Think carefully before purchasing if you’re in the EU and UK

[FoxhallGH]

Just was is required for this? Broadcast how and to whom?

DJI released an app' last year called 'DJI Drone to Phone' which allowed anybody within about half a mile of an operational drone, to receive data about that drone on their mobile phone using Wi-Fi protocols. It would only require that the Operator filled in a blank field in the Go4 / GoFly app with their Operator reg' ID (or Flyer reg'), and that would be added to the broadcast, making it 100% compliant with the EASA requirement (as EASA don't prescribe any distance parameters, or anything to do with how that data is to be collected).
While this app' sounds like a great idea, the whole concept of 'open to everybody' has got the drone communities pretty much everywhere, up in arms because they say that this allows 'thieves' to target drone flyers and steal their drones (for some reason, they don't think they can see the drone operator?). Nobody in these communities has acknowledged that it allows illegal use of drones to be pinpointed of course ...

DJI Demonstrates Direct Drone-To-Phone Remote Identification - DJI

DJI today demonstrated a direct drone-to-phone, Wi-Fi based solution to remotely identify airborne drones, pioneering an easy way for anyone with a smartphone to monitor nearby drones for enhanced safety, security and peace of mind.

www.dji.com

 

[swooshdave]

DJI released an app' last year called 'DJI Drone to Phone' which allowed anybody within about half a mile of an operational drone, to receive data about that drone on their mobile phone using Wi-Fi protocols. It would only require that the Operator filled in a blank field in the Go4 / GoFly app with their Operator reg' ID (or Flyer reg'), and that would be added to the broadcast, making it 100% compliant with the EASA requirement (as EASA don't prescribe any distance parameters, or anything to do with how that data is to be collected).
While this app' sounds like a great idea, the whole concept of 'open to everybody' has got the drone communities pretty much everywhere, up in arms because they say that this allows 'thieves' to target drone flyers and steal their drones (for some reason, they don't think they can see the drone operator?). Nobody in these communities has acknowledged that it allows illegal use of drones to be pinpointed of course ...

DJI Demonstrates Direct Drone-To-Phone Remote Identification - DJI

DJI today demonstrated a direct drone-to-phone, Wi-Fi based solution to remotely identify airborne drones, pioneering an easy way for anyone with a smartphone to monitor nearby drones for enhanced safety, security and peace of mind.

www.dji.com

Does that meet the EU regulations?

 

[FoxhallGH]

Does that meet the EU regulations?

In that it provides the data that the EASA reg's ask for - Yes. DJI have made a statement confirming their ability to make the software change to add the CAA / FCC / whatever - Operator ID to the transmitted data.

 

[swooshdave]

In that it provides the data that the EASA reg's ask for - Yes. DJI have made a statement confirming their ability to make the software change to add the CAA / FCC / whatever - Operator ID to the transmitted data.

So then is your proposal that they add that functionality to the Fly app?

 

[z28lt1]

Would guess that DJI have designed the Air 2 as a C1 (or possibly C2) as it seems to be able to meet the requirements. Later F/W update to slow Tripod mode down to 3m/s an option?

However seeing as for some reason it's not actually certified yet - maybe they decided no need to set Tripod so slowly for the launch of the Air 2?

If they get the model certified, F/W update for all to 3m/s (yet of course the C certification would only apply to serial numbers sold from that point on).

All guesswork though.

DJI has obviously built the Air 2 for C1. It fits the weight , and the max published speed is exactly the speed that is the maximum for C1.

The problem is that you can't certify yet, and the remote identification certification process isn't finalized. So, there is nothing DJI can do. No drones can be certified today it seems. The big unknown is, after those certifications are finalized, will DJI then implement the proper remote ID? And will they certify all those manufactured after that date? Or by that time will they be on to the Pro 3 and ignore the Air 2? Will they be allowed to retroactively certify the ones previously built if they are exactly the same as the ones certified going forward (this one seems unlikely)?

 

[swooshdave]

DJI has obviously built the Air 2 for C1. It fits the weight , and the max published speed is exactly the speed that is the maximum for C1.

The problem is that you can't certify yet, and the remote identification certification process isn't finalized. So, there is nothing DJI can do. No drones can be certified today it seems. The big unknown is, after those certifications are finalized, will DJI then implement the proper remote ID? And will they certify all those manufactured after that date? Or by that time will they be on to the Pro 3 and ignore the Air 2? Will they be allowed to retroactively certify the ones previously built if they are exactly the same as the ones certified going forward (this one seems unlikely)?

Seems to be more an issue with EU regulators than DJI?

 

[Lastrexking]

Will they be allowed to retroactively certify the ones previously built if they are exactly the same as the ones certified going forward (this one seems unlikely)?

Nope, because the manufacturer has to mark the drone with its class (C1, C2 etc).

 

[Lastrexking]

Seems to be more an issue with EU regulators than DJI?

Yep. This whole class thing, and the requirements are way over the top. If there’s one thing the EU loves, it’s over regulation (and, I’m someone that wanted the UK to stay in the EU). I don’t know how much if DJI's income comes from Europe, but if it’s not much then they’d be well within their rights to ignore the new requirements.

 

[FoxhallGH]

Seems to be more an issue with EU regulators than DJI?

It probably is, because the whole idea is to get a pan-Europe wide set of rules that would allow us (if I hadn't been stripped of my Citizenship of 27 European states!), to fly our drones anywhere in Europe under the same rules. DJI have been very pro-active though, in proposing solutions that the EASA reg's have been drafted around (particularly in the areas of Geo-Fencing and ID transmission). So considering that 28 countries are involved in this, and DJI has been lobbying the lot - it's actually moving on at a good pace really!

 

[FoxhallGH]

So then is your proposal that they add that functionality to the Fly app?

I don't think I need to propose it, I'd be surprised if it wasn't already there & just needing a software flick-switch to turn it on in GoFly ...

 

[FoxhallGH]

Does that meet the EU regulations?

The EASA reg's actually request the following (this is from the Class C1 spec' - but all classes have this section as written):

(12) have a direct remote identification that:

(a) allows the upload of the UAS operator registration number in accordance with Article 14 of Implementing Regulation (EU) 2019/947 and exclusively following the process
provided by the registration system;

(b) ensures, in real time during the whole duration of the flight, the direct periodic broadcast from the UA using an open and documented transmission protocol, of the following data, in a way that they can be received directly by existing mobile devices within the broadcasting range:
i the UAS operator registration number;
ii the unique physical serial number of the UA compliant with standard ANSI/CTA-2063;
iii the geographical position of the UA and its height above the surface or take-off point;
iv the route course measured clockwise from true north and ground speed of the UA; and
v the geographical position of the remote pilot or, if not available, the take-off point;

(c) ensures that the user cannot modify the data mentioned under paragraph (b) points ii, iii, iv and v;

[Note the specific use of the phrase: "received directly by existing mobile devices" in part (b)]

 

[Ikopta]

EU have delayed the New Drone regs until for another 6 months.. you'll then have another 2 years before you have to comply in certain airspace.. by which time you'll be on the Mavic Air 5..

 

[gb160]

EU have delayed the New Drone regs until for another 6 months.. you'll then have another 2 years before you have to comply in certain airspace.. by which time you'll be on the Mavic Air 5..

So this is good for us hobby flyers right?

So can someone just clarify, briefly what are the restrictions to hobby fliers between now and 6 months time? and then between 6 months time and 2 years from then?

 

[Lastrexking]

So this is good for us hobby flyers right?

So can someone just clarify, briefly what are the restrictions to hobby fliers between now and 6 months time? and then between 6 months time and 2 years from then?

Its been covered in this thread already.

 

[gb160]

Its been covered in this thread already.

I was hoping for a recap so I wouldn't have trudge through.

 

[FoxhallGH]

So this is good for us hobby flyers right?

So can someone just clarify, briefly what are the restrictions to hobby fliers between now and 6 months time? and then between 6 months time and 2 years from then?

Current UK Drone Code rules are allowing more flexibility for a 'hobby flyer' - so no - I don't think this is good for us hobby flyers. Unfortunately, irresponsible operators who have posted videos clearly showing rule-breaking UAV flights, have made it difficult for all of us!

It's not easy to clarify - but - After 1st November 2020, all current drones that do not show an EASA Class label on the manufacturer's product label, become Legacy UAV's and must fly under the rules of 'Open Class' 'category A3'. In essence, this class and category allows flight only outside "... a safe horizontal distance of at least 150 metres distance from residential, commercial, industrial or recreational areas;" This ability to use the Legacy drone in Open Class - category A3 will last indefinitely.
To obtain a dispensation for a two year period after the 1st November, we are told that an Operator of a Legacy drone, can sit an exam to gain an A2 'Certificate of Competency' that will allow an operator to fly the UAV under category A2 rules - which include the ability to fly to 30m from people, and as close as 5m to people - if the UAV has a slow-speed mode that doesn't exceed 3 m/sec. I'm assuming that this allows a drone that does not have an EASA Class logo to be used for commercial operations for that time, while a new Class certified UAV is purchased to continue operations with. At the end of the 2 year period, however, the Legacy drone cannot be used for other than category A3 operations.

The following EASA document is a good reference to cover the basic points behind the regulations:

Easy Access Rules for Unmanned Aircraft Systems (Regulations (EU) 2019/947 and 2019/945) - Revision from April 2024 — Available in pdf, xml, and online format | EASA

This publication contains the rules and procedures for the operation of unmanned aircraft, displayed in a consolidated, easy-to-read format, with advanced navigation features through links and bookmarks.

www.easa.europa.eu

The CAA CAP 1789 document tries to be specific for UK operations. It's a complicated document, but does have a good Q&A section:

CAP1789: The New European UAS Regulations: General Outline | Civil Aviation Authority

publicapps.caa.co.uk

 

[droneloverair]

Would guess that DJI have designed the Air 2 as a C1 (or possibly C2) as it seems to be able to meet the requirements. Later F/W update to slow Tripod mode down to 3m/s an option?

However seeing as for some reason it's not actually certified yet - maybe they decided no need to set Tripod so slowly for the launch of the Air 2?

If they get the model certified, F/W update for all to 3m/s (yet of course the C certification would only apply to serial numbers sold from that point on).

All guesswork though.

If the government regulates the speed to 3m/s wouldnt that also make every drone dangerous to others as the drone would be susceptible to wind drift making it crash and on to private property and into someones head? That otherwise would have been counteracted with speed/motorpower thus avoiding collision and crash/accident.

 

[FoxhallGH]

If the government regulates the speed to 3m/s wouldnt that also make every drone dangerous to others as the drone would be susceptible to wind drift making it crash and on to private property and into someones head? That otherwise would have been counteracted with speed/motorpower thus avoiding collision and crash/accident.

No - that would not be the case ... Limiting the speed does not remove the drone's ability to 'position keep' as it does right now. Limiting airspeed is completely different than rpm limiting - which would have the effect that you are worried about ... For example, if the drone were moving forward at 3 m/sec, but battling a wind from the side of 10 m/sec - I'd expect it to 'lean into wind' to compensate and carry on forward at 3 m/sec.

 

[droneloverair]

In that case then hopefully it will work.

It was just a theory of mine about the speed.

 

[Alex2]

Current UK Drone Code rules are allowing more flexibility for a 'hobby flyer' - so no - I don't think this is good for us hobby flyers. Unfortunately, irresponsible operators who have posted videos clearly showing rule-breaking UAV flights, have made it difficult for all of us!

It's not easy to clarify - but - After 1st November 2020, all current drones that do not show an EASA Class label on the manufacturer's product label, become Legacy UAV's and must fly under the rules of 'Open Class' 'category A3'. In essence, this class and category allows flight only outside "... a safe horizontal distance of at least 150 metres distance from residential, commercial, industrial or recreational areas;" This ability to use the Legacy drone in Open Class - category A3 will last indefinitely.
To obtain a dispensation for a two year period after the 1st November, we are told that an Operator of a Legacy drone, can sit an exam to gain an A2 'Certificate of Competency' that will allow an operator to fly the UAV under category A2 rules - which include the ability to fly to 30m from people, and as close as 5m to people - if the UAV has a slow-speed mode that doesn't exceed 3 m/sec. I'm assuming that this allows a drone that does not have an EASA Class logo to be used for commercial operations for that time, while a new Class certified UAV is purchased to continue operations with. At the end of the 2 year period, however, the Legacy drone cannot be used for other than category A3 operations.

The following EASA document is a good reference to cover the basic points behind the regulations:

Easy Access Rules for Unmanned Aircraft Systems (Regulations (EU) 2019/947 and 2019/945) - Revision from April 2024 — Available in pdf, xml, and online format | EASA

This publication contains the rules and procedures for the operation of unmanned aircraft, displayed in a consolidated, easy-to-read format, with advanced navigation features through links and bookmarks.

www.easa.europa.eu

The CAA CAP 1789 document tries to be specific for UK operations. It's a complicated document, but does have a good Q&A section:

CAP1789: The New European UAS Regulations: General Outline | Civil Aviation Authority

publicapps.caa.co.uk

After November 1st, the MM will become legacy subcategory A1 indefinitely, without the need to undertake any formal qualifications!

In addition, currently rule-breaking flights (especially those conducted with a Mavic Mini) may well become legitimate following the 1st November so long as they are conducted with a compliant drone.

This in turn will make it harder for the viewer to judge whether a video posted after this date is indeed showing a rule-breaking UAV flight by an irresponsible operator.