It’s out… Are they nuts?

[Vic Moss]

Basically yes, but co-located technically only applies to the recreational exemption. Under Part 107 both the PIC and any VOs must both be able to see the aircraft at all times (which makes daisy chaining pointless and doesn't buy distance) but they do not have to be co-located - that word is not used in Part 107.

Correct in that it's not used, but it's implied. It does apply to flights under both 44809 and 107. And as you mention, it is used in 44809 (3).

 

[Phanfran]

What turned me off, even before I saw the price, was when I checked the specs.... seems they don't have the time or energy to convert the numbers from metric to standard.... but then over half the stuff they listed there, even if they did do the conversions, I would not have a clue what it meant... all written for some super drone nerds.

Maybe you're forgetting here just a little bit that for more than 80 % of the world metric IS the standard.

 

[vindibona1]

The temptation is real...

DJI put many of us in a Trance with this release.

For me the curiosity of what they'd come up with next was intriguing. For me, my biggest gripe with DJI drones has been their geofencing scheme. This should not exist in a professional level drone. While the M2P is not on the same level as the Inspire (does Inspire have geofencing too???) the most frustrating thing I've experienced has been, on paid gigs, to have to deal with geofencing issues prior to the job, often initially without full success of unlocking.

Obviously if someone has got some volume business the cost isn't so terrible as it's a write off and the business should cover the extra expense. But there are other considerations too. Crash/loss insurance. Look at what DJI charges for their FPV both on the front end and with replacement. Will they cover loss too with the M3? We all know it's not if but when and how bad... and how much$...

... And how much better will the images be? Ok, if you're shooting for Cecil B. it's probably a great investment if you can't afford a giant platform with a Red attached. If you're shooting for a 4k corporate video, is it going to give you that much of an advantage? Ok... so it's got a zoom lens on it. I think I would be more inclined to get an Air2s if the EVO3 is too expensive, or that. Again, my biggest fear with DJI is it's ability to "brick" one's drone at the most inopportune time. It doesn't matter if you're going to fly 5 feet off the ground in your back yard, but if you're in one of those odd NFZ's it's just an unnecessary hassle that no other drone company bothers with.

Will DJI keep the M2's in production? There seems to be a huge jump between the Air2s and the M3. But if I could ignore the geofencing I might be more inclined to go with an Air2s rather than an M3. The pictures I've seen from that drone are stunning and the only thing it lacks IMO is variable aperture.

About Pro-rez... Yeah, there is a huge space penalty that I'm sure drives up the cost to have an onboard chip to record to, that would probably up the price about $1500 alone. But if Pro-rez is desired or required, files can be easily converted to Pro-Rez with a program such as Shutter Encoder. Also... Other than the big three: Final Cut, Premier and Davinci, will the other budget NLE's be able to deal with Pro-Rez encoded files?

 

[sar104]

Correct in that it's not used, but it's implied. It does apply to flights under both 44809 and 107. And as you mention, it is used in 44809 (3).

At the risk of diving too far into semantics, I don't see where it is even implied and I've wondered before whether the absence in Part 107 of the clear co-location statement in 44809 is deliberate or accidental - in other words was an operational case envisaged where the PIC and VO might need not to be co-located. Obviously they could not be very far apart if they both have VLOS at all times, but perhaps the VO might be on top of a structure to maintain a better view of the surrounding airspace, for example.

In any case, the letter of the law supersedes implication, and so technically it doesn't apply to Part 107 as long as the actual specified requirements are met.

 

[Vic Moss]

Is the Mavic 3 complying with CE Mark and RemoteID? Or that an update they will have deploy at a later time?

RID standards aren't out yet. DJI is hoping a simple firmware update will make them compliant. Not sure about CE Mark.

 

[Vic Moss]

At the risk of diving too far into semantics, I don't see where it is even implied and I've wondered before whether the absence in Part 107 of the clear co-location statement in 44809 is deliberate or accidental - in other words was an operational case envisaged where the PIC and VO might need not to be co-located. Obviously they could not be very far apart if they both have VLOS at all times, but perhaps the VO might be on top of a structure to maintain a better view of the surrounding airspace, for example.

It's from my discussions with FAA folks on the subject.

In any case, the letter of the law supersedes implication, and so technically it doesn't apply to Part 107 as long as the actual specified requirements are met.

Correct, but as you mentioned in the other post, RPIC and VO must have the ability to maintain VLOS, so this is basically moot.

 

[VenomXts]

It was never physically in stock. Its been showing In stock soon since time DJI made the official announcement. Probably still stuck at port or customs

Their have been lots in the system. I understand supply chain

 

[macoman]

No thanks DJI, I will keep my Air 2s and mini 2. I fly for fun anyway. The Air 2s camera is more than enough for me.

 

[Vic Moss]

For me the curiosity of what they'd come up with next was intriguing. For me, my biggest gripe with DJI drones has been their geofencing scheme. This should not exist in a professional level drone. While the M2P is not on the same level as the Inspire (does Inspire have geofencing too???) the most frustrating thing I've experienced has been, on paid gigs, to have to deal with geofencing issues prior to the job, often initially without full success of unlocking.

All DJI drones have GEO fencing. But there does need to be a QEP for qualified 107s to use.

Obviously if someone has got some volume business the cost isn't so terrible as it's a write off and the business should cover the extra expense. But there are other considerations too. Crash/loss insurance. Look at what DJI charges for their FPV both on the front end and with replacement. Will they cover loss too with the M3? We all know it's not if but when and how bad... and how much$...

You can buy Refresh for the M3. Refresh is either $400 for two years, or $239 for one.

... And how much better will the images be? Ok, if you're shooting for Cecil B. it's probably a great investment if you can't afford a giant platform with a Red attached. If you're shooting for a 4k corporate video, is it going to give you that much of an advantage? Ok... so it's got a zoom lens on it. I think I would be more inclined to get an Air2s if the EVO3 is too expensive, or that.

Without optical zoom, the 1/2" sensor seams pointless to me. The 4/3 sensor is a no brainer to me. I can get a 4/3 sensor in the air for $2200. That's remarkable.

Again, my biggest fear with DJI is it's ability to "brick" one's drone at the most inopportune time. It doesn't matter if you're going to fly 5 feet off the ground in your back yard, but if you're in one of those odd NFZ's it's just an unnecessary hassle that no other drone company bothers with.

All drone companies will incorporate some sort of GEO at some point. It's inevitable.

Will DJI keep the M2's in production? There seems to be a huge jump between the Air2s and the M3. But if I could ignore the geofencing I might be more inclined to go with an Air2s rather than an M3. The pictures I've seen from that drone are stunning and the only thing it lacks IMO is variable aperture.

Most Mavic 2 versions are End Of Life, and no longer in production. Some of the Enterprise versions are still being produced.

About Pro-rez... Yeah, there is a huge space penalty that I'm sure drives up the cost to have an onboard chip to record to, that would probably up the price about $1500 alone. But if Pro-rez is desired or required, files can be easily converted to Pro-Rez with a program such as Shutter Encoder. Also... Other than the big three: Final Cut, Premier and Davinci, will the other budget NLE's be able to deal with Pro-Rez encoded files?

ProRes is definitely not for everyone. Most won't need it. But all of the software you mentioned already support it. But it is a memory hog for sure. PreRes HD is nothing new, it's just new to the Mavic line.

 

[Deleted member 137163]

Makes me wonder what a single battery will cost?

Good point! If money grew on trees I would be in!

 

[sar104]

It's from my discussions with FAA folks on the subject.

I'd be interested to know exactly what their take is on this point - inadvertent omission or deliberate? Considerable care seems to go into crafting these things, and I've yet to see a case of FAA regulations not meaning exactly what they say, even when the wording seems strange or clumsy at first sight.

Correct, but as you mentioned in the other post, RPIC and VO must have the ability to maintain VLOS, so this is basically moot.

Agreed.

 

[Dizzy1971]

Makes me wonder what a single battery will cost?

200bux here in Canada at least

 

[Dougcjohn]

For me the curiosity of what they'd come up with next was intriguing. For me, my biggest gripe with DJI drones has been their geofencing scheme. This should not exist in a professional level drone. While the M2P is not on the same level as the Inspire (does Inspire have geofencing too???) the most frustrating thing I've experienced has been, on paid gigs, to have to deal with geofencing issues prior to the job, often initially without full success of unlocking.

Obviously if someone has got some volume business the cost isn't so terrible as it's a write off and the business should cover the extra expense. But there are other considerations too. Crash/loss insurance. Look at what DJI charges for their FPV both on the front end and with replacement. Will they cover loss too with the M3? We all know it's not if but when and how bad... and how much$...

... And how much better will the images be? Ok, if you're shooting for Cecil B. it's probably a great investment if you can't afford a giant platform with a Red attached. If you're shooting for a 4k corporate video, is it going to give you that much of an advantage? Ok... so it's got a zoom lens on it. I think I would be more inclined to get an Air2s if the EVO3 is too expensive, or that. Again, my biggest fear with DJI is it's ability to "brick" one's drone at the most inopportune time. It doesn't matter if you're going to fly 5 feet off the ground in your back yard, but if you're in one of those odd NFZ's it's just an unnecessary hassle that no other drone company bothers with.

Will DJI keep the M2's in production? There seems to be a huge jump between the Air2s and the M3. But if I could ignore the geofencing I might be more inclined to go with an Air2s rather than an M3. The pictures I've seen from that drone are stunning and the only thing it lacks IMO is variable aperture.

About Pro-rez... Yeah, there is a huge space penalty that I'm sure drives up the cost to have an onboard chip to record to, that would probably up the price about $1500 alone. But if Pro-rez is desired or required, files can be easily converted to Pro-Rez with a program such as Shutter Encoder. Also... Other than the big three: Final Cut, Premier and Davinci, will the other budget NLE's be able to deal with Pro-Rez encoded files?

Different subject, but there is a very low cost solution to end the geozone issues in M2's and MA2's. The I2 has multiple ways to end the Geozone issue especially since it hasn’t received new FW for sometime.

If GeoZone is a primary anti-DJI issue... there are functional work arounds... that may not be applicable to M3 series. One advantage to an older platform. Newer models in all Brands will eventually become more restrictive.

That said, the EVO 2 Ent and EVO 3 are definitely worth watching and considering... I'd agree with you there.

 

[Vic Moss]

I'd be interested to know exactly what their take is on this point - inadvertent omission or deliberate? Considerable care seems to go into crafting these things, and I've yet to see a case of FAA regulations not meaning exactly what they say, even when the wording seems strange or clumsy at first sight.

Probably necessary clarification thanks to the vague language given to them by the FAA. In 2016 the language wasn't up to the current level of interpretation and knowledge we have now. Hence the need for continual interpretation.

 

[jencarta]

My boss gave the OK to buy the Fly More Combo yesterday for work but then one of my coworkers got nervous about the recent talk about government restrictions on using Chinese drones. We do a lot of work for NOAA, USCG, and USFWS. I spent hours yesterday researching the issue including threads on this forum to assure them it’s still worth getting the Mavic 3. We need another drone in our fleet and I think it will be a great upgrade for us from the Mavic 2 Pro we already have and will continue to use.

We use it mostly for hurricane and oil spill response. Longer battery life and a secondary camera with zoom! Though we fly over water a lot and so I wonder how the improved sensors and RTH will behave in that situation. I assume there is a hand launch and catch feature since it uses the Fly app? And will it be able to do waypoint flying? That is an absolute must for us. I hope they release the SDK right away.

 

[Dougcjohn]

About Pro-rez... Yeah, there is a huge space penalty that I'm sure drives up the cost to have an onboard chip to record to, that would probably up the price about $1500 alone. But if Pro-rez is desired or required, files can be easily converted to Pro-Rez with a program such as Shutter Encoder. Also... Other than the big three: Final Cut, Premier and Davinci, will the other budget NLE's be able to deal with Pro-Rez encoded files?

Interesting... I hadn't heard of a convertor that upgraded media to ProRes. The quality improved sounds questionable, it may convert the media to ProRes format but the depth, bit level, and uncompressed detail I don't see that being recaptured.

Upscaling such as with Topaz Video Enhance does work nicely and Resizing small photos also works nicely (On1 Resize & Topaz GigaPixel)... this one is new to me converting to ProRes.

 

[projectarjun]

This doesn't cost much to manufacture, but just like Apple products, people will be willing to shell out $$$$$ regardless. The batteries doesn't cost much to put together and yet DJI able to charge $$$$$ from their investors (us).

 

[sar104]

This doesn't cost much to manufacture, but just like Apple products, people will be willing to shell out $$$$$ regardless. The batteries doesn't cost much to put together and yet DJI able to charge $$$$$ from their investors (us).

I don't think you understand the component cost and development complexity of some of this equipment, and it is certainly not as cheap to design and manufacture as you seem to think. That goes for both Apple and DJI products.

 

[Dougcjohn]

My boss gave the OK to buy the Fly More Combo yesterday for work but then one of my coworkers got nervous about the recent talk about government restrictions on using Chinese drones. We do a lot of work for NOAA, USCG, and USFWS. I spent hours yesterday researching the issue including threads on this forum to assure them it’s still worth getting the Mavic 3. We need another drone in our fleet and I think it will be a great upgrade for us from the Mavic 2 Pro we already have and will continue to use.

We use it mostly for hurricane and oil spill response. Longer battery life and a secondary camera with zoom! Though we fly over water a lot and so I wonder how the improved sensors and RTH will behave in that situation. I assume there is a hand launch and catch feature since it uses the Fly app? And will it be able to do waypoint flying? That is an absolute must for us. I hope they release the SDK right away.

I may have lost track... haven't been into news as much lately.
Regarding Fed Govt Bans... that was proposed and bill introduced that generated several States and Business Entities to write there own version of Ban to so-call join the bandwagon.

Then later, the Fed Bill was voted down and not passed. There are several Govt entities and some Military still using and acquiring DJI or other Chinese drones.

Main Ban concern are individual Entities, not Fed Govt.

 

[projectarjun]

I don't think you understand the component cost and development complexity of some of this equipment, and it is certainly not as cheap to design and manufacture as you seem to think. That goes for both Apple and DJI products.

I do understand the complexity in cost and development, but I certainly feel DJI is taking advantage of loyal DJI customers that are willing to pay more than what they paid for the previous generation. Also, I feel like we all have been conditioned that the MSRP's for a lot of this equipment is perfectly fine. Wouldn't it have been fine to sell an upgraded camera for the Mavic 2 Pro?