Law enforcement question?

[sar104]

The FAA has does not employ enough people to check who ran a drone up and down a river for a half hour on a given day. They are not like fish and game wardens who check licenses at boat put-in points. But even if one did happen to come along while you were involved in saving a life, do you think that such a person would want to bring shame on his employer by citing a rescuer? Not if he likes his job he won't! The whole anxiety about the FAA as patrolling drone police seems to me to be misplaced.
I would be very open to hearing other points of view with other information.

I think you are mostly correct, but it's not the random, patrolling FAA agent that you need to consider - it's what happens if someone other than the LE officer who asked you to help reported you for flying illegally - for example if other aerial resources did show up unexpectedly.

 

[Esurfman]

Dépends, what if it was you in water needing assistance? Would you be glad to see a drone that spotted you?

 

[AMann]

The FAA has does not employ enough people to check who ran a drone up and down a river for a half hour on a given day. They are not like fish and game wardens who check licenses at boat put-in points. But even if one did happen to come along while you were involved in saving a life, do you think that such a person would want to bring shame on his employer by citing a rescuer? Not if he likes his job he won't! The whole anxiety about the FAA as patrolling drone police seems to me to be misplaced.
I would be very open to hearing other points of view with other information.

Don’t think FAA is out patrolling the skies, but word does tend to get out on news and posted videos on YouTube... that’s how most violations get picked up by FAA.

 

[Matchlock]

If you have the capabilities you must respond to a police officers request for assistance. That's the law. You may not refuse.

If something prevents you from responding, such as age, handicap or other "thing" then you do not have to comply with the request.

Bud

Hypothetically, boating accident happens and somebody falls in the water cop comes up to me and ask if I can fly my drone up and down the river to see if anybody is bobbing in the water or on the shoreline. I am in D airspace. can I lawfully do that for that police officer? I am a Part 107 pilot so I should know this. my first impression is no because the FAA regulates the air not the police officer but it's an emergency how far can that go?

 

[skiptv]

You can deviate from the FAA rules in the event of an emergency. You only have to tell the FAA about it, if they request that you do. But you need to be able to prove it was an emergency.

 

[DroningOn]

If you have the capabilities you must respond to a police officers request for assistance. That's the law. You may not refuse.

Where did you come up with that?

 

[sar104]

You can deviate from the FAA rules in the event of an emergency. You only have to tell the FAA about it, if they request that you do. But you need to be able to prove it was an emergency.

I think that only refers to an aviation emergency.

 

[NetDep]

The FAA has an emergency request form for "exigent circumstances." The criteria are:
> The requesting operator must possess a Certificate of Waiver or Authorization (COA) or Part 107 Pilot License
> The UAS operation must support an emergency response or other effort being conducted to address exigent circumstances and that will benefit the public good
> The requested FAA approval cannot be secured via normal processes in time to meet urgent operational needs
For all emergencies, please follow up any email with a phone call to 202-267-8276, which is answered 24/7. The phone number is for the FAA System Operations Support Center (SOSC).

Normally, requested operations must be flown by a governmental entity or sponsored by a government entity

Link to the form:
http://www.faa.gov/uas/advanced_ope...dia/uas-sgi_waiver_approval_request_form.docx

Great reply and great info!!

If it were me and I had the above info handy, I would launch & start search immediately while first available LE command could make the call.

Long gone are the days of me waiting for others to do the right thing when I’m able to - immediately.

Add an echo to those saying if the FAA were petty enough to sanction - I’d just say thank you.

 

[Jake37]

I hate using Wikipedia as a resource but there’s an aspect of tort law called “Duty to Rescue” meaning you could be sued if you have the ability to save one and it does not put yourself in danger and choose not to.

Now this is part of common law and there are very few example of this successfully being used but if we are going off of the letter of the law I could make an arguement that you could be held civilly liable if you refused.

There’s also an aspect of common law called “The Good Samaritan Law” which gives protection to someone who has to break the law to save someone’s life. So therefore I find the “it’s against the rules” argument to be extremely weak.

You are 100% correct, as you mentioned, you have the right to help save someones life regardless of the law and you should make every safe effort to do so. Standing by doing nothing when you could can get you in trouble.

 

[Phill B12]

Hypothetically, boating accident happens and somebody falls in the water cop comes up to me and ask if I can fly my drone up and down the river to see if anybody is bobbing in the water or on the shoreline. I am in D airspace. can I lawfully do that for that police officer? I am a Part 107 pilot so I should know this. my first impression is no because the FAA regulates the air not the police officer but it's an emergency how far can that go?

I'm a retired police officer in Canada. I'm a drone pilot (Mavic), former member of our underwater recovery team (13 years) and ten years of Marine Enforcement in my 40 year career. Our laws are similar particularly for drone pilots. There are two trump cards in your hypothetical situation. First is the potential to save one or more lives. Second is you are acting on the direction of the police officer in the hope of saving a life. So, you should be sure you are being directed by the police officer, not 'asked'.
So, I would fly but take all necessary precaution to prevent an accident such as flying very low, follow the river below tree top level, avoid any potential conflict with other search aircraft, and have the police officer maintain contact with your local ATC or Air Radio Station ensuring local air traffic are informed of your activity. If you can articulate why you took the action you did and all precautions you took, your FAA people will look pretty stupid in the media if they decided to charge you when you were trying to save a life. Of course, my opinion is based on Canadian experience.

 

[Maviac]

If you have the capabilities you must respond to a police officers request for assistance. That's the law. You may not refuse.

If something prevents you from responding, such as age, handicap or other "thing" then you do not have to comply with the request.

Bud

(Citation needed)

 

[Personl Drone Reapair]

Jimmytpi
Go for it !
Do not hesitate .
Who is going to report you ?
I will go so far as to say that even if a representative of the FAA were on scene , he would just turn and look the other way.
If the case were to make to court , which I doubt seriously , the enforcement agencies endorsement would mitigate any action by the court .
Maybe a verbal warning from the judge .
Me personally , I would not hesitate .
Juz My Two Pennies

 

[Personl Drone Reapair]

Crap, got in a hurry signing up and misspelled my user name .
How do I delete this account ?
Seriously , does any one know how to delete an account ??

 

[Maviac]

Crap, got in a hurry signing up and misspelled my user name .
How do I delete this account ?

I assume you were going for “Personnel Drone Reaper,” but I think Amazon already has a patent for that.

 

[sar104]

You are 100% correct, as you mentioned, you have the right to help save someones life regardless of the law and you should make every safe effort to do so. Standing by doing nothing when you could can get you in trouble.

In the situation under discussion I think that responding is appropriate, but neither of those blanket statements is correct.

 

[BigAl07]

You can deviate from the FAA rules in the event of an emergency. You only have to tell the FAA about it, if they request that you do. But you need to be able to prove it was an emergency.

This is specifically for an In Flight Emergency and not even remotely related to "SAR" type operations. The exact (and correct) wording was already shared in this thread earlier.....

 

[Victorian Aerial Vision]

Laws be [Language Removed], if asked by a cop to help then that's what I'm gonna do. Couldn't live with a "what if I had helped, could I had made the difference" scenario that results in someone losing their life.

Victorian Aerial Vision Videos

 

[BigAl07]

If you are working with a Public Safety entity and they are requesting you can get a fairly quick (probably before you can get set up and in the air) approval using SGI but note there is paperwork etc that must be completed immediately following the incident.

 

[sar104]

Laws be [Language Removed], if asked by a cop to help then that's what I'm gonna do. Couldn't live with a "what if I had helped, could I had made the difference" scenario that results in someone losing their life.

Victorian Aerial Vision Videos

I agree with your general sentiment but, in most cases, as here, the law is quite able to accommodate such actions.

 

[4thdpi]

I've had the police twice at my house because people who considered it illegal. Some will call at 390 ft, some at 90 ft. Otherwise they are friendly and wave. Many of them forget the fact that there's something called Google Earth where I can zoom in on your backyard up to and including what's on your picnic table or whatever you're doing at the moment. Google Earth also runs around with cars mapping every part of the world from the street view. There are many cameras on a house pointed toward their neighbors for various reasons. That brings in the question down to privacy and non privacy. When the police came to my house it was one person two blocks over when I flew over his house at three hundred feet coming back to my house to land. When the police arrive I was very kind offered my information when they ask and then remember always be kind I asked them what law or ordinance I was breaking. They called her sergeant and he said none you're not breaking any laws. Federal laws take precedence over local ordinances or laws. Therefore the only federal law is don't fly above 400 ft. This doesn't give you the right to fly at 10 ft above a picnic and disrupt things. Why would u be there anyway. I won't fly above schools, daycare centers or scoolbuses, it's creepy. I was watching a softball game at 200ft. For a few minutes. Not a public park but a athletic complex. Apparantly they didnt like it, they stopped the game and started throwing things at me. Their softballs wouldn't come close and no one can throw upwards 200ft. I think it's the learning curve the public needs to get used to. The police said it's noagainst the law, but just be cool with it. I know what means. They've never been here since. What's happening in your neighborhood? The public, drone operators, and court rooms will ultimately leave it alone. I was flying 300 over a forest preserve property. Trying to see anything wrong. Lots of assaults and murders happen there. Can u imagine if I saw an assault on a jogger and called police and they caught the creep. I'd be a hero. Otherwise I'm a nuisance. It's kinda like in michigan the speed limit on highways is 70mph, yet we drive at 79, they leave u alone, at 80 ur getting pulled over. Fly as you will, don't hang over picnics or groups of people, if u do be at least 300ft. They won't even know your their. If someone loses a cat or dog and God forbid a child, after the cell call, I'm up usually in my mavic, but not in snow or rain. A drone at 200 ft can usually find the pet within a minute being on the phone tell the owner where it is and reunited with family. Have fun, don't fly above at 50 ft where people are outside enjoying themselves. How would u feel. So I'm cool and they talked to the guy with the 200ft flyover to land at my house. Also always download the latest restricted airspace. Trump was here in grand rapids last week, the mavic downloads the latest maps. It showed new no fly zones at least 10 miles out from where he was at. So I stayed away. I could test a defense or a shot down and be in trouble, but why. The restrictions lifted now. People will call at 100 ft and above to 400ft agl even if you not looking them. So I fly at these altitudes. People must learn drones are here to stay. So u will see them above flying by or at a reasonable altitude if hovering. Stick to you guns if the police come over, they are learning also how to handle the calls. I'm still flying the same, but they haven't been by at all. Stay cool, know that angry unhappy people that call on anything will call on you. I know in my area their houses. Record your flight in case they lie. People said just be cool with it. The second time the same female cop came over and she's cute. I told her jokingly I love talking to u and ur here for a while. It's a nebulous law except 400 ft agl limit., and just be cool. Cheers

excuse the grammatical and spelling errors I read this in