Is non-profit commercial?

[RichieGG]

If I make and post video to aid and promote a 501(c)3 org considered commercial by the FAA?
All my time donated...

 

[ac0j]

Here we go again..... There is a very similar active thread on this right now. Tons of comments, but the answer depends on what total stranger you choose to believe.
Brace yourself for a lot of "educated" confusion!
My advice? Do it and donate it anonymously.

EDIT to add: Take a look at this thread. Take an aspirin first! "Flying over people..."

 

[laurens23]

If I make and post video to aid and promote a 501(c)3 org considered commercial by the FAA?
All my time donated...

yes, this would fall under 107. section 366 is for recreation only. Working (creating promotion material) for free/non-profit is still considered working.

Maybe you know someone with a 107 license who can accompany you during the flying?
Or if this is something you plan on doing more often, just get your 107 license yourself.

 

[ac0j]

yes, this would fall under 107. section 366 is for recreation only. Working (creating promotion material) for free/non-profit is still considered working.

Maybe you know someone with a 107 license who can accompany you?
Or is this is something you plan on doing more often, just get your 107 license yourself.

OMG! Where were you in the other thread! Good answer!

 

[ac0j]

@laurens23
Just a question from a dumb hobby pilot,
In this situation in the OP, I understand that the FAA wants to fleece a person out of more money if they want to earn money in the air with the whole 107 thing, BUT, Say he does the shoot, with a 107 holder there, how would anybody ever know the 107 was there? Who would ask? Do 107 pilots have to submit flight data from a "commercial flights" to the FAA and report income? Does the 107 holder watermark his ID in the video or picture for proof?
Maybe it is a loose compromise in comparison to having a licensed driver in the car when you only have a learner permit, BUT If you dont need supervision by a 107 to do hobby flights anywhere in the airspace, why would you need a 107 present to do a "commercial" job only because of the potential of a few dollars being earned? Is there a financial adviser component to the 107?

(I hate the very broad use of commercial in this case)

Dont be mad at me, I really have a hard time with these senseless government rules.

 

[RichieGG]

I do plan to get my license, have ordered a couple books from amazon...
I was just wondering if I could use footage from before I get the license.

 

[ac0j]

I do plan to get my license, have ordered a couple books from amazon...
I was just wondering if I could use footage from before I get the license.

I still say do it and keep it as an anonymously donated video.

 

[laurens23]

@laurens23
Just a question from a dumb hobby pilot,
In this situation in the OP, I understand that the FAA wants to fleece a person out of more money if they want to earn money in the air with the whole 107 thing, BUT, Say he does the shoot, with a 107 holder there, how would anybody ever know the 107 was there? Who would ask? Do 107 pilots have to submit flight data from a "commercial flights" to the FAA and report income? Does the 107 holder watermark his ID in the video or picture for proof?
Maybe it is a loose compromise in comparison to having a licensed driver in the car when you only have a learner permit, BUT If you dont need supervision by a 107 to do hobby flights anywhere in the airspace, why would you need a 107 present to do a "commercial" job only because of the potential of a few dollars being earned? Is there a finavial advisor component to the 107?

(I hate the very broad use of commercial in this case)

Dont be mad at me, I really have a hard time with these senseless government rules.

IANAL:
It is not a question if the 107 pilot was really there or not. It is a question of what is legal and what is not.

OP could just do the promotion video alone, without 107, and likely nobody will find out or care much. Even if people start asking questions OP could just lie. However that does not make it legal, which was what OP was asking for.

an example: There is always a small chance someone will report the flight and police show up. He could then of course claim its a 366 flight (assuming its within 366 regulations this claim, while not strictly true, can not be contested). This makes the flight legal at that time. Then later he could still give the footage to the non-profit org, but that would be illegal.
If there was a 107 pilot present there would likely be no issue as the 107 could claim responsibility for the flight (i.e. be pilot during commercial bit) and show his license to the authorities covering the legal side.

 

[Scooterx64]

Why could you not just post the video on your own youtube channel and then the non-profit org can link to it?

 

[FlyGuy8675309]

Just show up to your gigs dressed like this. No questions will be asked.. other than ladies asking for your digits.

 

[Vegasdad]

I started to write a long reply as why I think you should do it BUT I don’t have time to get in a pissing match with some person who thinks you should know what run way signs mean. Go for it!!!!!

 

[ac0j]

People take some stuff to literal.
This whole argument is like saying your kids can’t have a lemonade stand in your driveway without a federal tax ID and a food service permit.

 

[jaysrmc]

Just show up to your gigs dressed like this. No questions will be asked.. other than ladies asking for your digits.

I just shat myself laughing at this. I bid u good day, sir as I must go find TP now.

 

[RichieGG]

IANAL:
It is not a question if the 107 pilot was really there or not. It is a question of what is legal and what is not.

OP could just do the promotion video alone, without 107, and likely nobody will find out or care much. Even if people start asking questions OP could just lie. However that does not make it legal, which was what OP was asking for.

an example: There is always a small chance someone will report the flight and police show up. He could then of course claim its a 366 flight (assuming its within 366 regulations this claim, while not strictly true, can not be contested). This makes the flight legal at that time. Then later he could still give the footage to the non-profit org, but that would be illegal.
If there was a 107 pilot present there would likely be no issue as the 107 could claim responsibility for the flight (i.e. be pilot during commercial bit) and show his license to the authorities covering the legal side.

LOL....
The area I am contemplating this is in the Tumacacori mtns, in S AZ...
The only other people likely to be present, or within several miles, are other club members... Maybe some curious Border Patrol agents, too.

 

[RichieGG]

Why could you not just post the video on your own youtube channel and then the non-profit org can link to it?

My what??? I don't have one of them...

 

[RichieGG]

Thanks for all the replies, especially the FAA memo. Sounds like I should be ok...