Airspace question

[Jimmytpi]

I live on the edge of KCEF class D airspace. Its Westover ARB Western MA. On the VFR map says check times etc. And I do. It says class D 1200-0400Z, all other times Class E. Is that class E to the surface, Class E 700 or Class E 1200?

 

[sar104]

The airport A/FD actually indicates Class D during those hours and otherwise Class G. However, the airport is also inside Class E 700 ft airspace, which won't affect sUAS operations.

 

[Jimmytpi]

The airport A/FD actually indicates Class D during those hours and otherwise Class G. However, the airport is also inside Class E 700 ft airspace, which won't affect sUAS operations.

Well, I might be able to get some sunrise pictures each day, but thats about it. Thanks.

 

[Jimmytpi]

Well, I might be able to get some sunrise pictures each day, but thats about it. Thanks.

So theoretically at 7 a.m. I could put my drone up 300 ft and fly right over that airport. I'm not going to do it but I could according to the FAA?

 

[sar104]

So theoretically at 7 a.m. I could put my drone up 300 ft and fly right over that airport. I'm not going to do it but I could according to the FAA?

Are we talking about Part 107 here, or recreational?

 

[Jimmytpi]

Let's say part 107

Are we talking about Part 107 here, or recreational?

 

[sar104]

Let's say part 107

Then you would need to follow Part 107 rules on not conflicting with traffic - almost impossible to do at a Class D field outside Class D hours.

 

[mikemoose55]

Abiding by the rules will not save your bacon if there is any conflict between your flight and any other pilot, airport personnel, etc.
Flying a drone it seems automatically makes you a target at least these days. Flying one near an airport is literally tap dancing on a land mine.

I live around 3 miles of a regional well within the 5 mile radius.Classification is G to 700 AGL I fly at my house only above my house now and then but ANY TIME i hear an aircraft I am in a hard dive as possible to 100 feet max
I have seen aircraft overfly my property well below 1000 ft most likey on approach and the traffic pattern seems to be whatever the pilot selects at least at this far out from the facility.
All I need is some report of a visual drone in a full size pattern and I am toast.
BTW I am not a 107 pilot .

Take a line from Dirty Harry....do you feel lucky .....well do ya punk.
Apologies to our global friends who may not have had the opportunity to enjoy a Dirty Harry movie.
mikemoose55

 

[sar104]

Abiding by the rules will not save your bacon if there is any conflict between your flight and any other pilot, airport personnel, etc.
Flying a drone it seems automatically makes you a target at least these days. Flying one near an airport is literally tap dancing on a land mine.

I live around 3 miles of a regional well within the 5 mile radius.Classification is G to 700 AGL I fly at my house only above my house now and then but ANY TIME i hear an aircraft I am in a hard dive as possible to 100 feet max
I have seen aircraft overfly my property well below 1000 ft most likey on approach and the traffic pattern seems to be whatever the pilot selects at least at this far out from the facility.
All I need is some report of a visual drone in a full size pattern and I am toast.
BTW I am not a 107 pilot .

Take a line from Dirty Harry....do you feel lucky .....well do ya punk.
Apologies to our global friends who may not have had the opportunity to enjoy a Dirty Harry movie.
mikemoose55

Slightly different case, since if you are flying recreationally within 5 miles of the field then you need to notify them and they should be able to advise on conflicts, altitudes etc..

 

[mikemoose55]

Sure here is the rub, I belong to a well established R/C club with about 60 members. Our field is just beyond 5 miles from the end of the regional airport runway we are cleanly within class G to 700 ft.

We met with the airport manager did the here we are who we are what we do even invited airport manager to visit our field to get another perspective from our end.
Our club a couple time each year attend airport flyin breakfast events and such as a club, we are well known by the airport.
All is good mostly we fly fixed wing stuff but if there is ever an incident all that meet and greet stuff is not going to do squat for our position. In fact it will be used against us in as much as you knew the airport was there, you knew you were in thier air space , you knew a full size has unquestioned right of way etc etc. Notifications are nice but if you think it is a get out of jail free card you are dreaming.

To fly a drone today is to be guilty first, and subject to the full weight of the law second.
mikemoose55

 

[sar104]

Sure here is the rub, I belong to a well established R/C club with about 60 members. Our field is just beyond 5 miles from the end of the regional airport runway we are cleanly within class G to 700 ft.

We met with the airport manager did the here we are who we are what we do even invited airport manager to visit our field to get another perspective from our end.
Our club a couple time each year attend airport flyin breakfast events and such as a club, we are well known by the airport.
All is good mostly we fly fixed wing stuff but if there is ever an incident all that meet and greet stuff is not going to do squat for our position. In fact it will be used against us in as much as you knew the airport was there, you knew you were in thier air space , you knew a full size has unquestioned right of way etc etc. Notifications are nice but if you think it is a get out of jail free card you are dreaming.

To fly a drone today is to be guilty first, and subject to the full weight of the law second.
mikemoose55

Notification, at any distance, does not change the requirement to avoid and yield to manned traffic, so if you have an "incident" then, by definition, you did not abide by the rules. I'm not clear how that is relevant to the question at hand.

 

[mikemoose55]

its not but the obvious answer to the question is in the chart.
the same source that provided the information of time and classification changes will no doubt have the AGL assignments too. So basically I would guess the answer was there all along.
Anyway my mind tends to wander, that is why mostly I am restricted to running to the end of my chain and barkingmikemoose55

 

[quad]

we all have to abide by our chain.

 

[neggy]

It is class D because there is someone in the tower.
In the times there is nobody in the tower, I would GUESS it is Class E

For those not familiar with the facility it is also a MILITARY base, and IIRC they were sending lots of stuff back and forth to The Sandbox at one point. They fly 24/7

Since flying at night is a theoretical no no under the now defunct 336, and a 107.29 waiver is needed for Part 107 flights ( and you would NEVER get one that close to an airport from my experience) it matters not , because I think you mean to say it is Class E from 0000 to 0400 zulu, which is midnight to 4 AM local time.

So IMHO you are on the edge of Class D during daylight hours, there is no time of the year that the sun rises or sets during class E airspace where you are.

That is assuming you are to the east /northeast because to your west and south you are surrounded by other Class airspace

 

[neggy]

we all have to abide by our chain.

That is correct, and if you look at the sectional around where the OP is , there is a whole lot of yellow, and that tells me as a private pilot, I need to be at a MINIMUM of 1000' AGL, and more than 500' above the tallest object on the ground, like radio towers.... and that means 1000' above the hills too. But since the Class D is to 2600 feet, I can not go wandering in there from 4 AM to Midnight without permission from their tower, I have to over fly it at 2600 AGL plus. I also can not fly VFR above 3000 without being cleared by ATC, so I have a very narrow 400' space where I can fly without being on someone's leash....

 

[Jimmytpi]

It is class D because there is someone in the tower.
In the times there is nobody in the tower, I would GUESS it is Class E

For those not familiar with the facility it is also a MILITARY base, and IIRC they were sending lots of stuff back and forth to The Sandbox at one point. They fly 24/7

Since flying at night is a theoretical no no under the now defunct 336, and a 107.29 waiver is needed for Part 107 flights ( and you would NEVER get one that close to an airport from my experience) it matters not , because I think you mean to say it is Class E from 0000 to 0400 zulu, which is midnight to 4 AM local time.

So IMHO you are on the edge of Class D during daylight hours, there is no time of the year that the sun rises or sets during class E airspace where you are.

That is assuming you are to the east /northeast because to your west and south you are surrounded by other Class airspace

Correct me if I'm wrong, 1200 - 0400Z would be 8 am to midnight local. But I get your meaning. Not trying to argue, just wanted to know if the Class E was from the surface or 700 ft. Thank you Sar104, and I'm not flying anywhere close to Westover, why would I, just wanted to be clear on the Law/rule.

 

[sar104]

It is class D because there is someone in the tower.
In the times there is nobody in the tower, I would GUESS it is Class E

For those not familiar with the facility it is also a MILITARY base, and IIRC they were sending lots of stuff back and forth to The Sandbox at one point. They fly 24/7

Since flying at night is a theoretical no no under the now defunct 336, and a 107.29 waiver is needed for Part 107 flights ( and you would NEVER get one that close to an airport from my experience) it matters not , because I think you mean to say it is Class E from 0000 to 0400 zulu, which is midnight to 4 AM local time.

So IMHO you are on the edge of Class D during daylight hours, there is no time of the year that the sun rises or sets during class E airspace where you are.

That is assuming you are to the east /northeast because to your west and south you are surrounded by other Class airspace

Don't guess. As I posted above, it reverts to G at the surface outside Class D hours. It is under 700 ft Class E.

 

[Jimmytpi]

Don't guess. As I posted above, it reverts to G at the surface outside Class D hours. It is under 700 ft Class E.

That is what I'm confused about. You will notice that Barnes AFB is to the west of Westover. They also have class D airspace with times. Their airspace specifically states that the airspace is G when not D, but Westover specifically states class E when not D. If class E dosen't start at the surface, why the difference?

 

[sar104]

That is what I'm confused about. You will notice that Barnes AFB is to the west of Westover. They also have class D airspace with times. Their airspace specifically states that the airspace is G when not D, but Westover specifically states class E when not D. If class E dosen't start at the surface, why the difference?

No - that's incorrect. The A/FD info for Westover clearly states Class G outside Class D hours.

 

[Jimmytpi]

I'm looking at VFRMAP.com is there another pkace I should be looking.