I am getting ready to submit round two of questions for the FAA. Please ask here by replying to my original message. I will get them out in an email to my contact there and get them answered. Please be polite because I do not edit the questions or comments. Please, if you have questions ask. We will get them answered and it won't be some random dude on the internet.
New Questions for the FAA
- Thread starter jaysrmc
- Start date
This question has probably already been asked, but my google skills are lacking. What does, “Follow community-based safety guidelines and fly within the programming of a nationwide community-based organization” mean with respect to part 336 flying?
The context of 336 flying is different in different places. For example, the B4UFly app might help you get in touch with an airport you’re close to. In this context, I can be anywhere within a 5 mile ring by myself looking to fly. This is obviously 336 flying. I couldn’t simply call up the airport for permission to fly 107 because that requires a waiver.
On the FAA Drone zone website, it says you should register your drone under 336, “to fly with an aero modeling club.” What is the context of this? Do I have to be flying with a club to fly under 336? Can I be a club of one person?
Second question; if I register under 107, can I still operate under 336 rules occasionally? If so, does 107 registration also count as 336, or do I need a second 336 registration? Seems the common sense answer is yes since there is lots of 107 flying that looks exactly like 336 flying.
Thanks for this thread!
The context of 336 flying is different in different places. For example, the B4UFly app might help you get in touch with an airport you’re close to. In this context, I can be anywhere within a 5 mile ring by myself looking to fly. This is obviously 336 flying. I couldn’t simply call up the airport for permission to fly 107 because that requires a waiver.
On the FAA Drone zone website, it says you should register your drone under 336, “to fly with an aero modeling club.” What is the context of this? Do I have to be flying with a club to fly under 336? Can I be a club of one person?
Second question; if I register under 107, can I still operate under 336 rules occasionally? If so, does 107 registration also count as 336, or do I need a second 336 registration? Seems the common sense answer is yes since there is lots of 107 flying that looks exactly like 336 flying.
Thanks for this thread!
You only have to register either as 107 or the replacement for 336, but even with the 107 certification and registration, you can fly under the recreational rules. The difference between them will be narrowing though.
With recreational registration, you only register once and put the same ID on all your drones. With 107 you register each of them as I understand it.
No need to join an established club just follow their rules.
With recreational registration, you only register once and put the same ID on all your drones. With 107 you register each of them as I understand it.
No need to join an established club just follow their rules.
It might be worth asking about the impact of the repeal of Section 336 - how does that impact recreational flight before 14 CFR is amended. Also, what does this mean:
(5) In Class B, Class C, or Class D airspace or within
the lateral boundaries of the surface area of Class E airspace
designated for an airport, the operator obtains prior
authorization from the Administrator or designee before
operating and complies with all airspace restrictions and
prohibitions.
(5) In Class B, Class C, or Class D airspace or within
the lateral boundaries of the surface area of Class E airspace
designated for an airport, the operator obtains prior
authorization from the Administrator or designee before
operating and complies with all airspace restrictions and
prohibitions.
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In reference to flying as a hobbyist, the FAA Reauthorization Act of 2018 states the following:
What does "co-located" mean? What does "in direct communication" mean?
What does "co-located" mean? What does "in direct communication" mean?
rangemaster728
Well-Known Member
My interpretation of:
“Co-located” - in the same location as the remote pilot; the intent here is likely if the remote pilot has FPV goggles on (or looks down at the display and cannot visually reacquire the aircraft) the observer will maintain visual contact with the UAV.
“In direct communication” - both the RP and observer can communicate with each other, typically by unaided voice.
This scenario differs substantially from Part 107 operations using a Visual Observer (ref. Advisory Circular 107-2 on Section 107.33); under Part 107 operations a Visual Observer need not be in the same location as the Remote Pilot, and may communicate by radio or some other effective means:
To make this communication possible, the remote PIC, person manipulating the controls, and VO must work out a method of effective communication, which does not create a distraction and allows them to understand each other. The communication method must be determined prior to operation. This effective communication requirement would permit the use of
communication-assisting devices, such as a hand-held radio, to facilitate communication from a distance.
The differentiator here is ‘direct communication’ for recreational pilots...and ‘effective communication’ for 107 jockeys.
What it DOES establish under the new recreational rules is a standard for those pilots using FPV goggles by requiring an observer...near the pilot.
Of course this is the FAA we’re talking about...so who knows? LOL
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I want to know more about how to satisfy this new cockamamie privacy policy crap...
Specifically, will there be any examples for individuals to follow in order to comply?
Specifically, will there be any examples for individuals to follow in order to comply?
Last edited:
rangemaster728
Well-Known Member
For those of you that haven’t started reading the new law...the privacy policy concerns mcsenerd mentions center around requirements for commercial and governmental operations (Section 379), not recreational...but are also addressed by Section 357 for all UAS.
Regarding Section 379:
The way I read it the (FAA) Administrator must collect the data and make it available.
If that information is requested, compliance may be mandatory.
Considering the business environment today (regardless of the business) having a privacy policy is standard practice...how many time a year do you get snail mail/email from Apple, Paypal, banks, credit cards, merchants, etc. that inform you of their privacy policy?
I have a feeling as the new law is rolled out and the FAA develops mechanisms to deal with it we’ll see some standard privacy policy boilerplate appear on multiple websites you can incorporate in your operations.
Of course we’ll also see sites advertising these policy documents for a fee...
One thing of note is that privacy policies in this case deal with information that is ‘personally identifiable’ as gathered by an unmanned aircraft system; when you have contractual documents for an inspection job the clients’ name, address, phone number, etc. is not gathered by the UAS, but as a routine course of your business.
In this instance I believe Section 379 does not apply.
A system that uses facial recognition IS addressed in Section 379, but not many of us utilize that technology.
For me having a privacy policy is a normal business occurrence, but will have little/no additional reporting requirement to the FAA based on what I have read so far.
Section 357 is more nebulous...
SEC. 357. UNMANNED AIRCRAFT SYSTEMS PRIVACY POLICY.
It is the policy of the United States that the operation of any unmanned aircraft or unmanned aircraft system shall be carried out in a manner that respects and protects personal privacy consistent with the United States Constitution and Federal, State, and local law.
This Section applies to all UAS operations...and looks more like a CYA maneuver by Congress as a generic statement.
Regarding Section 379:
The way I read it the (FAA) Administrator must collect the data and make it available.
If that information is requested, compliance may be mandatory.
Considering the business environment today (regardless of the business) having a privacy policy is standard practice...how many time a year do you get snail mail/email from Apple, Paypal, banks, credit cards, merchants, etc. that inform you of their privacy policy?
I have a feeling as the new law is rolled out and the FAA develops mechanisms to deal with it we’ll see some standard privacy policy boilerplate appear on multiple websites you can incorporate in your operations.
Of course we’ll also see sites advertising these policy documents for a fee...
One thing of note is that privacy policies in this case deal with information that is ‘personally identifiable’ as gathered by an unmanned aircraft system; when you have contractual documents for an inspection job the clients’ name, address, phone number, etc. is not gathered by the UAS, but as a routine course of your business.
In this instance I believe Section 379 does not apply.
A system that uses facial recognition IS addressed in Section 379, but not many of us utilize that technology.
For me having a privacy policy is a normal business occurrence, but will have little/no additional reporting requirement to the FAA based on what I have read so far.
Section 357 is more nebulous...
SEC. 357. UNMANNED AIRCRAFT SYSTEMS PRIVACY POLICY.
It is the policy of the United States that the operation of any unmanned aircraft or unmanned aircraft system shall be carried out in a manner that respects and protects personal privacy consistent with the United States Constitution and Federal, State, and local law.
This Section applies to all UAS operations...and looks more like a CYA maneuver by Congress as a generic statement.
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I hope so, because I went and got my part 107 cert just to cover my arse, so to speak. I mean, I also don't think it's such a bad idea to educate yourself a bit about NAS before undertaking potentially dangerous operations anyway, so only the $$$ is a downside IMHO. The issue is that I'm just a guy. I don't have all of these policy plans, standard inspection reports, flight plan log books, etc. just sitting around, so I'm sort of overwhelmed right now trying to figure out what all I need to be "compliant" if and when I ever do fly any sort of quasi-commercial mission. I guess my issue is just like most of us...I don't fly my drone to "spy" on people. I fly to take beautiful scenery photos and videos, and occassionally video me and my family as we travel, but that being said, just like taking a selfie on the street or a family photo at a major landmark...I can't stop each and every other person on the planet from possibly appearing in any photo or video I take.
rangemaster728
Well-Known Member
mscenerd....I understand your position.
As all this rolls out I think you made the right choice to get your Part 107, as I think little will change for us (compared to the recreational pilots).
As all this rolls out I think you made the right choice to get your Part 107, as I think little will change for us (compared to the recreational pilots).
marklyn
Well-Known Member
I'd like to submit a question and would appreciate a FAA response...
what is the best way to handle a situation where an FAA registered hobbyist is flying in a reasonable manner and in an area where they are knowledgeable about where it's legal to fly (including takeoff/landing) and local police are questioning you or may be wanting to ticket you.
I'm looking for a non-confrontational, informative answer to provide them, or even some type of reference material I could keep with me to hand them.
what is the best way to handle a situation where an FAA registered hobbyist is flying in a reasonable manner and in an area where they are knowledgeable about where it's legal to fly (including takeoff/landing) and local police are questioning you or may be wanting to ticket you.
I'm looking for a non-confrontational, informative answer to provide them, or even some type of reference material I could keep with me to hand them.
rangemaster728
Well-Known Member
marklyn
Well-Known Member
I recall seeing that document somewhere a while back when doing some searches related to local law enforcement vs FAA regulation, so thanks.
However, I'd still like my question asked. While It might be nice to have a printed copy of this as a reference to show someone, it's unlikely that a local cop would bother to read through the document, even if I highlighted some passages (or am I wrong)?
In that situation I'd still like to hear from the FAA on the best way to inform/educate a local cop when they might not be familiar with the letter of the (FAA) law or they are making an incorrect assumption that what I'm doing might deserve a ticket. This all assumes I've done my homework and am confident on where I'm flying, etc.
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