What is your time and effort worth

[1bad]

Good Evening,

I know this question may vary from person to person however I'm open to all. When shooting property for realtors what do you charge. By the hour or by the job?

My example would be I shot 4 properties yesterday. Simple overheads on 3 properties no structure(maybe 6 pics each) and a small minute half video on a 4th with a house.

I had 2 hours of shooting, 2 hours of computer time.

What should I charge?

Thanks for your input in advanced!

 

[Mavic Mac]

All the same client ? On the CommercialDronePilots I have seen the figure of $150/hr

 

[1bad]

Yes all were the same client, different locations within 5 miles of each other

 

[MAvic_South_Oz]

Every person will have their own answer to this of course.
It all depends on the individuals circumstances (how much THEY'RE happy with / need), location (general living expenses), and so on.

Working on Mavic Mac hourly quote form the commercial forum . . .

220 working days Mon - Fri (over here) per year, I allow (in my other biz) 6 hrs a day productive time (actual work, it's manufacture) = 1320 hrs a year.
Calculating on $150 an hour, $198000 a year sounds ok (just), but you have to take out the real time working, it might only be 50% (4 hrs) a day, rather than my 75%, then you have to take out wear and tear of equipment, drone(s), vehicle, computers / tablets / ipads etc.

A lot will be determined by your expectations, if it's your primary / only income, or a hobby income, but if only a supplement, don't charge too little and undervalue your work.

4 hrs work, inc travel / prep and destaging equipment time ? Add some vehicle / equipment depreciation ?
$650 might be fine for this 1/2 day for you, you might be happy with $500 being all done in one go.

Sounds like it's you first RE gig, for this company at least, but because you're asking, maybe the first ever gig.
If so, I'd take your invoice into them, sit down with the person you're dealing with, and hand it over . . . ask if this fits their needs for such work.
Sound them out.

If they say, oh that's good, say well, this is cheaper because I did 4 properties back to back, all close, etc.
If it's one shoot on a day, and across town or whatever, it might be more pro rata for a single shoot.
Kinda butter em up in case you're too cheap on this.

More likely, they'll possibly say, oh that's a lot more than we have paid in the past.
Be prepared to show your professionalism, how you are a licenced commercial pilot, have the right gear, insurance in case needed, reliable, etc etc.
If they've used someone hobby based in the past, they might have been getting charged $50 a home or similar.

You really have to sell yourself.

Good luck.

 

[OurAngryBadger]

Re: What to price yourself out at and why this is probably a horrible profession to get into.

Real estate photography pricing has always been a hot topic for me. There are soooo many "real estate photographers" out there charging pennies. Most of them aren't good, some are, but all of them are "good enough" for most real estate agents.

Here in my area a typical real estate photo session (for interior pictures) is $75-100 by most real estate photographers, for about 30-50 photos. Add in aerial photos, maybe some video, and they have packages that are $150 ish or maybe a bit higher.

When you break it down for an average interior shoot:
Shooting: 1.5 hours
Editing: 1.5 hours
Travel (varies): 1 hour
Communication: 45 mins
Waiting on-site: 15 mins

So that's 5 hours of work put into a job. At $100 total you are only talking $20 per hour that you are getting paid. But of course you have to factor in the money spent on gas, insurance, equipment, maintenance, etc, and then take out 15% for taxes, and then you realize these people are getting paid LESS than minimum wage. That's really SAD for a creative "professional". Most other "professionals" like plumbers, electricians, welders, CPAs, etc make $75-100 per hour minimum.

And then you have to account for other things. Not only money spent on advertising, but TIME spent on running your business. Invoicing, accounting, e-mailing, website editing, etc just to name a few. Those are ALL things that every other professional out there except photographers get paid for. If they aren't getting paid directly by their employer, they are building it into their pricing.

So... how did things get this way?

The answer is that, photography, is not a profession that is regulated at all. There is no licensing requirements, required training, etc. Because of that, any uncle bob and his cousin can go out and become a real estate photographer. So what happens is you have all these real estate photographers that aren't really doing it full time and they are basically doing it just for a little extra beer money on the weekend. They don't care that they are getting paid less than minimum wage because any extra money works for them -- they already have stable day jobs that pay the bills.

But it hurts the rest of us that are trying to do this full time and make a living. Why? Well why would a real estate agent pay us full timers a living wage when they have fifty other people to choose from who only need beer money? Real estate agents don't need Grade-A artwork, they just need decent photos that will help show a house.

Re: What I charge and how I build my rates out.

For ground-level (interior+exterior photography)
$200 for 0-2000 sqft house. 15-25 photos.
$350 for 2000+ sqft house. 35 photos (to fill MLS).

For aerial photography:
$200 for 10 photos.
$350 for a 4-minute video.

These are my home-owner rates or first-time agent rates. I give recurring agents a 10% discount. I also offer some packages that combine multiple services into one to get about a 15-25% discount off the total services.

My rates are about double of most everyone else in my area. I don't have a big ego but I know the quality of the work and I can say without a doubt my work is the highest quality of anyone in my entire region. There are a few other photographers that come close or are on par but their prices are still lower than mine. I put a lot more work into my photos than most photographers do, typically it will take me 4-5 hours to edit 35 photos. I have a special editing process.

But still, the problem is that most real estate agents don't care how good your work is. They just want someone who's work is "good enough" and can do it cheap. Real estate agents, or at least most of them, are pretty cheap. Even though they might make a $20,000 commission off of a really nice home, they don't want to spend $2-300 to hire a quality photographer. They don't see the value in it, even if it means the home will sell a helluva lot quicker.

Roping them in and getting them to use me is hard work. I would say maybe only 20% of agents that contact me end up hiring me. But the ones that do, use me repeatedly and frequently. These are the agents that appreciate good work and are smart enough to see how it benefits them.

A few weeks ago I did a a very low-rate special for a real estate agent that was representing a family member of mine. This is a real estate agent that has been in business for 15+ years. After she posted the photos I took of the home, she was AMAZED at how much interest it got in the house. She had an open-house and there were more than 70 PEOPLE that showed up to the open-house. In my area, a pretty low-population area, that is a lot. She said it was more than triple of the amount of people she's ever had at an open house ever before. The home sold within 3 days of the open-house. Another record for her. Needless to say, she's hooked. She never valued good photography before, but now she does.

A really important tip:

If you are planning on doing this full-time, you need to market yourself as such. You can get away with charging more for your services than those fly-by-night weekend real estate photographers, and actually make a living wage, if you can promise real estate agents weekday availability and 24 hour turn around time on the photos. That's a really big thing - it's far more important to them than the quality of your work.


I hope this was helpful.


Edit: Ok my apologies it's very late here and I re-read your post. I didn't answer anything about what you asked at all. You seem to want to know about photographing empty properties with a drone, is that right? In that case, I would still charge $200 for 10 photos. That's my minimum rate to show up and do aerial work - even if they only need 5 or 6. With a drone you can always take photos at various angles and heights to fill the promised 10.

 

[OurAngryBadger]

To add to my above post, those rates are for residential real estate sales.

For commercial work (businesses) I just double my residential prices. Because a real estate agent is only going to use the photos once and only until the home sells. Commercial businesses will use the photos for much longer, maybe even forever, they benefit a lot more from the photos, so you deserve to get paid more.

Some photographers work out licensing or royalties but that's really above a complexity level I want to get into, and I'm not in a big city where that is more understood and popular.

 

[MAvic_South_Oz]

A few weeks ago I did a a very low-rate special for a real estate agent that was representing a family member of mine. This is a real estate agent that has been in business for 15+ years. After she posted the photos I took of the home, she was AMAZED at how much interest it got in the house. She had an open-house and there were more than 70 PEOPLE that showed up to the open-house. In my area, a pretty low-population area, that is a lot. She said it was more than triple of the amount of people she's ever had at an open house ever before. The home sold within 3 days of the open-house. Another record for her. Needless to say, she's hooked. She never valued good photography before, but now she does.

Excellent example of how to get yourself in the spotlight . . . I'd use that somewhere on a website blurb and in other marketing, have a box section somewhere with a title, "Just how important is good photography ?"
Make em think about how much better their service can be, with that little more work / $ spent on the photos / video.

In that case, I would still charge $200 for 10 photos. That's my minimum rate to show up and do aerial work - even if they only need 5 or 6. With a drone you can always take photos at various angles and heights to fill the promised 10.

So 4 homes, maybe a little package deal discount for the convenience of this particular series of jobs, $750 or so is in the ball park ?
The OP can look at his work and ask himself "Is my work up to par ?" "Will it get a big open inspection interest, and help sell this home fast ?"
If it is / will, that's a good starting point to price fairly and with decent reward..

 

[Mavic Mac]

@Fred Garvin posted in the CommercialPilot forum

Good Photographers aren't cheap and cheap Photographers aren't good.

 

[Deleted member 93449]

@Fred Garvin posted in the CommercialPilot forum

Good Photographers aren't cheap and cheap Photographers aren't good.

Good is a relative term. My guess is the average individual will see a photograph taken with a good camera on auto settings and think it's good.

 

[OzzieHerr]

Is there a site where drone photographers can offer their services? I’m in south Utah, and we travel in our RV full time, and arm not interested in competing with or eroding the rates of professionals who do it for a living, so I would try to keep rates in line with industry averages. I would like to supplement our income and offset the cost of my M2P and licensing. Thanks.

 

[OurAngryBadger]

Is there a site where drone photographers can offer their services? I’m in south Utah, and we travel in our RV full time, and arm not interested in competing with or eroding the rates of professionals who do it for a living, so I would try to keep rates in line with industry averages. I would like to supplement our income and offset the cost of my M2P and licensing. Thanks.

I would honestly start with local classifieds, like craigslist, or join local facebook groups of the areas you are traveling to.

 

[Ty Pilot]

My wife and I are both photographers, she does it for a living and her areas of most work are varied from being our local hospitals' new-born photographer to events and weddings and also a good helping of real estate. We added aerial to her real estate work about three years ago, almost all of which is in the residential field. What we have seen over the last three years is first; as the market increases (especially here in Central Florida), houses are practically selling themselves based on location. In addition as we all know, everyone with a camera on auto is a photographer.

These two things have driven prices down but she still has those clients that will pay for us to do the job right. One piece of advise I would offer anyone thinking of getting into this field is; to expand the scope of your work beyond just aerial imagery. Of all the work my wife does in a year, only about 25 to 35 percent is in real estate and of that percentage, the aerial only makes up maybe 35% in a good year. Realtors that are paying 200 to 300 for all of the ground shots are not always needing the extra Aerial images which adds 150 to the total for 15 photos. So typically we are hired first to shoot the inside and the aerial stuff is the piggy backed on top of that so to speak. Rare is it any of them ask for only aerial shots (again we do mostly residential single family housing).

In addition as it turns out many of the houses where they do want aerial is not what you think of in Florida - like a super nice house on a beach with a view - those don't need photographs to sell, not from the air anyway. No, what I get assigned are the houses that may be real nice inside but they are photographically challenged on the outside in some way. Many are obscured from the road or are covered in trees, and then there are those that the 'proximity' to something is the selling point. I get asked a lot to 'make sure to frame the house with the lake in back' and things like that.

So basically if your going to become a photographer from the air - adding ground capability to expand and to 'hook' for the aerial, might be a good idea.

 

[OurAngryBadger]

My wife and I are both photographers, she does it for a living and her areas of most work are varied from being our local hospitals' new-born photographer to events and weddings and also a good helping of real estate. We added aerial to her real estate work about three years ago, almost all of which is in the residential field. What we have seen over the last three years is first; as the market increases (especially here in Central Florida), houses are practically selling themselves based on location. In addition as we all know, everyone with a camera on auto is a photographer.

These two things have driven prices down but she still has those clients that will pay for us to do the job right. One piece of advise I would offer anyone thinking of getting into this field is; to expand the scope of your work beyond just aerial imagery. Of all the work my wife does in a year, only about 25 to 35 percent is in real estate and of that percentage, the aerial only makes up maybe 35% in a good year. Realtors that are paying 200 to 300 for all of the ground shots are not always needing the extra Aerial images which adds 150 to the total for 15 photos. So typically we are hired first to shoot the inside and the aerial stuff is the piggy backed on top of that so to speak. Rare is it any of them ask for only aerial shots (again we do mostly residential single family housing).

In addition as it turns out many of the houses where they do want aerial is not what you think of in Florida - like a super nice house on a beach with a view - those don't need photographs to sell, not from the air anyway. No, what I get assigned are the houses that may be real nice inside but they are photographically challenged on the outside in some way. Many are obscured from the road or are covered in trees, and then there are those that the 'proximity' to something is the selling point. I get asked a lot to 'make sure to frame the house with the lake in back' and things like that.

So basically if your going to become a photographer from the air - adding ground capability to expand and to 'hook' for the aerial, might be a good idea.

Agree with this.

All real estate agents want interior ground photos, not many want aerial photos from my experience. In my case, usually the ones that want aerial photos are, like you said, properties that are "challenged". Such as if the property has weird borders or access issues.

I always try to push aerial photos for homes that have a large property or nice land. It helps sell the home, for buyers who want property. I get a lot of push back from agents though that don't want to advertise how big the property is, they say that buyers don't want a large property and the responsibility that comes with maintaining a large property. I agree, but those are not the people buying a large property anyway. Once they get there in person and see the property with their eyes, does it really matter?

Here's an excerpt from my service guide

 

[MAvic_South_Oz]

Is there a site where drone photographers can offer their services? I’m in south Utah, and we travel in our RV full time, and arm not interested in competing with or eroding the rates of professionals who do it for a living, so I would try to keep rates in line with industry averages. I would like to supplement our income and offset the cost of my M2P and licensing. Thanks.

I've seen a few 'Uber' type biz mentioned on this forum, that have pilot listings, and dish out work.
Like Uber / Lyft etc, they take a good chunk, but it might suit you.
From what I've seen they post up geo based locations with scope of work, and pilots can respond, a bit more like negotiation there too I think, rather than a set price like an Uber or other such.

Here're a few I found online with a simple google search for > drone pilots for hire
Not sure where the base is for these, it might be local or Worldwide.

Zeitview

Advanced Inspection Software for Renewable Energy and Sustainable Infrastructure

dronebase.com

Hire Professional Drone Pilots - Droners.io

Hire licensed drone pilots for aerial photography & videography on Droners.io - the world's largest drone pilot marketplace, trusted by thousands.

droners.io

Hire UAV Pro - Drone Light Show Entertainment

The best in class drone light show company, serving the United States and beyond. Get in touch today to schedule your drone light show event.

www.hireuavpro.com

27 Best Freelance Drones Specialists For Hire In April 2022 - Upwork™

Find freelance drones experts for hire. Access 27 drones freelancers and outsource your project.

www.upwork.com

You do have part 107 then ?
Otherwise, it might have to be cash based (hard to get from RE agents and other biz), and greater risk if uninsured etc.