I found for me, I can see my Mavic 3 from 1,500 feet. So it would be impossible to go so high on your own property that they couldn't see you.
HOA demands that I stop flying drones in the neighborhood. Need advice
- Thread starter solidhouse
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Of course use a leaf blower when taking off, but don't use it only every time you take off. Use it a lot, a very lot and be sure to use it at all different times of the day that you are allowed to use it. That way you will not draw suspicion to yourself, every time you take off.
Plus, you can be causing far more noise and nuisance than any drone flight, and see if you get complaints about that. If none are forthcoming, then you may have a case that this is a personal attack against you flying your drone and has nothing to do with the suggested noise etc. that was in the letter.
You might just get an RC car and drive that around and see if people complain about that noise. Also see if the HOA have anything to say about RC cars running about the neighborhood. Of course, you could be a bugger and go outside of the HOA borders and then take off and fly back over and hover around your house. They can't do anything about that.
I'd also document the times and decibel sound levels, every time you hear a lawnmower or leaf blower being used, and then have that info to present to the board, if you do have a meeting and then compare that sound level and times of day list, to what you do.
I'm sure it was your noisy little FPV that started this all off, since you mentioned that you never had a previous problem, when flying your other drones. With all that said, if you have an acre of land, why are you taking off right in front of your house on the driveway? Why not go way out in the middle of your land or edge of it, if no neighbor is by you, and fly away from there?
And finally, if you say you usually fly off long distances, then it makes sense to drive to that location and conduct your flying from that point. I'd never buy a house that has a HOA and have them dictate, what can and can't be done, with the property I own, plus charge the monthly or annual HOA fees, just to live there.
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Another person here who flies frequently in my HOA controlled neighborhood, moved here in 2016 and no complaints yet. But that is exactly when I fly either my Avata or FPV drone - when the landscapers are at a neighboring home with their leaf blowers, lawn mowers, hedge trimmers, etc.
We all have 1/2 are lots, so lots of noise cover durinig the summer.
I try to fly daily, and some days that means I only have time to fly from my yard. My backyard is up against a large green space which is where I fly. No problems flying my Mini 2 or 3 because they are considerably quieter than the 2 goggled drones. .Aerial maneuvers over the Green Belt are still quite noisy. So I fly during the day while most are at work, use the landscapers to hide the noise, and fly high and away from houses.
AMann
Well-Known Member
Its flying handle heavy LOLLLLL.
Nuisance is a loaded word. Is the guy tuning cars all day Saturday a nuisance? Not if his buddy is on the board. Or the guy that thinks being deaf when riding his Harley around the block is cool? What about the barking dog that never shuts up?
As a person who has been a board member in two separate HOA's, and having dealt with our attorneys on many occasions over money issues and other board members who think they are God, I can say it will be difficult to work through the morass. An HOA can fine you for being a nuisance and you can fight the fine in court. Yep - that is your only legal recourse.
Best to attend a board meeting or three - they must be public and announced in advance. If the board isn't announcing the board meetings, you can haul them into court. If you see a couple board members chatting about HOA issues without a formal meeting, they are also probably breaking the law. But a board meeting is where you need to air your concerns. You are not allowed to speak for most of the meeting - only board members and committee members are "permitted" to speak; but most boards allow discussion time even during normal business. And, after the normal business, new business is opened and you should be allowed to bring up your concerns. Silly board members may require you to "request" attending and a time slot...
In the end, the board can spend the HOA funds on attorneys all day long and rack up millions in legal fees the HOA will have to repay -- seen it done -- so just know the battle can be uphill, but the simplest fix is to talk to the board members and even the architectural committee if you have one. Anyone you can chat with to put a face to the problem.
ps: the complaint may stem from privacy - someone thinks you are looking in their windows; or noise - a drone buzzing around in circles is annoying to a non-participant. In the first case, show a board member a flight - let them wear the goggles - let them see if you can look in windows. In the second case - noise, what can you do to show the board you are willing to work with them to mitigate the noise? No answers there - I've had to have conversations with neighbors myself - and I've changed my flight habits to get the drone out of dodge before the noise can be a concern (up and out).
As a person who has been a board member in two separate HOA's, and having dealt with our attorneys on many occasions over money issues and other board members who think they are God, I can say it will be difficult to work through the morass. An HOA can fine you for being a nuisance and you can fight the fine in court. Yep - that is your only legal recourse.
Best to attend a board meeting or three - they must be public and announced in advance. If the board isn't announcing the board meetings, you can haul them into court. If you see a couple board members chatting about HOA issues without a formal meeting, they are also probably breaking the law. But a board meeting is where you need to air your concerns. You are not allowed to speak for most of the meeting - only board members and committee members are "permitted" to speak; but most boards allow discussion time even during normal business. And, after the normal business, new business is opened and you should be allowed to bring up your concerns. Silly board members may require you to "request" attending and a time slot...
In the end, the board can spend the HOA funds on attorneys all day long and rack up millions in legal fees the HOA will have to repay -- seen it done -- so just know the battle can be uphill, but the simplest fix is to talk to the board members and even the architectural committee if you have one. Anyone you can chat with to put a face to the problem.
ps: the complaint may stem from privacy - someone thinks you are looking in their windows; or noise - a drone buzzing around in circles is annoying to a non-participant. In the first case, show a board member a flight - let them wear the goggles - let them see if you can look in windows. In the second case - noise, what can you do to show the board you are willing to work with them to mitigate the noise? No answers there - I've had to have conversations with neighbors myself - and I've changed my flight habits to get the drone out of dodge before the noise can be a concern (up and out).
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bobmoore1954
Active Member
I would politely defend you are not a nuisance. You are licensed and abide by FAA regulations and safety practices of reputable CBO's. You do not fly over people, moving vehicles, and maintain a safe distance from the public. You should thank them for being concerned with nuisances and suggest they look into real nuisances - barking dogs, speeders, walkers in the bike lane, bikes on the walking paths, ping ping ping of pickelball -- things like that.
Captain Spock
Well-Known Member
WOW. Goldmine of info here. Thanks all for comments and links
Captain Spock
Well-Known Member
You can almost say anything can be a nuisance. I don't see how that can really even be a legal term. I wish the only noise I had to put up with here in the Philippines was a drone.
I am starting to think that we need to purchase a db measuring device to show that the noise isn’t an issue. I would contact the HOA and ask them if they could be more specific about how it is a ‘nuisance’, maybe even offer an olive branch and say that you will not be flying the FPV. If it is a privacy issue, perhaps you can fly along the road and say you will not move your camera downward until you are outside the area, and explaining you have no interest in the houses and your interest is outside the area. Maybe invoice the president of the HOA to see you fly your drone and get him interested in drones, then get a neighbourhood drone club and then you can fly squadrons of drones over the houses.
Sorry about that. This is what I intended to post.
Drones over you property; do you own the airspace?
Suggest this video be shown to the HOA. Maybe the board of governors right away, and also at the next HOA meeting.
Yes, here is an advice, stop flying in your neighborhood... On the other hand, check the bylaws. If there is no mention of launching an aircraft of any kind from the HOA controlled grounds, they have no base for their request, other than appealing to the goodness of your heart. They control the grounds not the air.
GrayHornet
Well-Known Member
Seek out attorney with HOA litigation experience. You can find one by searching your clerk of courts public records. Also. search your HOA to find out its litigation experience using that site. While HOA can use the nuisance covenant broadly, it is a tough sell by an HOA to outright ban use of your drone on your property. At worst, HOA can limit hours you can fly like daylight only. In any event, a lawyer can help. Question is how much time and money you want to invest?
Better go get on the HOA board so they don't vote to put something official in place about UAV's .
If they do then you're legally bound to abide by their rules in most states.
In a handful of states per the FAA property owners do own the airspace up to 75 ft from the ground.
In short check the regs for the state and county you're flying in. The HOA can impose drone rules.
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I would find the Harley (or the leaf blower mentioned upthread) way more annoying than a drone. But the thing here is that there's at least one person with an axe to grind (hmm, that would be noisy too!) and who understands how to use the HOA to get what their way. There's one in every neighborhood.
I find the whole concept of an HOA very foreign (I don't think we have such entities here in Canada), but it seems they have overly vague and broad 'rules' that they can bring to bear. But I really like the FAA suggestion.
Law-abiding drone pilots follow the appropriate federal rules, which sometimes limit what we can do. Conversely, as long as we are following the rules, and being respectful of our neighbors, we should be allowed to enjoy our hobby / trade.
Maybe the starting point is a matter of quoting chapter and verse of the regs at them, while offering to educate them about drone flying. Heck, maybe even give one or two of the board members an offer to let them see you fly. Then they can see for themselves and possibly be more of a reasonable ally than an arbitrary foe.
It's worth a shot.
Bohemian, the FAA does not control the airspace in Canada. In this case you need to be referring to Transport Canada's for rules and regulations while flying in Canada. In short quoting something from The FAA won't matter there in Canada.
After checking with Transport Canada one would then need to check out the local laws for the current territory or province they are flying in.
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HOA's are a pain, but folks have a choice to live in an HOA regulated property. The HOA can make up their own rules if reasonable and have them enforced by local law enforcement. That's a fact. Now, you can go in like you did and quote a bunch of legal jargan and perhaps the HOA members as a whole will be in agreement. Which is great! However, That's not always the case of what happens. Bottom line property managers can put UAV specific rules into place and they are enforceable in most every state. At least in the US.
We all should know by now that state and federal laws OFTEN do not coexist very well equally, in many areas of the law.
I did the same thing in a high end neighborhood years ago. When you bring the law there isn’t much they can do. They rely on people being ignorant of the law.
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