How I would like to see regulations tweaked for US national parks

[Duckhunter50]

Yes it is an NFS/NOS posted policy.

I don't understand your answer to my question.

 

[Thomas B]

I don't understand your answer to my question.

NFS and NPS have posted policies.

 

[Duckhunter50]

NFS and NPS have posted policies.

I bet they have. My question is are there regulations more recent than the memo I linked to?

 

[Thomas B]

All sarcasm aside... here is the newest info

Drones in National Parks: What Every Drone Pilot Needs to Know

Can you fly a drone in a national park? Learn about the drone ban in national parks, exceptions, and notable rogue drone incidents.

uavcoach.com

For more contact the agency involved directly

 

[Yeunglings]

My 2 cents are that I can see both sides of the debate. I would like to enjoy the parks as peacefully as possible but there are also instances where I would Love to have THAT picture or short video. I dont believe that either a blanket no drones or every drone possible approach works well for everyone or every park. And a 1 size fits all for the number of drones allowed or when doesn't either. Valley Forge is a national park, and has private residences butting right up to it, but then has an RC airport smack dab in the middle. I can't just go in to the park and fly my drone in one of the wide open fields but I can get a membership or day pass to the RC club and fly there if I have an rc plane. PA also has 121 State parks but only allows flying in 6 of them. And in very small , designated areas. Some make sense due to size, shape, location or what have you but seriously to not be able to fly at all in over 95 percent of the parks seems ridiculous. Like was mentioned earlier if you let the individual Ranger in charge dictate the when, where, how many and then issue permits( with an associated reasonable cost) that can change based on what the season is I think that is doable. Obviously if there are a ton of people in the park, or such an assumption can accurately be made, you don't issue as many, or any for that matter, for the day. Same would go for if there's high winds, high probability of accidental fires, migrations or nesting and so forth. I would hate to know that my desire for a pic endangered some other animal or really intruded on someone else experiencing nature. But, within reason and safety being taken in to account, can't I also be allowed to enjoy it in my own way? Some responsible pilots won't like not being able to get just the right shot but would understand. The general public who sees what is allowed because its posted in plain English would, hopefully, understand as well. Maybe the NPS needs to get in touch with forums like this, local RC clubs and the public to have an open and honest conversation about it. I dont think it's unreasonable to want to fly if you're willing to follow the rules and be considerate of the environment and others.

 

[dronerdave]

I would like to use my flying camera in US National parks. There are some great shots that can't be taken because of the regulations. I understand the need to have some of those regulations in place. I can only Imagine how many drones there might be in the air when Old Faithful erupts in Yellowstone. It really makes sense to clamp down on that kind of thing in some places. I also can see how the peaceful and quiet atmosphere would be disturbed by what sounds like a swarm of angry bees. I also realized that the entirety Of Lake Powell is also a national recreation area. So drones are banned there too. In a place like Lake Powell that is large and sparsely populated it doesn't make as much sense to me.

So my proposal would be similar to the Nation Parks (specifically Yellowstone National Park) policy on backcountry hiking. They have a system of permits that enable people to hike in the backcountry. I would like to see a process that enables people who want to use a drone recreationly to video/photograph certian points of interest to be able to apply for a permit for a date and time of day. That way the park can keep track of who is using a drone, where, when and we can get unique photos of some amazing places.

I'm interested if this proposal would be realistic or completly out of bounds. I'm more familiar with national parks in the Western U.S. so I dont know what it would look like in those places. I'd like any input from others.

I am advocating for a system that one could obtain a permit to film a point of interest or location as easily as it to obtain a backcountry hiking permit. I think the park manager should be able to limit permits to a certain number and make areas off limits if appropriate. The process as it is now is a very burdensome.

Edited to clarify and condense

Nice idea but.... First, most national parks draws visitors at all times of the year. Points of interest are what many come to see. If I drove a long way to visit a park, I wouldn't really want to spend a day sharing these prime areas with multirotors flying about. Although the parks usually have vista points for ground photography, if I want to shoot some stills with my tripod mounted telephoto equipped DSLR, for the most part I wouldn't want a drone to suddenly pop up in my long range capture of something like Half Dome. I get upset when visitors walk into a restricted area to get that special up close shot and are in my ground cameras view. It would be difficult to keep drone operators corralled so to speak when using designated photography areas...much more difficult than dealing with the walking photographer. It's the aircraft's mobility that comes into play that might pose a problem during particular flight paths especially longer distance runs. Then there is the uninformed who would say, I saw one flying so I didn't know you have to have a permit. Kids come to mind. Throw in the animal disruption card & my guess is a blanket rule (as unfair as it seems to drone operators) is so much more easy and less costly to enforce. It's kind of a reason many National Parks don't allow ATV's. They just can't get all of them to stick to designated paths and some offenders feel it's OK to blase new trails because nobody is around. About the only way I see it working would be to have individual places controlled by a on site park official (a Docent) that monitors every operators flight to make sure they stay in compliance. I mean it is possible but unlikely IMO. Let's just hope they don't lock down drone use in National Forest areas here in the US.

 

[bushie]

We are lucky here in WA.UAVs were banned up until a couple of years ago but provided you comply with CASA regs and don't disturb animals you can fly. I guess we do not have the population pressure some other places have. Half the nation, nearly the same size as USA with only a couple of million people in the state, most around Perth and the SW. Even here you almost never see a UAV.

 

[Paco Bird]

I would like to use my flying camera in US National parks. There are some great shots that can't be taken because of the regulations. I understand the need to have some of those regulations in place. I can only Imagine how many drones there might be in the air when Old Faithful erupts in Yellowstone. It really makes sense to clamp down on that kind of thing in some places. I also can see how the peaceful and quiet atmosphere would be disturbed by what sounds like a swarm of angry bees. I also realized that the entirety Of Lake Powell is also a national recreation area. So drones are banned there too. In a place like Lake Powell that is large and sparsely populated it doesn't make as much sense to me.

So my proposal would be similar to the Nation Parks (specifically Yellowstone National Park) policy on backcountry hiking. They have a system of permits that enable people to hike in the backcountry. I would like to see a process that enables people who want to use a drone recreationly to video/photograph certian points of interest to be able to apply for a permit for a date and time of day. That way the park can keep track of who is using a drone, where, when and we can get unique photos of some amazing places.

I'm interested if this proposal would be realistic or completly out of bounds. I'm more familiar with national parks in the Western U.S. so I dont know what it would look like in those places. I'd like any input from others.

I am advocating for a system that one could obtain a permit to film a point of interest or location as easily as it to obtain a backcountry hiking permit. I think the park manager should be able to limit permits to a certain number and make areas off limits if appropriate. The process as it is now is a very burdensome.

Edited to clarify and condense

I would like to use my flying camera in US National parks. There are some great shots that can't be taken because of the regulations. I understand the need to have some of those regulations in place. I can only Imagine how many drones there might be in the air when Old Faithful erupts in Yellowstone. It really makes sense to clamp down on that kind of thing in some places. I also can see how the peaceful and quiet atmosphere would be disturbed by what sounds like a swarm of angry bees. I also realized that the entirety Of Lake Powell is also a national recreation area. So drones are banned there too. In a place like Lake Powell that is large and sparsely populated it doesn't make as much sense to me.

So my proposal would be similar to the Nation Parks (specifically Yellowstone National Park) policy on backcountry hiking. They have a system of permits that enable people to hike in the backcountry. I would like to see a process that enables people who want to use a drone recreationly to video/photograph certian points of interest to be able to apply for a permit for a date and time of day. That way the park can keep track of who is using a drone, where, when and we can get unique photos of some amazing places.

I'm interested if this proposal would be realistic or completly out of bounds. I'm more familiar with national parks in the Western U.S. so I dont know what it would look like in those places. I'd like any input from others.

I am advocating for a system that one could obtain a permit to film a point of interest or location as easily as it to obtain a backcountry hiking permit. I think the park manager should be able to limit permits to a certain number and make areas off limits if appropriate. The process as it is now is a very burdensome.

Edited to clarify and condense

Anyone's who's been to Yosemite and some of the other National Parks in the last few years knows what a zoo these places are. It's difficult to enjoy with all the attendant noise and impacts of 10,000 of your closest friends nearby all tromping around. Even the back country is crowded now. My two cents are that, for many reasons, including wildlife impacts, potential environmental impacts, noise, safety etc, the restrictions are appropriate. I would not support legalizing, or even implementing a permit system for drones in the National Parks.

 

[tlswift58]

As some will note - you can take off / land outside of a NP and fly in that airspace. Whether you can get some decent shots / video's depends on the NP. For instance - the Blue Ridge Parkway is a NP. Yet at most points - it's maybe 1/2 mile wide and has many public side roads not considered in "the park." So, you can take off / land and fly over that airspace and capture shots like Linn Cove Viaduct and others.

Last year alone - 12.5 MILLION visitors came to the Great Smoky Mountain NP - with Covid and closures no less. GSMNP does beat any other NP by like 3-4x times in visitors. This year is going to be WORSE in every single NP - with some like Yosemite, Rocky Mtn NP, and Glacier requiring Day Passes as well to restrict crowds. This will be the new norm for nearly all NP's in the future.

Would I love to fly my drone in every NP - sure - we all do. Why won't it happen - because some people WOULD NOT follow the rules, they are exempt you know. That alone creates 99% of the issues with lessening any restrictions. Most droners comply with the rules, yet nearly all restrictions everywhere are based on the say 10% that don't. Rules do not apply to them and they can do whatever they want, wherever they want, whenever they want. That burns us all in the long run.

Add in the hundreds to thousands of people in any given NP on any given day - just won't work. Sure there are many places / spots with virtually no people to fly safely - yet again those whom rules do not apply would not go that route. Not the mention to impact on wildlife. While flying 200 or so feet above them may or may not affect them - add in all the people trying to get up close selfies (yes there are distance requirements, but again many do not follow them) and then some drones buzz bombing them for that close-up - Uncle Sugar won't play that game ever.

If you want to get shots in a NP - find a safe location outside the park - take off, fly, shoot your pics / videos, and land. Be happy with what YOU CAN get - it could (and may) get worse as more drones take to the air every year. Not to mention if and when Amazon, UPS, USPS, etc can start delivering packages / mail by drone.

 

[Duckhunter50]

I can understand the cons to having drones in the parks. I'm really not familiar with any national parks on the eastern side of the U.S. I guess when I envisioned the permiting system I tend to think of Yellowstone, Teton, Arches, Zion etc. These are massive parks that encompass huge amounts of land. Flying in from outside isn't an option for some areas as they are surrounded by land that is also inaccessible.
Now in regards to crowds at parks I have no doubt that there are times that they are crowded. Ihave experienced it myself too many times. But that being said I have been at the upper falls of the Yellowstone river with only a few people around in the middle of June. I have been to Delicate Arch where the only people threre were my wife and I. Lake Powell is a national recreation area and drones are prohibited despite 1000's of motorized watercraft roaring around the lake. Adding a drone to the mix would not detrimental in my opinion. There is a road that goes from West Yellowstone,Mt to Bozeman, MT. It passes through Yellowstone park, but only through the outskirts of it. There is no park entrance per'se there but flying there is illegal. It has some beautiful scenery that i would love to photograph from the air if it were allowed.
I think the permiting would take busy times into consideration. The rangers know when it gets busy (i.e. time of day/year). I know the Dead Horse Point state park in Utah prohibits drones during the busy season but alows them during the off-peak time of year.

I guess what bothers me the most is that the memo from 2014 seems to be put in place as a hasty solution until they could firm up some regulations later. As best as I can determine the situation has never been revisited. I think it's reasonable to revisit the memo to see if drone photography could be accommodated.

 

[cdombaxe]

I would like to use my flying camera in US National parks. There are some great shots that can't be taken because of the regulations. I understand the need to have some of those regulations in place. I can only Imagine how many drones there might be in the air when Old Faithful erupts in Yellowstone. It really makes sense to clamp down on that kind of thing in some places. I also can see how the peaceful and quiet atmosphere would be disturbed by what sounds like a swarm of angry bees. I also realized that the entirety Of Lake Powell is also a national recreation area. So drones are banned there too. In a place like Lake Powell that is large and sparsely populated it doesn't make as much sense to me.

So my proposal would be similar to the Nation Parks (specifically Yellowstone National Park) policy on backcountry hiking. They have a system of permits that enable people to hike in the backcountry. I would like to see a process that enables people who want to use a drone recreationly to video/photograph certian points of interest to be able to apply for a permit for a date and time of day. That way the park can keep track of who is using a drone, where, when and we can get unique photos of some amazing places.

I'm interested if this proposal would be realistic or completly out of bounds. I'm more familiar with national parks in the Western U.S. so I dont know what it would look like in those places. I'd like any input from others.

I am advocating for a system that one could obtain a permit to film a point of interest or location as easily as it to obtain a backcountry hiking permit. I think the park manager should be able to limit permits to a certain number and make areas off limits if appropriate. The process as it is now is a very burdensome.

Edited to clarify and condense

I support your idea and I would love to know how we could start or purpose this revision!

 

[wisco_pilot]

I am 100% against changing the current NPS/NFS rules. I do not want to see drones in these areas during hikes, too many stupid operators and "influencers" causing problems already. They already have a method for special permits, no need to re-invent the wheel. I can find other places to fly.