Mavic mini and the new drone rules - UK

[scro]

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Following the CAA publication in April (link in post #1) that youtube video has become out of date. 2 crucial changes to note are changed implementation date (1/11/20) and shift from MTOM to "flying weight" Good video otherwise.

Acknowledged that registration will be required, even after the April update.

edit: Hah, beat me to it, @Alex2

 

[Alex2]

Following the CAA publication in April (link in post #1) that youtube video is out of date. 2 crucial changes to note are changed implementation date (1/11/20) and shift from MTOM to "flying weight"

Acknowledged that registration will be required, even after the April update.

edit: Hah, beat me to it, @Alex2

To be honest, when I originally saw this video, I did think it was clutching at straws that MTOM would ever apply to legacy craft, as this is a legal definition under the new regulations that must be provided by the manufacturer, i.e. DJI, for each aircraft.

This is something they have never actually provided for the MM, only an aircraft weight of 249 grams listed in the specification and user manual.

Edit: I've only recently purchased a MM, so have been following the upcoming changes to legislation closely!

 

[scro]

My thoughts too @Alex2 . There's no defined MTOM for the MM as of yet, and I don't think there will be. The legally accepted value for a drone's MTOM is to be provided by the manufacturer, i believe.

 

[Alex2]

My thoughts too @Alex2 . There's no defined MTOM for the MM as of yet, and I don't think there will be. The legally accepted value for a drone's MTOM is to be provided by the manufacturer, i believe.

@scro Agreed, which is most likely why the latest changes have been made.

 

[Zbip57]

Here in Canada our regulations consistently refer to "maximum takeoff weight", which I've always thought should be changed to the more relevant "maximum takeoff mass".

Weight and mass are not the same thing.

For example, you can build a zeppelin framed with heavy steel girders. The completed aircraft then has a measurable mass and weight. If you then fill the body of the aircraft with helium, the total mass increases slightly (taking into account the mass of the helium added), but it's weight decreases significantly.

In takeoff trim, like a hot air balloon, the massive zeppelin's weight becomes "lighter than air".

I'm curious why your CAA would now choose to change from using "mass" to instead using "weight" in their wording?

 

[scro]

Here in Canada our regulations consistently refer to "maximum takeoff weight", which I've always thought should be changed to the more relevant "maximum takeoff mass".

Weight and mass are not the same thing.

For example, you can build a zeppelin framed with heavy steel girders. The completed aircraft then has a measurable mass and weight. If you then fill the body of the aircraft with helium, the total mass increases slightly (taking into account the mass of the helium added), but it's weight decreases significantly.

In takeoff trim, like a hot air balloon, the massive zeppelin's weight becomes "lighter than air".

I'm curious why your CAA would now choose to change from using "mass" to instead using "weight" in their wording?

I'd pondered the same thought. Perhaps owners of legacy craft over 250g mass just need to get a suitably sized helium balloon tied onto their drones to bring their weight down enough to fly in the A1 category once these changes eventually become live ? .

 

[Alex2]

So will all the other DJI drones be obsolete except the MM?

All DJI drones other than the MM will be able to be flown essentially as per the current drone code.

 

[TDZHDTV]

To be honest, when I originally saw this video, I did think it was clutching at straws that MTOM would ever apply to legacy craft, as this is a legal definition under the new regulations that must be provided by the manufacturer, i.e. DJI, for each aircraft.

This is something they have never actually provided for the MM, only an aircraft weight of 249 grams listed in the specification and user manual.

Edit: I've only recently purchased a MM, so have been following the upcoming changes to legislation closely!

Good to know, cheers

 

[Skyfli]

All DJI drones other than the MM will be able to be flown essentially as per the current drone code.

Thanks! ??

So would that be A3 category?

 

[scro]

Thanks! ??

So would that be A3 category?

That's how I see it. Broadly the same as current rules, but a few subtle differences, such as the 150m distance becomes horizontal distance, so no more "bubbles" around things, rather "cylinders". There doesn't seem to be mention of 50m from individual buildings either.

 

[Alex2]

Thanks! ??

So would that be A3 category?

A3 subcategory for anything 250 grams or higher from July 2022.

 

[Zbip57]

Definition is given on pg8, last bullet point: The weight of the unmanned aircraft at any time while it is in flight
That to me means 249g (ignoring very slight variations) for the standard CE MM without any accessories, rather than 272g. 272g might be a fair assumption for the no-longer-applicable MTOM, though as the MM can fly with prop guards on

OMG. The penny just dropped. I didn't read it this way earlier.

So "flying weight" is the thing in its current condition while flying. The Mini weighs 249 grams so that's ok.

"Maximum takeoff weight" could be interpreted to mean something entirely different. Hypothetically speaking, if the Mini was still able to takeoff when carrying 1kg of extra payload [it's not!], but no more than that, bringing its total weight to 1,249g, then THAT is its maximum takeoff weight?

So even if you only ever fly it at it normal weight of only 249, just having the potential to carry more payload would put it over the "Maximum takeoff weight" category?

@#$! I wonder if anyone has ever interpreted "maximum takeoff weight" to mean the same thing here in Canada?

 

[scro]

I think the intention of the definition of MTOM in the EU draft rules is that it's a figure that the drone manufacturer specifies, which is the sensible maximum mass of drone+payload in a flyable and fully controllable condition. Similar to maximum weight of a road vehicle being vehicle+fuel+passengers+cargo. In both cases you could possibly go beyond that weight but it would start to more adversely affect handling and reliability.

 

[Skyfli]

What about the Tello..? 80g

I honestly think the CAA will be on their knees soon with the threat of their enitre industry ending in a huge collapse. Drones will either be the last thing on their minds Or dorne will be the only aircraft left.

 

[sli-woody]

I always fly my drone safely.
But has anyone run into any problems with the law? Would be good to hear some stories and what happened/
And are most of these changes really aimed towards commercial drone pilots#?
Everyone saying about the weight of their drones and how far you have to be away from "uninvolved" people, but I am yet to see the drone Police turn up with a pair of scales and tape measure.
As long as you fly safely and don't be a $%^& with your drone then you wont have any problems.

 

[Skyfli]

I always fly my drone safely.
But has anyone run into any problems with the law? Would be good to hear some stories and what happened/
And are most of these changes really aimed towards commercial drone pilots#?
Everyone saying about the weight of their drones and how far you have to be away from "uninvolved" people, but I am yet to see the drone Police turn up with a pair of scales and tape measure.
As long as you fly safely and don't be a $%^& with your drone then you wont have any problems.

They won't even turn up if you get mugged or house burgled. They are on their knees and also a large number of them are now millenial - who complain about being in danger at work...! A policeman in danger? Hmmm Isn't that par for the course - lol

 

[scro]

What about the Tello..? 80g

I honestly think the CAA will be on their knees soon with the threat of their enitre industry ending in a huge collapse. Drones will either be the last thing on their minds Or dorne will be the only aircraft left.

That might just start up a debate about what is a toy and what isn't

Controlling my tello directly from my phone it struggles to get even to 100m away without losing signal (definition says can't be flown more than 120m away). However, with a simple wifi repeater in my pocket it can get to 300m or more away while maintaining a good signal. Tello marketing aims it at kids as much as grown ups... so... toy or not a toy??

 

[TaylorL]

Does anyone know any good scenic flying spots around staffordshire. I have a mavic mini and i flew a bit near the Roaches as i wanted get some got shots of the rocky hills. But after reading about it the next day i’m unsure of the rules flying in the peak district. Can anyone help?

 

[scro]

Does anyone know any good scenic flying spots around staffordshire. I have a mavic mini and i flew a bit near the Roaches as i wanted get some got shots of the rocky hills. But after reading about it the next day i’m unsure of the rules flying in the peak district. Can anyone help?

Hi TaylorL, welcome to the forum! Try posting your question as a new thread, rather than at the end of a discussion about future drone regulations. That way all the forum get to see it, and not just people reading this thread

I guess you've read this already:

FAQs - Drones: Peak District National Park

Peak District National Park:

www.peakdistrict.gov.uk

 

[Lastrexking]

I always fly my drone safely.
But has anyone run into any problems with the law? Would be good to hear some stories and what happened/
And are most of these changes really aimed towards commercial drone pilots#?
Everyone saying about the weight of their drones and how far you have to be away from "uninvolved" people, but I am yet to see the drone Police turn up with a pair of scales and tape measure.
As long as you fly safely and don't be a $%^& with your drone then you wont have any problems.

I've had six run-ins with Police around the country. Four have been very easy to deal with, two not so much. On all six occasions I was flying as part of my job, and I work for the Government and have all of the required paperwork (and the weight of being a warrant card holder too) - but, they were still on one occasion threatening me with confiscating my gear.