Is my HOA going to be a problem?

[A.O.]

Just makes me appreciate even more living 'in the country' with no neighbors, no noises except insects, squirrels and birds, on a paved 'county-maintained' tertiary road with very little traffic.

Oh yeah, re: sounds... forgot about the coyotes in the distance some nights, the bard owls early morning, and the quail we actively husband with plantings and un-mowed pasture.

Agree completely!! I do a fair amount of shooting along with some of the neighbors, so there is a bit of noise out this way.

 

[BigAl07]

Apparently some things are no longer allowed to talk about here?? Shooting ranges??

Hmmm , I could not post those words in the above post, kept giving me a "oops" message..

I'm not sure "Shooting Ranges" is filtered or not (realize we have had Server Issues for 2 days now) but keep in mind that the topic of Guns is specifically mentioned in the >>>Community Rules<<< which we ALL agreed to upon joining this forum.

Take note of item #13 in the Community Rules:
13. Discussions about politics, weaponry and religion are not permitted in the community and will be closed or removed.

I'm an AVID gun owner/shooter/collector but this forum is NOT the right place for that or any of the above noted topics.

 

[spudster]

Agree completely!! I do a fair amount of shooting along with some of the neighbors, so there is a bit of noise out this way.

I believe that having an HOA would not be the main reasons for restrictions on that. If you live within many, if not all, cities, that would not be allowed. In fact, some HOAs do not restrict that kind of activity.

 

[BigAl07]

I believe that having an HOA would not be the main reasons for restrictions on that. If you live within many, if not all, cities, that would not be allowed. In fact, some HOAs do not restrict that kind of activity.

True!! We "sling lead" in our HOA quite often. Everything from small caliber up to some significant Bang Sticks!!

 

[A.O.]

I'm not sure "Shooting Ranges" is filtered or not (realize we have had Server Issues for 2 days now) but keep in mind that the topic of Guns is specifically mentioned in the >>>Community Rules<<< which we ALL agreed to upon joining this forum.

Take note of item #13 in the Community Rules:
13. Discussions about politics, weaponry and religion are not permitted in the community and will be closed or removed.

I'm an AVID gun owner/shooter/collector but this forum is NOT the right place for that or any of the above noted topics.

I'm good with that, I had just mentioned the ranges on the one post and it wouldn't let me post it, but the next post did.. I am fine with your rules..

 

[A.O.]

I believe that having an HOA would not be the main reasons for restrictions on that. If you live within many, if not all, cities, that would not be allowed. In fact, some HOAs do not restrict that kind of activity.

Yep, I understand that.. I probably wouldn't buy a house within city limits either, for just that reason.

 

[Nobbler]

A recent post I read got me to wondering... I never stopped to consider my HOA might prohibit drone operation i.e. launch/landing from my private property until I read that some HOA's do precisely that. So, I thought I'd check my CCR's to see. While drones are not mentioned, specifically, I noticed these two provisions might be used if someone were to complain:

1. MACHINERY: No Machinery or equipment of any kind shall be placed, operated, or maintained upon any Lot, except such machinery or equipment as is usual and customary in connection with the use or maintenance of a private residence.

2. GOOD NEIGHBOR RULE: This rule asks that all homeowners refrain from any activity that would disturb the pleasant quality of a neighborhood life. This guideline extends to any unacceptable activity that might negatively impact the quiet enjoyment of each homeowner, their radio or TV reception or the Association's insurance rates.

Both of these can be very broadly interpreted, to include drone operation, I would think. In the meantime, I DO want to be a good neighbor and do NOT wish to disturb the peaceful enjoyment of anyone on their property. My general practice is to launch straight up, gain altitude as quickly as possible to maybe 150-250 ft before heading off in any direction. I don't hover over people's houses. I'm usually just flying along, keeping things moving, unless I'm doing a panoramic shot or hyperlapse. I also prefer to fly at dusk or after dark, which could work for or against me. Most people are in their homes during these times, but the drone is also easier to spot, even at maximum altitude of 400'. So I suppose if someone gets a wild hair, not only will they spot the drone more easily, they will also be more easily to see where it lands when I bring it home. For now, I'll just continue to try and be a good neighbor, keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best.

These rules weren't written to be a good neighbor. They were vague to allow a group / particular person power over other members (specifically, those who wish to just be left alone and prone to bouts of agreeableness)

I said it in the other thread, but when it comes to concern over any entity, esp. one with a lopsided power balance and no checks and balances, your best bet is to be invisible.

 

[Tonkin Gulf]

If you live in a HOA, try taking a "Tiny Planet" shot of the Club House. Then put the shot in a 8x8 frame and give it to the Club House for display. Other Home Owners will see it and like it, and just might request their own home shot. Text it to them. They will love it......then you have them on your side.

 

[PompousWindbag]

If you live in a HOA, try taking a "Tiny Planet" shot of the Club House. Then put the shot in a 8x8 frame and give it to the Club House for display. Other Home Owners will see it and like it, and just might request their own home shot. Text it to them. They will love it......then you have them on your side.

Nice thought, but we don't have a clubhouse. Or a common pool. Some small kiddie parks, but that's about it.

 

[CalOldBlue]

Random thoughts/my two cents. If my HOA decided to take action against drones there are processes they must follow, including hearings. I would insert myself in those.

I would make sure they understood that they need to have a reason (justification) for promulgating any new rule against drones (assuming nothing in the existing CC&Rs covers it), or they could face legal challenges:

1) If the justification is privacy, they need to realize there are already rules dealing with privacy issues in most jurisdictions, and they should not create new ones. Let the cops deal with peeping Toms using existing laws.

2) If the justification is related to air space ownership, they need to understand the FAA position on that. Take along a copy of the FAA press release detailing the position. DO NOT downplay the delineation of where local control is allowed... but help them understand what that means in terms of the HOA and the property they control. (In my case, the HOA does not own the streets and individual lots, so they cannot ban takeoffs and landings from my property; they CAN ban takeoffs and landings from common property, like parks and clubhouse. If we were a gated community, they would own the streets and sidewalks, so they could ban there as well... my HOA does not own the streets, the city does).

3) If the justification is noise, they need to understand that a noise rule needs to include ANY source of noise, including leaf blowers, lawn mowers, motorcycles; not just drones. Any drone noise rule that ignored louder and more persistent sources of noise would be subject to a court challenge.

At the end of the day HOA boards are not interested in putting themselves in the position of having to defend lawsuits... help them understand where their authority ends. Nicely. Be helpful. Position yourself as someone who wants to help them understand the boundaries.

Lastly: do not make yourself a nuisance to your neighbors, as HOA boards are political animals and if enough of your neighbors make enough noise, you're going to lose.

EDIT: recent posts triggered a thought. Make sure they understand the difference between Part 107 pilots and recreational pilots, and do they really want to get in the way of licensed professionals trying to do their job (e.g. roof inspections, real estate photos)... if you help them understand the complexities of what they are dealing with them hopefully they will take the time to think about it instead of knee-jerk reacting.

 

[gajman]

A recent post I read got me to wondering... I never stopped to consider my HOA might prohibit drone operation i.e. launch/landing from my private property until I read that some HOA's do precisely that. So, I thought I'd check my CCR's to see. While drones are not mentioned, specifically, I noticed these two provisions might be used if someone were to complain:

1. MACHINERY: No Machinery or equipment of any kind shall be placed, operated, or maintained upon any Lot, except such machinery or equipment as is usual and customary in connection with the use or maintenance of a private residence.

2. GOOD NEIGHBOR RULE: This rule asks that all homeowners refrain from any activity that would disturb the pleasant quality of a neighborhood life. This guideline extends to any unacceptable activity that might negatively impact the quiet enjoyment of each homeowner, their radio or TV reception or the Association's insurance rates.I volunteere

Both of these can be very broadly interpreted, to include drone operation, I would think. In the meantime, I DO want to be a good neighbor and do NOT wish to disturb the peaceful enjoyment of anyone on their property. My general practice is to launch straight up, gain altitude as quickly as possible to maybe 150-250 ft before heading off in any direction. I don't hover over people's houses. I'm usually just flying along, keeping things moving, unless I'm doing a panoramic shot or hyperlapse. I also prefer to fly at dusk or after dark, which could work for or against me. Most people are in their homes during these times, but the drone is also easier to spot, even at maximum altitude of 400'. So I suppose if someone gets a wild hair, not only will they spot the drone more easily, they will also be more easily to see where it lands when I bring it home. For now, I'll just continue to try and be a good neighbor, keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best.

I volunteered to do some beauty shots for our HOA. They were very happy with the results. If you want to risk it, you can offer such service if you are a 107 pilot. On the other hand maybe you don't want to wake a sleeping giant.

 

[PompousWindbag]

I volunteered to do some beauty shots for our HOA. They were very happy with the results. If you want to risk it, you can offer such service if you are a 107 pilot. On the other hand maybe you don't want to wake a sleeping giant.

I'm not a 107 pilot and I don't want to wake a sleeping giant. But thanks. LOL

 

[davey1der]

I guess my question would be, do you really need to launch from your property? Maybe if it’s not an issue, don’t make it one. I don’t completely know the situation, but I guarantee you if it’s not a specific HOA rule today, it very well can be one tomorrow. As pilots, we need to fight the battles that really matter. My HOA does not have any hard and fast rules regarding drone use, however, I don’t give anybody a reason to question making one. As much as I would love to have some cool footage of my house, I’m not one to prove a point because “nothing says I can’t “. Best of luck dealing with this issue, happy flying. Peace.

 

[Robert Prior]

Easy there... it's obvious you're not a fan of an HOA but many of us have enjoyed living in an HOA for many years. It really depends on the individual HOA, their existing bylaws/rules, and on the board governing that HOA. Unfortunately, many HOA's become overrun over time with those who have nothing better to do than worry/complain about every little detail and it ends up being a heated issue within a fairly small community. Those busy bodies get on the board and can literally run it into the ground when they get enough "like minded" people involved.

Our HOA is now 23 years old and still just as easy going and FUN as it was when first created (I was involved with the building of the subdivision many years ago long before I purchased land and "entered" the HOA). Yes we have rules (cars must be tagged and operational if outside, can't block roads, house can't look like it's out of a 70's cartoon, no farm animals....) but the rule were in place prior to me buying the property and I approved of them then and still do today.

My neighbor bought a "cough-used-cough" RV a few weeks ago. He plans to strip it down and do a complete overhaul (I suggest using dynamite as it looks beyond repair) for when he retires in a few years. This thing was brought in on a roll back as it has flat/rotten tires, the front has NO siding so it's exposed furring strips and insulation hanging out, and looks like it sat under a maple syrup plant dripping on it for years. He parked it Front & Center of his house on the MAIN road for all to see and "enjoy". For a day or two it was no big deal as I was confident it was going to be moved/removed at any moment. It didn't move for a week but fortunately the President of the HOA happens to live directly across from that neighbor. I saw them having a conversation, walking around the RV looking, pointing and a lot of head shaking.... the next morning the RV was moved into my neighbors basement and out of sight. Come to find out, he was intending to leave it like that on the main road in full view of everyone until spring so he could source parts and get his ducks in a row for the rebuild. Negative LOL!

In stark contrast, there is another community directly across the hill from ours (thank goodness the hill is a visual and audible buffer)... it's 15 years younger and has no HOA. Even at 400' AGL you can tell a marked difference between a "Community Ran" housing area and a "free for all" housing area. The neighboring community literally has cars sitting ON cars, RV's parked in their community road half disassembled, litter and trash on the roads, in the yards, and spewed out in almost every place you can toss your old fast food litter. One of the homes has a "storage building" (I use that word loosely) that is literally old wooden pallets stacked and 2 tarps (one blue and one silver) as the roof. It currently has the remains of a fallen bradford pear tree connecting the "Roof" to the ground and has been there since late last fall. To say it's an eye sore is grossly understating it.

My HOA may be on one end of the spectrum for a GOOD HOA and the community across the hill from us is definitely the OTHER end of the spectrum for a nonHOA community but it does demonstrate the potential benefits of living in a community with some rules and standards.

Yes an HOA does have some restrictions/limitations but for some people that's worth the increase in aesthetics, pleasures, cleanliness, and over all condition of the community as a whole. Not all HOAs are horrible just like not all HOAs are as easy going and a pleasure as the one I live in. You can't paint them all with the same broad/wide brush.

Is this an American thing?

I've lived in multiple places in Canada, none of which had an HOA, and things like cars parked on roads, litter and trash, unkempt yards etc are handled by municipal bylaws and enforced by the municipality. Likewise the maintenance of parks and recreation centres.

Do American municipalities not handle these matters?

 

[gemniii]

the topic of Guns is specifically mentioned in the >>>Community Rules<<< which we ALL agreed to upon joining this forum.

Very similar to an HOA, we agree to the rules when we join.

Do American municipalities not handle these matters?

There is the concept in America of FREEDOM. Often taken to the extreme. Half of my life is spent in a small town (pop ~4,000) in Northeast Mississippi. A moderately poor area with a poor schooling system. Up until a few years ago our house in town on 1/3 acre (about 5 blocks from City Hall) was basically "unregulated". Didn't have to mow the grass, place could look like a dump. There were several houses that looked like dumps between us and city hall. And most houses were well maintained and kept "neat" from street view.
Then the town implemented (and ENFORCED) what I consider some basic rules - cut your grass, no junk cars.
Sort of an HOA for the town.
LOTS OF COMPLAINING from those who had to clean up their act. Their FREEDOMS were being taken away.
Property values shot up.
So in answer to Robert Prior - some American municipalities handle them, a lot do not, or do not handle the matters well.

 

[PompousWindbag]

Random thoughts/my two cents. If my HOA decided to take action against drones there are processes they must follow, including hearings. I would insert myself in those.

I would make sure they understood that they need to have a reason (justification) for promulgating any new rule against drones (assuming nothing in the existing CC&Rs covers it), or they could face legal challenges:

1) If the justification is privacy, they need to realize there are already rules dealing with privacy issues in most jurisdictions, and they should not create new ones. Let the cops deal with peeping Toms using existing laws.

2) If the justification is related to air space ownership, they need to understand the FAA position on that. Take along a copy of the FAA press release detailing the position. DO NOT downplay the delineation of where local control is allowed... but help them understand what that means in terms of the HOA and the property they control. (In my case, the HOA does not own the streets and individual lots, so they cannot ban takeoffs and landings from my property; they CAN ban takeoffs and landings from common property, like parks and clubhouse. If we were a gated community, they would own the streets and sidewalks, so they could ban there as well... my HOA does not own the streets, the city does).

3) If the justification is noise, they need to understand that a noise rule needs to include ANY source of noise, including leaf blowers, lawn mowers, motorcycles; not just drones. Any drone noise rule that ignored louder and more persistent sources of noise would be subject to a court challenge.

At the end of the day HOA boards are not interested in putting themselves in the position of having to defend lawsuits... help them understand where their authority ends. Nicely. Be helpful. Position yourself as someone who wants to help them understand the boundaries.

Lastly: do not make yourself a nuisance to your neighbors, as HOA boards are political animals and if enough of your neighbors make enough noise, you're going to lose.

EDIT: recent posts triggered a thought. Make sure they understand the difference between Part 107 pilots and recreational pilots, and do they really want to get in the way of licensed professionals trying to do their job (e.g. roof inspections, real estate photos)... if you help them understand the complexities of what they are dealing with them hopefully they will take the time to think about it instead of knee-jerk reacting.

I appreciate your taking the amount of time and thought that it took to reply to my post. Both are greatly appreciated. Yes, I live in a gated community. The HOA owns the streets. So far, I think things are going fine. I'm taking great care not to be obnoxious with or draw attention to, my drone flights. So far, so good. You've given me a lot of good points to think about should it become an issue further down the road, but for now, I'll just continue to fly discreetly and not draw untoward attention to my drone. Cheers.

 

[BigAl07]

Is this an American thing?

I've lived in multiple places in Canada, none of which had an HOA, and things like cars parked on roads, litter and trash, unkempt yards etc are handled by municipal bylaws and enforced by the municipality. Likewise the maintenance of parks and recreation centres.

Do American municipalities not handle these matters?

Many Cities/Incorp areas do but I don't live in the city. We handle our own maintenance etc as well as "governing" our community.

 

[spudster]

Do American municipalities not handle these matters?

All US cities and towns have rules and regulations for these things, just that in many cases they are stretched too thin to be able to enforce it. Or, it is just too expensive and time consuming to do so. Sure, they "could" tow vehicles in someone's yard but first they have to get court orders, possibility fight court cases then pay someone to tow and store the vehicle. They could fine them but they would likely not get the owner to pay (if they are even working) and it is a long drawn out process to force payment, put liens on the property or even seize the property. In the end it could take years and costs 1000's of dollars it they may not even get it resolved after that.

Example, in a community I used to live in. The owner died and had no next of kin. Even if there is next of kin, many times the "kids" live elsewhere and don't want the responsibility of caring or paying for the upkeep on such property so they just abandons it. Admittedly the house was in bad shape before the person died but it's been 2 two years and place is a wreck. With storms the past couple years siding has been blown off the house, awnings and windows broken, trees and shrubs over grown, etc. Nothing has or can be done as the courts have not made any progress on a resolution of ownership. Luckily there is an HOA and they have been mowing the lawn and have taken some time to straighten up things but still it is legally in limbo no one is willing or even able to do much more.

 

[In The Zone]

A recent post I read got me to wondering... I never stopped to consider my HOA might prohibit drone operation i.e. launch/landing from my private property until I read that some HOA's do precisely that. So, I thought I'd check my CCR's to see. While drones are not mentioned, specifically, I noticed these two provisions might be used if someone were to complain:

1. MACHINERY: No Machinery or equipment of any kind shall be placed, operated, or maintained upon any Lot, except such machinery or equipment as is usual and customary in connection with the use or maintenance of a private residence.

2. GOOD NEIGHBOR RULE: This rule asks that all homeowners refrain from any activity that would disturb the pleasant quality of a neighborhood life. This guideline extends to any unacceptable activity that might negatively impact the quiet enjoyment of each homeowner, their radio or TV reception or the Association's insurance rates.

Both of these can be very broadly interpreted, to include drone operation, I would think. In the meantime, I DO want to be a good neighbor and do NOT wish to disturb the peaceful enjoyment of anyone on their property. My general practice is to launch straight up, gain altitude as quickly as possible to maybe 150-250 ft before heading off in any direction. I don't hover over people's houses. I'm usually just flying along, keeping things moving, unless I'm doing a panoramic shot or hyperlapse. I also prefer to fly at dusk or after dark, which could work for or against me. Most people are in their homes during these times, but the drone is also easier to spot, even at maximum altitude of 400'. So I suppose if someone gets a wild hair, not only will they spot the drone more easily, they will also be more easily to see where it lands when I bring it home. For now, I'll just continue to try and be a good neighbor, keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best.

HOA is HOA there's really not much you can do if they tell you, you can't take off or land on the property. They can't stop you from flying over the property but they can tell you you can't take off or land.