Is NAV CANADA failing the drone community

[Garatshay]

Canadian Advanced Certificate holders are able to authorize flight in Controlled Airspace using an app called Nav Drone. But, are the conditions set for automated approval in the app being fairly decided. Watch this video to make your own decision and see whether you think NAV CANADA is failing the Canadian drone community.

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[Solsearcher]

Canadian Advanced Certificate holders are able to authorize flight in Controlled Airspace using an app called Nav Drone. But, are the conditions set for automated approval in the app being fairly decided. Watch this video to make your own decision and see whether you think NAV CANADA is failing the Canadian drone community.

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Thank you for your insightful commentary. I likely don't have a good enough reason for saying anything...I have the app, but I've never used it! I use my M3P in areas within the aerodrome. That said, I live within a few miles of our airport, but I'm not on a flight path.

Anyway, now I'm wanting to try the app out now just to get an idea of how it works (or doesn't)!

 

[Garatshay]

Thank you for your insightful commentary. I likely don't have a good enough reason for saying anything...I have the app, but I've never used it! I use my M3P in areas within the aerodrome. That said, I live within a few miles of our airport, but I'm not on a flight path.

Anyway, now I'm wanting to try the app out now just to get an idea of how it works (or doesn't)!

Thanks for watching - and taking a moment to comment. It would be good that you should try it - you never know when you might want to advance to other drones or experiences. Enjoy your flying - and thanks again.

 

[Robert Prior]

Never used the app — my phone is too old, and I don't fly anywhere I need clearance.

Do you have a non-video source of information? I have a hard time absorbing information from video, much prefer to read.

 

[Chrislaf]

I have the app and use it frequently to check the type of airspace I plan to fly in and if there are any NOTAMS in place. Don’t fly in controlled airspace since only have my basic licecence

 

[Garatshay]

Never used the app — my phone is too old, and I don't fly anywhere I need clearance.

Do you have a non-video source of information? I have a hard time absorbing information from video, much prefer to read.

I’ll see if I can find the script - standby

 

[Garatshay]

I have the app and use it frequently to check the type of airspace I plan to fly in and if there are any NOTAMS in place. Don’t fly in controlled airspace since only have my basic licecence

Sensible use of the app. Thanks for commenting

 

[Robert Prior]

I have the app and use it frequently to check the type of airspace I plan to fly in and if there are any NOTAMS in place. Don’t fly in controlled airspace since only have my basic licecence

I've been using Drone Pilot Canada for that, because it logs flights as well as holds all my documentation. (And also runs on my old iPhone.)

I got a Mini so I could fly in controlled airspace. Living in the GTA, it's the only way I can fly without needing to drive a ways. Also, I wanted something I could use to check my roof!

 

[Garatshay]

I've been using Drone Pilot Canada for that, because it logs flights as well as holds all my documentation. (And also runs on my old iPhone.)

I got a Mini so I could fly in controlled airspace. Living in the GTA, it's the only way I can fly without needing to drive a ways. Also, I wanted something I could use to check my roof!

DPC is the Gold Standard - well worth the small cost

 

[Ralph thompson]

Thank you Garatshay for a very thoughtful and knowledgable video. I watched it quickly but will listen again in more detail.
As one with a commercial (manned) pilot license and advanced drone pilot certificate I agree with your points. There is no doubt that Nav Canada's approach is totally based on a very conservative manned flight approach but my sense is that their drone experience comes from the military (thats just a sense, no confirmation) since I see referrals to landing drones in catching nets etc. My use of the drone is fairly basic (as a journalist) but living on the island of Montreal, almost all Class C airspace, I use the Nav Drone App many times a week usually for simple popup stills. The App is very convenient. Having operated an early Phantom and then an Inspire between 2012 and 2019, it is great to not to have to complete huge SFOC applications and wait as much as a month for a response. That said,
1. It took be 3 attempts to pass the Advanced written, not because it was terribly difficult, I simply didn't understand some of the questions/responses and in one question, when asked to interpret the type of VFR circuit on a Sectional, the resolution was so bad, I couldn't make out the symbols. I was relieved to learn from the inspector that gave me the flight test, a high time commercial helicopter pilot, that he too had taken 3 kicks at the written test. I agree the written exam is barely relevant to everyday drone operations and just a subset of a regular pilot exam. I'm not going to be flying my drone from Montreal to Toronto and don't have to no "high to low, look out below". My drone doesn't have an altimeter setting anyway!!
2. I have snagged issues with the App on numerous occasions and amazed that they just make excuses in bizarrely muddle responses. e.g. during the COP15 conference in Montreal in 2022 there was a NOTAM restricting use of drones within 2 nm of the conference centre. The NavDrone App showed 3 nm forcing me to cancel an assignment located 2.5nm from the Centre. I snagged it and after multiple exchanges, their final remark was "the red circle in the App is just guidance you must refer to the actual NOTAM". Other examples included the drone being "inflight" in the operations list when in fact I hadn't even clicked TAKEOFF. Again multiple excuses and no fixes.
3. Having complained to the regular Nav Canada support department, which you'd think might be concerned if the RPAS group was not managing their service professionally, their response was a polite but "I'll pass you to the RPAS Group". Having known and worked with many of the Nav Canada staff in the past (as Director of Infrastructure Strategy in IATA), these are highly dedicated, skilled and knowledgable people but I expect they don't consider drones much of a priority, getting A380's in and out of Toronto Pearson with RNAV might be a higher priority.

In spite of the huge growth in RPAS use globally, I think its still a very young industry and regulators and their service providers like Nav Canada have to catchup.
P.S their progress on BVLOS is impressive, congrats to those working on this although they're a long way from BVLOS in Class C airspace )

 

[Robert Prior]

I see referrals to landing drones in catching nets etc.

I had a question on my exam about launching devices. The correct answer turned out to relate to model aircraft, which are also covered by the sRPAS certificate. Many of the questions would have been improved by stating the type of sRPAS in the question. Context is important, and depending on assumptions the correct answer may change.

I agree that many of the questions were less-than-relevant. If I'm at an altitude where hypoxia is an issue, I'm not likely to be flying a drone (as you can't fly from a moving vehicle)!

 

[Garatshay]

Thank

Thank you Garatshay for a very thoughtful and knowledgable video. I watched it quickly but will listen again in more detail.
As one with a commercial (manned) pilot license and advanced drone pilot certificate I agree with your points. There is no doubt that Nav Canada's approach is totally based on a very conservative manned flight approach but my sense is that their drone experience comes from the military (thats just a sense, no confirmation) since I see referrals to landing drones in catching nets etc. My use of the drone is fairly basic (as a journalist) but living on the island of Montreal, almost all Class C airspace, I use the Nav Drone App many times a week usually for simple popup stills. The App is very convenient. Having operated an early Phantom and then an Inspire between 2012 and 2019, it is great to not to have to complete huge SFOC applications and wait as much as a month for a response. That said,
1. It took be 3 attempts to pass the Advanced written, not because it was terribly difficult, I simply didn't understand some of the questions/responses and in one question, when asked to interpret the type of VFR circuit on a Sectional, the resolution was so bad, I couldn't make out the symbols. I was relieved to learn from the inspector that gave me the flight test, a high time commercial helicopter pilot, that he too had taken 3 kicks at the written test. I agree the written exam is barely relevant to everyday drone operations and just a subset of a regular pilot exam. I'm not going to be flying my drone from Montreal to Toronto and don't have to no "high to low, look out below". My drone doesn't have an altimeter setting anyway!!
2. I have snagged issues with the App on numerous occasions and amazed that they just make excuses in bizarrely muddle responses. e.g. during the COP15 conference in Montreal in 2022 there was a NOTAM restricting use of drones within 2 nm of the conference centre. The NavDrone App showed 3 nm forcing me to cancel an assignment located 2.5nm from the Centre. I snagged it and after multiple exchanges, their final remark was "the red circle in the App is just guidance you must refer to the actual NOTAM". Other examples included the drone being "inflight" in the operations list when in fact I hadn't even clicked TAKEOFF. Again multiple excuses and no fixes.
3. Having complained to the regular Nav Canada support department, which you'd think might be concerned if the RPAS group was not managing their service professionally, their response was a polite but "I'll pass you to the RPAS Group". Having known and worked with many of the Nav Canada staff in the past (as Director of Infrastructure Strategy in IATA), these are highly dedicated, skilled and knowledgable people but I expect they don't consider drones much of a priority, getting A380's in and out of Toronto Pearson with RNAV might be a higher priority.

In spite of the huge growth in RPAS use globally, I think its still a very young industry and regulators and their service providers like Nav Canada have to catchup.
P.S their progress on BVLOS is impressive, congrats to those working on this although they're a long way from BVLOS in Class C airspace )

Thank you for such a comprehensive comment. Yes, there’s definitely some catching up to do - and no one can be expected to predict the future - but responding reasonably is not too much to ask. Transport Canada are working hard to understand and support the nascent drone industry. Couldn’t agree more about the bizarre snag responses. Some seem to be AI generated - or posted by people who have no real idea about drones and their operation. Overall - Nav Drone needs a root-and-branch review. I’m told one is taking place. We will see.