Railroads and drones....is it okay ?
- Thread starter MavicFlyer2
- Start date
That depends really. Will this trains arrival be an event that others will attend?
If so you need to make sure to stay clear of them.You want to keep a safe distance from people! You will want to check the local rules for Drones in the place you intend to fly..
NOTE! It is illegal to fly a Drone directly over a train. You should also be aware that all Railroad companies have Rules about Drones and unless its their Drone, Drones are NOT WELCOME on any railroad companies property that I can find! Do NOT takeoff, land, or trespass on any railroad property!
You should have no problem using your Drone if you follow these simple rules.
If so you need to make sure to stay clear of them.You want to keep a safe distance from people! You will want to check the local rules for Drones in the place you intend to fly..
NOTE! It is illegal to fly a Drone directly over a train. You should also be aware that all Railroad companies have Rules about Drones and unless its their Drone, Drones are NOT WELCOME on any railroad companies property that I can find! Do NOT takeoff, land, or trespass on any railroad property!
You should have no problem using your Drone if you follow these simple rules.
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Thank you for the direction I need to go with this !
It's just a drive through town event with no stops and people will be attending. I'm planning on a waypoint flight pre flown ahead of time to stay away from the main area people will be congregated. We're a mall town of 2000 so I am thinking ahead for a safe spot.
A roadway away from downtown is my choice for launching.
Thanks again for your input and have a good day !
I used to live in St Louis Park, MN in the 1990s but I never saw that train. I wouldn't worry about flying a drone nearby just don't hover on or over the crowd. Not all trains are critical infrastructure or targets for terrorists with the railroad police cracking down on curious citizens. I doubt you'll have to worry about any trespassing since this is often an event open to the public. Unless you run into a super drone hater, you shouldn't have a problem.
Not to be a downer on this BUT, with the current mystery drone “invasion” going on and the FAA and other government agencies not knowing WTH is going on, taking some video of a holiday train seems pretty trivial.
I’m not saying disregard the rules, but…..
Nope. There is nothing illegal about flying directly over a train. It's only illegal to fly directly over the people inside the train if it's moving.
The airspace above trains is not considered Critical Infrastructure. Railroad cops like to tell you that it's illegal to fly over trains and train yards, but they're wrong. And 90% of the time they know they're wrong. They just don't want you there.
This is 100% correct. Stay off their property. They really don't like that and will very likely have the cops charge you with trespassing.
Yes it is legal to fly over a non moving train. However the FAA considers a moving train as a "moving vehicle" and the restrictions in §107.39 apply. I googled it. BUT Vic Moss does know his stuff. I am interpreting the rule myself from reading it.
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Wrong again. You're misinterpreting §107.39. And actually it's SubPart D of §107.39 that deals with moving vehicles. And Subpart D, §107.145 has the specific language for moving vehicles.
The tile of .145 is misleading. It says, "§ 107.145 Operations over moving vehicles." But the first sentence of .145 actually holds what the regulation is about. It states, "No person may operate a small unmanned aircraft over a human being located inside a moving vehicle unless the following conditions are met:" then goes on to describe those conditions.
§107.145 is about the people inside the train, not the train itself. It's perfectly legal to fly over a moving train (or any moving vehicle for that matter) if you don't fly over the people inside. It must be done safely, but it is legal.
Most trains,ships,airports, docks fir ships, loading unloading zones have strick rules and you will need their permission to fly near or around the facilities. I'd check with the train company and get written permission to prevent any undo expenses or fines.
Nope. You only need permission if they are FAA designated NFZs. The list of Critical Infrastructure can be found on the FAA's UAS Data Map (AKA Visualize it) here: ArcGIS Web Application
Click these squares on the layer list, and it will show you where you aren't allowed to fly. Any other rules are not necessarily accurate. Many states, and even companies, self designate where you can't fly, but they aren't technically allowed to. That doesn't mean they won't try.
But again, unless you are on RR property, there is nothing they can legally do to prevent you from flying over their yards or trains, as long as you are following FAA regulations.
Can you ask permission? Sure. But instead, I'd just inform them as a courtesy if you're worried. If you go the route of asking for permission, you are granting them authority they do not possess.
Attachments
I was able to get a lot of really good footage of a train loading cars. I asked for permission first, and was given the go ahead providing I didn’t get too close to the tracks. This was in Canada.
Hmmm.......Tell that to this guy! Hold my beer.
Amazing!
Amazing!
If whomever orchestrated these events get their way, the drone rules will be rewritten making it nearly impossible for the hobby drone to fly anywhere except for FRIA and an empty field in the local city park. Everywhere will be marked critical infrastructure, everyone will be allowed to raise restrictions, and the enforcement will be commenced by anyone with a badge. By the time they get done, flying a drone will be a crime.Not to be a downer on this BUT, with the current mystery drone “invasion” going on and the FAA and other government agencies not knowing WTH is going on, taking some video of a holiday train seems pretty trivial.
I’m not saying disregard the rules, but…..
I talked with Nurk about this after it happened. The FAA was not pleased. Never found out for sure if he was fined or not, but he definitely won't be doing something like that again.
That and distracting the engineer. He also technically trespassed since he landed inside the train. But basically the BVLOS violation was the main thing. I think if he did get in trouble, it was likely a slap on the wrist.
In Florida they really evolved critical infrastructure over the years. Number 12 below might include railways in some sections of the track and, in stretching the definition a bit, an Amazon warehouse:
(a) “Critical infrastructure facility” means any of the following, if completely enclosed by a fence or other physical barrier that is obviously designed to exclude intruders, or if clearly marked with a sign or signs which indicate that entry is forbidden and which are posted on the property in a manner reasonably likely to come to the attention of intruders:
1. A power generation or transmission facility, substation, switching station, or electrical control center.
2. A chemical or rubber manufacturing or storage facility.
3. A water intake structure, water treatment facility, wastewater treatment plant, or pump station.
4. A mining facility.
5. A natural gas or compressed gas compressor station, storage facility, or natural gas or compressed gas pipeline.
6. A liquid natural gas or propane gas terminal or storage facility.
7. Any portion of an aboveground oil or gas pipeline.
8. A refinery.
9. A gas processing plant, including a plant used in the processing, treatment, or fractionation of natural gas.
10. A wireless communications facility, including the tower, antennae, support structures, and all associated ground-based equipment.
11. A seaport as listed in s. 311.09(1), which need not be completely enclosed by a fence or other physical barrier and need not be marked with a sign or signs indicating that entry is forbidden.
12. An inland port or other facility or group of facilities serving as a point of intermodal transfer of freight in a specific area physically separated from a seaport.
13. An airport as defined in s. 330.27.
14. A spaceport territory as defined in s. 331.303(19).
15. A military installation as defined in 10 U.S.C. s. 2801(c)(4) and an armory as defined in s. 250.01.
16. A dam as defined in s. 373.403(1) or other structures, such as locks, floodgates, or dikes, which are designed to maintain or control the level of navigable waterways.
17. A state correctional institution as defined in s. 944.02 or a contractor-operated correctional facility authorized under chapter 957.
18. A secure detention center or facility as defined in s. 985.03, or a moderate-risk residential facility, a high-risk residential facility, or a maximum-risk residential facility as those terms are described in s. 985.03(44).
19. A county detention facility as defined in s. 951.23.
20. A critical infrastructure facility as defined in s. 692.
Yep, Florida is another state that is overstepping their authority. There are a couple of other states, including Texas and Louisiana, that do the same thing. This is what happens when U.S. Security Agencies keep dragging their feet with Section 2209 of the 2016 FAA Extension, Safety, and Security Act.
2016...
They are 8 years late, and this is the reason states are setting their own CI rules. And it creating our industry no end of trouble.
All of that notwithstanding. The skill was beyond impressive to me. How many could have done it? Maybe everyone but me lolI talked with Nurk about this after it happened. The FAA was not pleased. Never found out for sure if he was fined or not, but he definitely won't be doing something like that again.
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