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“CAN’T OPERATE UAS ON ST AUGUSTINE BEACH FLORIDA” = DEBUNKED

Yep goofy rules for sure. But all good from below high water line. (Not controlled by local authority). Be sure to carry that evidence (B4UFly) with you. You'll probably need it and it worked for me. Remember, once you're in the air, you still have to abide by all Fed Drone laws. If you land/crash on the restricted land, all bets are off. Happy flying ?
 
This might actually work haha

Then someone could do an instructional YouTube video of how to hand launch while midair hahaha
 
The only one with authority to regulate the FLYING of UAVs is FAA (and maybe NPS?). Any governmental level, on the other hand, can legislate where TAKE OFF and LANDING of UAVs are permitted.

The NPS doesn't have authority of the airspace above them. You can take off outside of a National Park and fly over it, provided you do everything legally (VLOS, and definitely don't harass any animals).

Here's a quote from their website:

If I am flying my unmanned aircraft in the national airspace and do not take off, land, or operate from NPS lands and waters, is there anything the park could do to stop me?

Unless an unmanned aircraft pilot obtains special permission through the FAA, use of unmanned aircraft must remain line of sight. In addition, although they do not directly address unmanned aircraft, the following existing 36 CFR sections may apply under certain circumstances.



Happy flying out there!
 
The NPS doesn't have authority of the airspace above them. You can take off outside of a National Park and fly over it, provided you do everything legally (VLOS, and definitely don't harass any animals).

Here's a quote from their website:

If I am flying my unmanned aircraft in the national airspace and do not take off, land, or operate from NPS lands and waters, is there anything the park could do to stop me?

Unless an unmanned aircraft pilot obtains special permission through the FAA, use of unmanned aircraft must remain line of sight. In addition, although they do not directly address unmanned aircraft, the following existing 36 CFR sections may apply under certain circumstances.



Happy flying out there!
Thanks. I am clear that airspace is exclusively controlled by the FAA.

Theoretically, if you could find a National Park that had its main attraction within line of sight distance of the park border, you indeed could legally take of and land while not violating the "operating" a drone within the park.

But I am not familiar with any National Park that might have an attraction within line of sight but that's not otherwise in NFZs.

Anyone know of such a park?
 
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Thanks. I am clear that airspace is exclusively controlled by the FAA.

Theoretically, if you could find a National Park that had its main attraction within line of sight distance of the park border, you indeed could legally take of and land while not violating the "operating" a drone within the park.

But I am not familiar with any National Park that might have an attraction within line of sight but that's not otherwise in NFZs.

Anyone know of such a park?

There are some, for sure, but if you have a Visual Observer, or several, that stay in contact with you over a cell phone or 2 way radio, then as far as the FAA is concerned you've satisfied the VLOS requirement.

I recently flew in St. Augustine and it's beautiful there, I got LAANC authorization for the flight. The NPS controls the Castillo de San Marcos which is a National Monument, but it's small like you're asking. It's beautiful in pictures and video! I got close but there were several people outside so I chose not to fly directly over the Castillo but got very close. I took off and landed at a park just South of there, near a bridge.

376e5a131fb39695280f94287c69572f.jpg
 
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There are some, for sure, but if you have a Visual Observer, or several, that stay in contact with you over a cell phone or 2 way radio, then as far as the FAA is concerned you've satisfied the VLOS requirement.

I recently flew in St. Augustine and it's beautiful there, I got LAANC authorization for the flight. The NPS controls the Castillo de San Marcos which is a National Monument, but it's small like you're asking. It's beautiful in pictures and video! I got close but there were several people outside so I chose not to fly directly over the Castillo but got very close. I took off and landed at a park just South of there, near a bridge.

376e5a131fb39695280f94287c69572f.jpg

Nice shot! I was just about to say that spot haha I don’t live far from there. I haven’t flown there yet because there is a huge red “no fly zone” over it on all airspace maps.
 
I wanted to make sure I was being lawful before attempting to operate my MA2 over the beach to get those awesome dune shots as well as some long exposure shots of the waves.

I’ve been told several times by many people that under no circumstance can you fly a drone over the beaches here but I could never find anything actually stating that.

I researched online until my eyes bled so I decided to reach out to local law enforcement.

So, after emailing the St Augustine Beach Police Department (SABPD) The Police Chief took the time to email me back promptly.

I won’t attach the email traffic here for PII reasons but if you’d like a copy you may PM me if you’re looking to fly in the area and would like the printout.

The response:

“St. Augustine Beach falls under the St. Johns County Beach Code. Per the county beach code, it is unlawful to launch or land a drone on a county beach. It doesn't specify about flying over the beach though after launching and landing from another location.

Hope this helps.”

So, as you can see, it IS legal to fly over the beach here in St Augustine as long as you’re not launching or landing on the beach itself.
Thanks for the info. I live in Jax and drove down to Mantanzas Inlet for some shots. I took off and landed on the beach with no problem from the other people that were there. I got lucky i guess. Thanks again for the info.
 
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Thanks for the info. I live in Jax and drove down to Mantanzas Inlet for some shots. I took off and landed on the beach with no problem from the other people that were there. I got lucky i guess. Thanks again for the info.
Yeah you usually won’t have any issues but I wanted to share this thread info because there are some locals to the beach that don’t much care for it and also if you’re ever approached you now have a legit answer haha
 
I live @ Crescent Beach and have flown many times on the beach. Had a sheriff stop once who sounded to not only know the local ordinances but drones as well. By brother has the mini so didn't fall under the beach rule whereas my phantom did and the officer was the one that brought up the grams part. He also added that I just needed to hand launch/land my phantom and that was fine. Yesterday while flying at Crescent with two others (phantom, air 2 and mini) a PSA officer stopped and first thing out of his mouth was "flying those on the beach is illegal". I told him the story of the sheriff and he said that the sheriff was wrong.
I told him I was hand launching/landing and he said it didn't matter and told me I could park in the lot and fly over. I told him there's never a parking spot which is why I drive out on the beach. He then calmed down and said he wasn't going to do anything if he catches us but couldn't guarantee what another officer might do.
So as usual, I add another "confused" to the drone list. Can I hand launch/land or not? Seems ridiculous to park a couple hundred feet away and do the same thing. And I did openly admit I didn't want to push it cause it only takes one bad apple to mess it up for everyone and then the FAA will ban beaches all together.
Side note, both the sheriff and the PSA said the law/ordinance was created because of paragliders taking off of the beach and one guy with a home made version got dragged down the beach and kept trying only to tick enough people off that they banned taking off and landing from the beach. Unfortunately that included drones. That was one bad apple.
 
I wanted to make sure I was being lawful before attempting to operate my MA2 over the beach to get those awesome dune shots as well as some long exposure shots of the waves.

I’ve been told several times by many people that under no circumstance can you fly a drone over the beaches here but I could never find anything actually stating that.

I researched online until my eyes bled so I decided to reach out to local law enforcement.

So, after emailing the St Augustine Beach Police Department (SABPD) The Police Chief took the time to email me back promptly.

I won’t attach the email traffic here for PII reasons but if you’d like a copy you may PM me if you’re looking to fly in the area and would like the printout.

The response:

“St. Augustine Beach falls under the St. Johns County Beach Code. Per the county beach code, it is unlawful to launch or land a drone on a county beach. It doesn't specify about flying over the beach though after launching and landing from another location.

Hope this helps.”

So, as you can see, it IS legal to fly over the beach here in St Augustine as long as you’re not launching or landing on the beach itself.

The debate stops here.
The FAA and only the FAA controls ALL the airspace of USA. Only the FAA can make laws telling you where you can and can't fly.

BUT the FAA does not control the ground, but only the airspace.
Airports, landing strips, runways, launch and land, is ground activity and the local governments can and do control the activities on the ground within their jurisdiction.

So a local government can prohibit you from taking off/launching from the beach, and landing on the beach. But they can't stop you from flying over the beach. A local government cannot control the airspace, according to congress. Only the FAA can and does.

It's usually as easy as walking across the street to the convenience store/gas station, launching from there, walking across the street to the beach as your drone is already airborne, and flying as you please, and then landing off of beach property.

https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/faa-statement-federal-vs-local-drone-authority

FAA Statement–Federal vs. Local Drone Authority​


Friday, July 20, 2018

Congress has provided the FAA with exclusive authority to regulate aviation safety, the efficiency of the navigable airspace, and air traffic control, among other things. State and local governments are not permitted to regulate any type of aircraft operations, such as flight paths or altitudes, or the navigable airspace.
However, these powers are not the same as regulation of aircraft landing sites, which involves local control of land and zoning. Laws traditionally related to state and local police power – including land use, zoning, privacy, and law enforcement operations – generally are not subject to federal regulation.

Cities and municipalities are not permitted to have their own rules or regulations governing the operation of aircraft.
However, as indicated, they may generally determine the location of aircraft landing sites through their land use powers.
In the context of Unmanned Aircraft Systems (UAS) – popularly called “drones”— the Department of Transportation’s UAS Integration Pilot Program (IPP), directed by the President, will provide the FAA with insight on how to best involve local jurisdictions in the integration of UAS into the airspace in a way that also alleviates their concerns. On May 9, the Secretary of Transportation announced the selection of 10 state, local, and tribal governments as participants in the pilot program. These entities will partner with private sector participants to safely explore the further integration of drone operations. We’re looking forward to working with the IPP participants as we look to the future.


https://www.faa.gov/uas/recreational_fliers/where_can_i_fly/airspace_101/

Airspace 101 – Rules of the Sky​


FAA rules apply to the entire National Airspace System -- there is no such thing as "unregulated" airspace. Drone operators should be familiar with the difference between controlled and uncontrolled airspace, and where you can legally fly. Controlled airspace is found around some airports and at certain altitudes where air traffic controllers are actively communicating with, directing, and separating all air traffic. Other airspace is considered uncontrolled in the sense that air traffic controllers are not directing air traffic within its limits.


In general, you can only fly your drone in uncontrolled airspace below 400 feet above the ground (AGL). Commercial drone operators are required to get permission from the FAA before flying in controlled airspace. Learn more about the rules for Certificated Remote Pilots and commercial operators on Flying Drones Near Airports (Controlled Airspace) – Part 107.

Illustration of Airspace Guidance for Small UAS Operators


(click to enlarge)


Read more about controlled and uncontrolled airspace, as well as the different classifications of controlled airspace in the Pilot's Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge (PDF) in chapter 15 (see page 377).


Remember, there are thousands of private pilots who fly in both controlled and uncontrolled airspace at various altitudes, and they usually cannot see your drone until it's too close for comfort. Drone operators are responsible for staying away from manned aircraft, not the other way around!


...And here is a guy that successfully works his way around no landing or launching on beach or restricted properties.

How to fly a drone Anywhere | Where to fly a drone legally Step by Step Tutorial​

How do I follow the new FAA Rules, Local Laws AND keep my DRONE from being CONFISCATED, get FINES, TICKETS or even ARRESTED by Police or FAA? How do I fly a drone legally in New York City and follow drone rules? If you're asking what are the NEW drone regulations, what are the new FAA rules for hobbyists, what are the local drone laws, how do I find them, where can I fly my drone near me or how do I find out where to fly a drone, even near an airport controlled airspace in Los Angeles?... you're not alone. I receive these questions often on the Alien Drones channel and I think it's because no one really wants to believe it is such a pain in the neck to truly know where and how to fly legally in the US, and spoiler alert, simply opening up B4Ufly or Airmap and see that it shows "good to go" doesn't cut it. Nothing exists that brings the federal, state and local rules together in one place, AND it is constantly moving, so in all fairness this ain't easy! So ignorance is bliss then, right? Secondly, most people simply aren't willing to put in the kind of effort that is currently required to get a valid answer on where it is legal to fly a drone anywhere in the United States simply for a hobby. Pecking at an app for 30 seconds should be good enough, right? Well, tell that to the officer when he shows up, see how that works for ya! Finding a legal spot locally for that DJI is IMPORTANT as well as the FAA airspace rules so here's my guide on how I locate a spot that considers most everything before flying in the U.S.. A recent trip I planed to an overly restrictive California proved both challenging and informative on how not only to do this in San Clemente, California but gave me a blueprint on how I approach flying new areas. Who knew it would be so dang hard? I'll do my best to share knowledge here but I need your comments to continue honing this in for the benefit of the drone community. What say you? Drop your tidbits below... As a side note, as I'm in the U.S. this covers this area so apologies to those in other countries. Pilots outside the US certainly can benefit immensely from the same due diligence process but obviously the details may be different for you in different countries. Wish I could help but hey, I've got my own problems here, right? LOL! -How do I follow the new FAA Rules, Local Laws AND keep my DRONE from being CONFISCATED, get FINES, TICKETS or even ARRESTED by Police or FAA? How do I fly a drone legally in New York City and follow drone rules?



Code:
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/H3_oJ5ZKiwA" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>


I'm a newbie and not sure how to embed youtube into this forum, so if I screwed it up- LOL

Hey Morton, send me a copy of that email please. weldersandblaster ATGMALE
Thanks


And for those of you that might run into these issues, copy this post and keep a copy on your phone in case you must convince some Law Enforcement Officer that the ticket he wants to give you, is unfounded.

If you really want to delve deep into this subject, this thread here does that. Law Question: Can a City Commission arbitrarily make rules regulating Drones without FAA approval?


And this one is scary, This is the mentality of 90% of our lawmakers.

City Council HUMILIATES themselves by ignoring FAA drone laws!​


Happy flying ya'll.
 
…It's usually as easy as walking across the street to the convenience store/gas station, launching from there, walking across the street to the beach as your drone is already airborne, and flying as you please, and then landing off of beach property…
@Blacksheep Pilot shares lots of good references and opinions here, but that quote isn’t correct.

Land is under the control of the landowner, gov or private. A gas station can trespass you, a parks ranger/LEO can write you a ticket or worse if their laws prohibit operation of a drone on their property. If you’re standing in the prohibited space with your controller and the drone is in the air you are operating it.

IF you’re concerned about flying the prohibited beach do it from off-property.

In many cases saying “sorry, I didn’t know that, I’ll land” will calm the situation. Waving around a printout and explaining how you’re not really operating from the beach you’re standing on will just escalate the situation.
 
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…It's usually as easy as walking across the street to the convenience store/gas station, launching from there, walking across the street to the beach as your drone is already airborne, and flying as you please, and then landing off of beach property…
@Blacksheep Pilot shares lots of good references and opinions here, but that quote isn’t correct.

Land is under the control of the landowner, gov or private. A gas station can trespass you, a parks ranger/LEO can write you a ticket or worse if their laws prohibit operation of a drone on their property. If you’re standing in the prohibited space with your controller and the drone is in the air you are operating it.

IF you’re concerned about flying the prohibited beach do it from off-property.

In many cases saying “sorry, I didn’t know that, I’ll land” will calm the situation. Waving around a printout and explaining how you’re not really operating from the beach you’re standing on will just escalate the situation.
I agree with you. That quote was my opinion. I apologize if I was not clear. If there is a city ordinance about landing and take off while being upon the beach, stepping off the beach may be an easy solution. I did not mean stepping off the beach and stepping onto private property, pissing off the property owners. I meant to imply launching from anywhere that is not beach property is frequently the easy solution. I did not mean to imply I can go into a property owner backyard without permission and launch from there.

However, here in St Augustine, Florida, launching from a gas station parking lot and going straight up as I walk away and out of sight, 99 times out of 100, will not bring the counter clerks rushing out of the store to chase me down the street as the drone is now out of sight.

My first goal is to not stay around long enough to make it obvious I'm controlling a drone that's right next to me. Being invisible is the best protection.

My 2nd goal is to not launch/land from government prohibited property.

My 3rd goal, is to play dumb, innocent, harmless, non-confrontational if approached by law enforcement.

My 4th goal is to have my book of laws, rules and regulations with me in case 1-3 fail. I have talked my way out of a ticket for having 2 people upon 1 ATV, (all terrain vehicle, 4 wheeler), as I rode through my state park, by showing the officer the statutes that regulate riding in the state park. And being super friendly and respectful to that park ranger.

My 5th goal is to not annoy, piss off, or irritate the general public with my flying. At 50 feet, you can't hear my drone, It's that quiet. At 100 feet, you virtually can't see it if you're looking for it. DJI mini 2.

And it's a given that flying safe is first and foremost even if I have not said that yet.

And I do believe there is a difference between launching/landing and operating an aircraft.
Florida says the local governments can't interfere with my flying the aircraft, even if I'm standing on property prohibiting launching and landing on that property. I can operate my controller legally from anywhere.


So, both the FAA and the Florida State Legislature are in agreement.
The State of Florida has pre-empted the power to regulate unmanned aircraft systems to itself. See section 320.41, Florida Statutes. (2020).
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine
Subsection (3)(b) of that statute states:

”(b) Except as otherwise expressly provided, a political subdivision may not enact or enforce an ordinance or resolution relating to the design, manufacture, testing, maintenance, licensing, registration, certification, or operation of an unmanned aircraft system, including airspace, altitude, flight paths, equipment or technology requirements; the purpose of operations; and pilot, operator, or observer qualifications, training, and certification.” (Emphasis added)

But this does not protect me from landing on, or taking off from prohibited property.

Be invisible.
Don't piss anyone off.
Be legally protected obeying the laws.
Be nice and friendly.
Be safe, protect our right to fly.
Have fun and smile.


I hope I haven't pissed you off, SethB. I'm not looking for arguments. But as I read this post, I see that might not show thru.
 
…I hope I haven't pissed you off, SethB. I'm not looking for arguments. But as I read this post, I see that might not show thru.
Not at all. I feel that your roundup of regs, practices, and opinions is helpful.

I just wouldn’t want a new pilot reading this thread to take away that there’s wiggle room that doesn’t actually exist. If you’re piloting you’re operating, whether or not you launched from that particular location.

An LEO is not going to put up with threading any such needles. If one presents as someone trying to skirt the regs they will correct you. Nobody wants that. We want to be perceived as respectful of regs, of private property, and as concerned about the safety of other users of public property.

I’m not familiar with state preemption of local drone regs in Florida, and don’t need to be, but would advise non-conflictual communication rather than confrontation.
 
There are some, for sure, but if you have a Visual Observer, or several, that stay in contact with you over a cell phone or 2 way radio, then as far as the FAA is concerned you've satisfied the VLOS requirement.

I recently flew in St. Augustine and it's beautiful there, I got LAANC authorization for the flight. The NPS controls the Castillo de San Marcos which is a National Monument, but it's small like you're asking. It's beautiful in pictures and video! I got close but there were several people outside so I chose not to fly directly over the Castillo but got very close. I took off and landed at a park just South of there, near a bridge.

376e5a131fb39695280f94287c69572f.jpg

FAA rules clearly state that any spotters MUST be physically next to you, and using unaided sight.
 
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