is regulatory over reach if that phrase has any meaning. You and I can’t fly our drones because Amazon needs the skies for their drone feet to be unobstructed. This is ridiculous.

This allows ALL of us to fly in the NAS in a more safe manner. It's not putting anyone or anything OUT just like having to have headlights & taillights on cars only meant people needed to upgrade their equipment.

 

[Matriculated01]

I have not had a chance to read the whole thing, but it appears there will be a 400’ limit on DISTANCE, not only AGL altitude. Is this correct? Can anyone confirm/deny for sure?

 

[Matriculated01]

This allows ALL of us to fly in the NAS in a more safe manner. It's not putting anyone or anything OUT just like having to have headlights & taillights on cars only meant people needed to upgrade their equipment.

So you’ve already read the whole thing and understand it fully? You have way too much trust in the people writing the rules. Give them the power and they will keep squeezing and squeezing until most people just give up and it becomes accepted as conventional that of course if you want to fly your drone you should go to the allocated “drone park.” You expected to just fly freely as long as you’re not endangering anyone and following some basic rules? Fanatic opinions, just be quiet and fall in line.

 

[Paul2660]

Hi Sar104,

I am not trying to over react. From the literature the FAA provided in the email I received, there are only 3 methods, 2 required internet for remote id, the 3rd is when remote id can't be obtained, net you are flying in a AMA field or similar spot. Sorry if I read this wrong, as your knowledge base is much greater than mine. But from reading just the email and their proposal that is linked, I don't feel it's ridiculous. But I guess time will tell.

I am also concerned as I use the smart controller, there is no cell phone connection. I realize that with the standard controller and a cell phone, with some new software from DJI, remote id can work possibly since cell service would allow connection to the internet, however with the smart controller, it only has wifi and thus you would be locked out of 99% of all networks.

I only fly in remote parts of my State, all National Forest or Private land, where I have permission. 85% of these spots have no cell phone connection thus no remote id would be possible, so if I read the literature from the FAA proposal, I could not fly legally by their new rules. Instead only on a AMA field or similar spot.

Sorry if I have this incorrect.

Paul C

 

[Chip]

So essentially, DJI could do this with existing drones with a updated controller that interfaces via bluetooth with your phone to connect to internet. But that would only work if the connection to the drone is stable.

Interesting question. DJI was originally dead set against this when it brought out Aeroscope:

Because AeroScope relies on drones directly broadcasting their information to local receivers, not on transmitting data to an internet-based service, it ensures most drone flights will not be automatically recorded in government databases, protecting the privacy interests of people and businesses that use drones.

This system is consistent with DJI’s problem-solving approach to drone regulation, which aims to strike a reasonable balance between authorities’ need to identify drones that raise concerns and drone pilots’ right to fly without pervasive surveillance.

 

[HappyHours]

Noooooooo!
I am just getting into the hobby, it’s still fresh and fun. How come nobody is discussing what is really going on here? The gigantic commercial interests are buying up the airspace all to themselves via the puppets we call politicians/regulators and pushing out us recreational, normal people all under the guise of “safety.” This is regulatory over reach if that phrase has any meaning. You and I can’t fly our drones because Amazon needs the skies for their drone feet to be unobstructed. This is ridiculous.

It wasn’t lost on me that the notice just happened to be located on the amazon server farm, hah

 

[Evmoius]

This allows ALL of us to fly in the NAS in a more safe manner. It's not putting anyone or anything OUT just like having to have headlights & taillights on cars only meant people needed to upgrade their equipment.

I have a lot of gripes with this proposal but probably the biggest one is that they don't seem to make any kind of allowance for flying in uncontrolled airspace. If a plane can take off in class G with no transponder or radio then why would a drone have these limitations put on it?

Also the direct line to an ambiguous "Law Enforcement" really shows this for what it is. They assume we're all criminals who need to be caught and punished.

I can guarantee if this goes into effect as is there will be almost zero compliance among the vast majority of builders.

 

[Matriculated01]

Interesting question. DJI was originally dead set against this when it brought out Aeroscope:

Because AeroScope relies on drones directly broadcasting their information to local receivers, not on transmitting data to an internet-based service, it ensures most drone flights will not be automatically recorded in government databases, protecting the privacy interests of people and businesses that use drones.

This system is consistent with DJI’s problem-solving approach to drone regulation, which aims to strike a reasonable balance between authorities’ need to identify drones that raise concerns and drone pilots’ right to fly without pervasive surveillance.

View attachment 88853

Anyone who thinks the government is being truthful when they say “Scout’s honor, we won’t be unreasonable in our surveillance, we’d never use this newly acquired tracking capability malevolently or illegally” hasn’t been paying attention over the last 15-20 years. The idea that this is no different than headlights on a car as a safety measure is ridiculous. Do my car’s headlights let the government know of my location? Just wait and see how this will be abused and how quickly promises of privacy protections will fall by the wayside.

 

[Deleted member 93449]

This is getting ridiculous. That is not what the proposal says at all. It does not rely on an internet connection:

a. Standard Remote Identification UAS​

​

For purposes of this proposed rule, a “standard remote identification UAS” is a UAS with remote identification equipment capable of both: (1) connecting to the internet and transmitting through that internet connection to a Remote ID USS; and (2) broadcasting directly from the unmanned aircraft. Standard remote identification UAS are discussed further in section X.A.1 of this preamble. Any person operating a standard remote identification UAS would be required to ensure:​

​

• · The UAS was designed and produced to meet the minimum performance requirements of the rule using an FAA-accepted means of compliance for standard remote identification UAS. Persons would be able to meet this obligation by ensuring that the serial number of the standard remote identification UAS is listed on an FAA-accepted declaration of compliance. A person operating a UAS would be able to read the label on the aircraft indicating whether the UAS is a standard or limited remote identification UAS. Additionally, a person could determine whether the UAS is listed on an FAA-accepted declaration of compliance by verifying the status on the FAA’s website. The standard remote identification UAS broadcasts the remote identification message elements directly from the unmanned aircraft from takeoff to landing.
  • · When the internet is available at takeoff, the standard remote identification UAS connects to the internet and transmits the required message elements through that internet connection to a Remote ID USS.

You lost me with "it does not rely on an internet connection". If one of the requirements says "connecting to the internet and transmitting through that internet connection" followed by "and" broadcasting directly from the aircraft how can it not be relying on an internet connection? If 1 and 2 were separated by "or" I could understand that you wouldn't be relying on an internet connection but there is no "or" in the statement.

 

[JAW]

Scary part (p.31 of the proposal)

This proposed rule would result in additional costs for persons responsible for the production of UAS, owners and operators of registered unmanned aircraft, community based organizations,

 

[Matriculated01]

It wasn’t lost on me that the notice just happened to be located on the amazon server farm, hah

Interesting, isn’t it?

 

[Kombucha]

If you want to fly in the old drone ghetto...

From the proposal:
"Because his UAS does not have any remote identification capabilities, Linus knows he may only operate it within an FAA-recognized identification area."

This rule is horrible for drone owners.

 

[tcope]

.

We knew it may come to this, self regulation obviously isn’t working for some, and many here have been trying to help educate those who pushed the rules.

It will be an interesting rule to implement, and to follow. My main question is What will happen for those of us who fly in unregulated open space with no internet and cell coverage.

In truth, self regulation was working just fine. How many people are flying drones? How many have posed a real problem? My parents bought me a bow and arrow when I was a teen. No regulation on just shooting it. Probably more accidents from that then use of drones.

 

[JAW]

You lost me with "it does not rely on an internet connection". If one of the requirements says "connecting to the internet and transmitting through that internet connection" followed by "and" broadcasting directly from the aircraft how can it not be relying on an internet connection? If 1 and 2 were separated by "or" I could understand that you wouldn't be relying on an internet connection but there is no "or" in the statement.

See p.22 of the proposal (at the bottom.). It explains how things work when an internet connection is NOT available.

	No person would be allowed to operate a UAS within the airspace of the United States unless the operation is conducted under one of the following: (1) the UAS is a standard remote identification UAS and that person complies with the requirements of § 89.110; (2) the UAS is a limited remote identification UAS and that person complies with the requirements of § 89.115; or (3) the UAS does not have remote identification equipment and that person complies with the requirements of § 89.120.
	(Standard) Remote identification: If the internet is available at takeoff, the UAS would have to do the following from takeoff to landing: (1) connect to the internet and transmit the required remote identification message elements through that internet connection to a Remote ID USS; and (2) broadcast the message elements directly from the unmanned aircraft. If the internet is unavailable at takeoff, or if during the flight, the unmanned aircraft can no longer transmit through an internet connection to a Remote ID USS, the UAS would have to broadcast the message elements directly from the unmanned aircraft from takeoff to landing.
In-flight loss of broadcast capability:	A person manipulating the flight controls of a standard remote identification UAS that can no longer broadcast the message elements would have to land as soon as practicable.

 

[AMann]

. In truth, self regulation was working just fine. How many people are flying drones? How many have posed a real problem? My parents bought me a bow and arrow when I was a teen. No regulation on just shooting it. Probably more accidents from that then use of drones.

Yeah you’re right, my dad’s car kept getting arrows in it at school because the staff parking lot was behind the archery range. Go figure!