Does Mavic Shoot Video or Watercolor Paintings? Don’t settle. Get Involved!

[AyeYo]

Moral of the story? Your expectations are too high, as they are with everyone complaining in this thread. I think most of you have probably never seen a full res cell phone photo on a large screen and therefore have no basis of comparison for the Mavic. 12MP photos aren't meant to be viewed and cropped at full res. Look at them on a 1080p display and they look great.

 

[WheelzWorld]

Well the gopro takes good pictures at 12MP... and jpg is pretty good. I don't know, has it a bigger sensor?

Also my Honor 8 pictures look way better than the mavic... That shouldn't be the case in my opinion...

 

[AyeYo]

Yea but you're also comparing to the Mavic jpeg, which is known broken. The Mavic RAW looks quite nice for what it is.

This is partly DJI's fault as well, because of the push for 4k res. Just because a camera can shoot 4K doesn't mean it went be compressed into oblivion garbage that isn't actually viewable on a 4K display. But what you can do with it is make some really nice 1080p down renders. Those of us with any photography background never bought a Mavic expecting usable 4K video. I don't even shoot in 4K. I shoot 2.7K because this thing is only good for a 1080p render anyway.

 

[cardplayer71]

Yea but you're also comparing to the Mavic jpeg, which is known broken. The Mavic RAW looks quite nice for what it is.

This is partly DJI's fault as well, because of the push for 4k res. Just because a camera can shoot 4K doesn't mean it went be compressed into oblivion garbage that isn't actually viewable on a 4K display. But what you can do with it is make some really nice 1080p down renders. Those of us with any photography background never bought a Mavic expecting usable 4K video. I don't even shoot in 4K. I shoot 2.7K because this thing is only good for a 1080p render anyway.

I used 2.7k as well because their 1080 compression is broken, I hear, due to the FPV goggle support and the 4K is just compressed to death.

 

[Strafe1]

Well the gopro takes good pictures at 12MP... and jpg is pretty good. I don't know, has it a bigger sensor?

Also my Honor 8 pictures look way better than the mavic... That shouldn't be the case in my opinion...

I thought the GoPro sensor was similar. I actually prefer the images out of the Mavic over the GP. Not just the field of view, but the entire look of it.

 

[Kestrel]

I never was into shooting videos so I don't have any experience or any real knowledge of the whole practice but I think 4k looks fine to me, again to my untrained eyes, and the majority of people have untrained eyes as well. So Maybe the minority of camera snobs its not the best but to the average person I believe the 4k video is fine.

 

[sostengo]

Went out today for a test flight, i restarted the camera by switching NTSC/PAL like some people mentioned here.

First one is a screencapture from a video with "None"and the standard settings:


Second one with D-Cinelike and sharpness to -1:


I should probably tried the D-Cinelike without the sharpness -1 or maybe the "None" with sharpness -1 as well. But so far the other profiles are giving me less information to work with.

 

[bk_flyguy]

From reading here, would you say the following is correct:

Use Dlog for high contrast scenes only, because data is removed from midtones in order to help with highlights/shadows to increase the DR

Use 0,0,0 for dlog, or perhaps 0, -2, 0 for high contrast scenes to slightly improve latitude in post -- NO SHARPNESS REDUCTION FOR DLOG -- is this official?

Use D-Cinelike (or ART) for standard or lower contrast scenes to get a better distribution of data on the starved bitrate (more data in the midtones)

Make sure to ETTR (expose to the right) to keep as much detail as possible. Be careful not to under-expose the Mavic! Remove ND filters if needed and prioritize too high a shutter speed if you must choose between proper shutter and low exposure values. Under-exposing the Mavic is no-go due to the low-bitrate and small sensor.

You may set sharpness at -1 (or perhaps even -2?) for Cinelike/ART profiles, but do NOT do this in dlog, as it will cause watercolour effect (because the log profile removes data from the midtones in order to evenly distribute). But, you could reduce sharpness slightly on another profile that has a more even bit distribution

It seems shooting 2.7k @ 45mbps will give more data per pixel than 4k @ 60mbps?

* Does adding Polar Pro filters reduce sharpness at all? Or no affect?

 

[borislip]

This kinda makes me wonder, would using 24fps (as opposed to NTSC's 30fps) keep the same 60mbps bitrate? If it would, this should decrease the compression a little.

 

[bk_flyguy]

Not sure, but you can examine the bitrate after. The Mavic does shift bitrate for resolution, it may for framerate also and thus not improve quality. But I will say, many slow motion modes on camera reduce quality per frame as they work on the same bitrate for the given resolution. So it is possible!

If so, the change from 30 to 24 would be negligible, but with bit-starved mavric, it may help marginally?

 

[WheelzWorld]

Unfortunately there seem to be many advantages to shoot in 30fps vs 24fps. Does anyone saw a jump in quality by filming in 24 vs 30?

 

[bk_flyguy]

don't forget the rest of the questions a couple posts back

 

[AyeYo]

From reading here, would you say the following is correct:

Use Dlog for high contrast scenes only, because data is removed from midtones in order to help with highlights/shadows to increase the DR

The correct time to use d-log on the Mavic is: never. It's too noisy of a sensor. There's too much compression for whatever reason (crap hardware, bad software, etc.)

Use 0,0,0 for dlog, or perhaps 0, -2, 0 for high contrast scenes to slightly improve latitude in post -- NO SHARPNESS REDUCTION FOR DLOG -- is this official?

No d-log ever. That's official.

Use D-Cinelike (or ART) for standard or lower contrast scenes to get a better distribution of data on the starved bitrate (more data in the midtones)

No. This camera only shoots good in "none". Cinelike and Art are just modified or mild log profiles.

Make sure to ETTR (expose to the right) to keep as much detail as possible. Be careful not to under-expose the Mavic! Remove ND filters if needed and prioritize too high a shutter speed if you must choose between proper shutter and low exposure values. Under-exposing the Mavic is no-go due to the low-bitrate and small sensor.

I actually err on the dark side, but your mileage may vary. In post, I find it far easier to recover shadows than highlights. When highlights look gone with this camera, they are gone.

You may set sharpness at -1 (or perhaps even -2?) for Cinelike/ART profiles, but do NOT do this in dlog, as it will cause watercolour effect (because the log profile removes data from the midtones in order to evenly distribute). But, you could reduce sharpness slightly on another profile that has a more even bit distribution

Again, the correct profile is None 0,0,0 - nothing else (maybe TrueColor). Some hefty noise reduction will take care of things in post just fine, but trying to get a noise free picture by lowering sharpening in-camera is putting you on the fast track to watercolor station.

It seems shooting 2.7k @ 45mbps will give more data per pixel than 4k @ 60mbps?

Can't confirm that, but I hope someone else can. From what I recall from prior discussions, the bitrate changes are proportional when going down in res, so no additional quality should be expected - but I haven't seen anyone else confirm that.

I'd really like to see someone do a bitrate comparison between 24fps and 30fps.

* Does adding Polar Pro filters reduce sharpness at all? Or no affect?

No effect.

 

[Strafe1]

The correct time to use d-log on the Mavic is: never. It's too noisy of a sensor. There's too much compression for whatever reason (crap hardware, bad software, etc.)




No d-log ever. That's official.



No. This camera only shoots good in "none". Cinelike and Art are just modified or mild log profiles.



I actually err on the dark side, but your mileage may vary. In post, I find it far easier to recover shadows than highlights. When highlights look gone with this camera, they are gone.



Again, the correct profile is None 0,0,0 - nothing else (maybe TrueColor). Some hefty noise reduction will take care of things in post just fine, but trying to get a noise free picture by lowering sharpening in-camera is putting you on the fast track to watercolor station.



Can't confirm that, but I hope someone else can. From what I recall from prior discussions, the bitrate changes are proportional when going down in res, so no additional quality should be expected - but I haven't seen anyone else confirm that.

I'd really like to see someone do a bitrate comparison between 24fps and 30fps.



No effect.

Not true for every Mavic. I think most of them though, after reading this thread. For me, I get my best production using D-Cinelike at -1,-1,-1. Or D-Log 0,0,0. None or TrueColor are oversaturated for me. I don't get any watercolor effect with the settings I'm using, unless I underexpose. I also get cleaner footage shooting in 4k/30. Just my observations.

 

[bk_flyguy]

Dlog - NEVER? Really? I am new to the Mavic, but I thought it was largely improved last firmware update (with caveats and proper use, of course?). Please help me understand.

 

[AyeYo]

Dlog - NEVER? Really? I am new to the Mavic, but I thought it was largely improved last firmware update (with caveats and proper use, of course?). Please help me understand.

Ask yourself this... why are you using it?

 

[bk_flyguy]

To maximize dynamic range in high contrast scenes, and flexibility in applying a look in post. I understand this is inherently limited by the mushy codec of the Mavic and low quality sensor. I am new to the Mavic, so it's a legitimate question on my behalf: is there really no use case for dlog? I thought it was improved as of the feb update?

 

[AyeYo]

To maximize dynamic range in high contrast scenes, and flexibility in applying a look in post. I understand this is inherently limited by the mushy codec of the Mavic and low quality sensor. I am new to the Mavic, so it's a legitimate question on my behalf: is there really no use case for dlog? I thought it was improved as of the feb update?

I think it makes the most sense to start from square one... why did you buy the Mavic? People are going to have many answers to that, but DJI's answer (based on their target market) is something like "because I'm an outdoorsy person looking for a portable drone to capture my outdoorsy stuff where I can't carry a Phantom."

With that established, the Mavic was designed to get shots other drones can't because you wouldn't have bothered to bring them with you (or realistically couldn't have brought them). The Mavic is supposed to document mountain sports, backpacking trips, and stuff of that nature. It's built for portability first and foremost.

With that too established, the Mavic maximizes portability at the expense of image quality and... guess what... it doesn't matter. Because if you're using this drone as intended, the people watching your videos aren't looking at and don't care about whether your trees are showing individual leaves. They don't care whether that area in an irrelevant corner of the shot has good shadow detail. They're watching the badass mountain biker blast down the hill or they're looking at the mountain views, not the tree branches.

So with that all established, what is the point of maybe kinda sorta (because I've no seen compelling evidence that d-log actually increases dynamic range on the Mavic) increasing dynamic range at the expense of detail in the main exposure? It's totally pointless and counter-productive to the intended use of the drone. If you want a slightly flatter color profile so you can more easily grade to your liking, then just shoot less saturation.

Now, on the other hand, if you're a pixel peeper that needs to count pine needles - you bought the wrong drone. If you're a cinematographer that needs crystal clarity at 4K on a 4K screen - you bought the wrong drone. If you like to spend ages in post processing tweaking your videos to perfection - you bought the wrong drone, because the image data just isn't there to support it.

This drone you have here is there to fulfill the saying "the best camera is the one you have with you", because a low-quality Mavic video of a cool moment still beats the hell out of not capturing the moment at all.

 

[bk_flyguy]

Hi AyeYo,

I am a professional cinematographer who purchased the drone to capture the best images possible. Due to the nature of my work (remote documentary work on small plane with extremely limited baggage weights) and the need to bring a full camera gear set, the Mavic is my only option for aerials.

Frankly, I bought exactly the right drone and am well aware of where to set expectations. When shooting locally, or even some international projects, we use dedicated operators and drones like the Inspire 2.

My mission right now is to maximize the limited quality possible from the drone, so I would prefer to keep the discussion focused on the specific use care scenarios and caveats of dlog post feb update, as well as the other questions which you gracefully helped answer in my post. The more feedback from experienced cinematographers and the community here the better.

 

[WheelzWorld]

I think it makes the most sense...
...guess what... it doesn't matter ...
...They're watching the badass mountain biker blast down the hill....

I stopped there....

IN THIS CASE WHY THE F....... DON'T WE HAVE 60.... no wait.... 120FPS???????

and don't dare tell me we have it in 1080!!!!

I'm ending up thinking attaching a GoPro to the mavic is my only option!