Selling photos taken before I passed my 107 exam

BAGraphics · Nov 18, 2018

Hello all.I have been a ground based photographer for many years and just took up drone photography. I have many drone shots that I think are worthy of being sold. I know I can’t sell them without my 107 lic so I am studying f the test now and was wondering if, when I pass the dam, I can sell the photos taken before I got certified? I would hate to have beautiful shots that are in limbo and t “stop shooting” until passing as absurd.

I know I can delete my metadata to change the taken date but would not like to do that.

Anyone have some insight?

Thanks

sar104 · Nov 18, 2018

The FAA regulations care only about the intent of the flight at the time, making this a bit of a grey area. If you were just flying for fun when you took them then technically you could later sell them with or without a Part 107 certification. However - do that too much and the argument becomes less credible.

Once you actually have a Part 107 certification the same rules still apply to those previous flights, but it's really unlikely that anyone is going to pursue you over use of prior work.

Meta4 · Nov 18, 2018

BAGraphics said:
I am studying f the test now and was wondering if, when I pass the dam, I can sell the photos taken before I got certified? I would hate to have beautiful shots that are in limbo and t “stop shooting” until passing as absurd.
I know I can delete my metadata to change the taken date but would not like to do that.

Whether you sell the images or not won't make any difference to aviation safety or the FAA.

theDRONEranger · Nov 18, 2018

sar104 said:
The FAA regulations care only about the intent of the flight at the time, making this a bit of a grey area. If you were just flying for fun when you took them then technically you could later sell them with or without a Part 107 certification. However - do that too much and the argument becomes less credible.

Once you actually have a Part 107 certification the same rules still apply to those previous flights, but it's really unlikely that anyone is going to pursue you over use of prior work.

Spot on! I echo the thoughts.

frank candor · Nov 18, 2018

BAGraphics said:
Hello all.I have been a ground based photographer for many years and just took up drone photography. I have many drone shots that I think are worthy of being sold. I know I can’t sell them without my 107 lic so I am studying f the test now and was wondering if, when I pass the dam, I can sell the photos taken before I got certified? I would hate to have beautiful shots that are in limbo and t “stop shooting” until passing as absurd.

I know I can delete my metadata to change the taken date but would not like to do that.

Anyone have some insight?

Thanks

SHHHHHHHHHHH

Lady Rover · Nov 18, 2018

If you clear or change out the exif data, how will anyone know when you took them?

BAGraphics · Nov 18, 2018

Meta4 said:
Whether you sell the images or not won't make any difference to aviation safety or the FAA.

I agree though if you sell images or make any money with your drone flights without FAA approval (107) then you are breaking the law and can be fined.

sar104 · Nov 18, 2018

BAGraphics said:
I agree though if you sell images or make any money with your drone flights without FAA approval (107) then you are breaking the law and can be fined.

View attachment 53706

No - it's not that simple. What you cannot do without a Part 107 is fly for purposes other than recreational. So, for example, you cannot fly with the purpose of taking photos/video that you intend to try to sell or use in furtherance of a business. You cannot fly to support a search and rescue operation, even unpaid, because that's not recreational. But none of that precludes later selling material acquired on a genuinely recreational flight, provided that the intent, at the time, really was recreational.

ac0j · Nov 18, 2018

BAGraphics said:
I agree though if you sell images or make any money with your drone flights without FAA approval (107) then you are breaking the law and can be fined.

View attachment 53706

Do you have an example of that happening, EVER?

BAGraphics · Nov 18, 2018

ac0j said:
Do you have an example of that happening, EVER?

Nope, I do not. As with every law there needs to be a first time to enforce. I don’t want to be the first. I am a purely recreational flyer and I am also a photographer and shoot every time I fly. I do not run nor own nor work for a photography company but I have in the past and have numerous images hanging internationally and published. I would prefer to follow the law regardless if it is enforced or not.

Just so I know who asked this of me, do you have your 107 or do you make money without having it just because you don’t know of anyone who has beeen fined?

Bruce

BAGraphics · Nov 18, 2018

sar104 said:
No - it's not that simple. What you cannot do without a Part 107 is fly for purposes other than recreational. So, for example, you cannot fly with the purpose of taking photos/video that you intend to try to sell or use in furtherance of a business. You cannot fly to support a search and rescue operation, even unpaid, because that's not recreational. But none of that precludes later selling material acquired on a genuinely recreational flight, provided that the intent, at the time, really was recreational.

Not a business anymore but I do have many images being sold as stock and many fine art images still in galleries and museums.

Just wanted to make sure I know what the edge of the rules are so I can legally enjoy shooting and offering my images for sale.

Thanks
Bruce

ac0j · Nov 18, 2018

BAGraphics said:
Nope, I do not. As with every law there needs to be a first time to enforce. I don’t want to be the first. I am a purely recreational flyer and I am also a photographer and shoot every time I fly. I do not run nor own nor work for a photography company but I have in the past and have numerous images hanging internationally and published. I would prefer to follow the law regardless if it is enforced or not.

Just so I know who asked this of me, do you have your 107 or do you make money without having it just because you don’t know of anyone who has beeen fined?

Bruce

LOL! I bought a flying toy with a camera on it for fun. And to explore whatever area I am in (when free of people and aircraft) I dont need extra money bad enough to peddle whatever photos I may take for more or less a pittance. I dont take having any certificate or license as a badge of honor or to demand any kind of respect from anyone.
So, to answer your query, NO I do NOT have a 107 because I have NO INTENTION of going into the Photo and video business, EVER. There are hundreds of things that I can do to generate more income than is possible for me with a flying camera if needed.

BAGraphics said:
Not a business anymore but I do have many images being sold as stock and many fine art images still in galleries and museums.

Just wanted to make sure I know what the edge of the rules are so I can legally enjoy shooting and offering my images for sale.

Thanks
Bruce

Some one as Important as you shouldn't be skirting the edges of anything, YOU are REQUIRED by Federal LAW to hold a Part 107 to continue doing what you do ( ifwith a drone). OR to have done what you claim to have done (if with a drone). You should be ashamed and reported to authorities if that is the case.

Meta4 · Nov 18, 2018

BAGraphics said:
I agree though if you sell images or make any money with your drone flights without FAA approval (107) then you are breaking the law and can be fined.

It's always amusing to see the strict fundamentalist interpretations that come up whenever this topic pops up.
Compare that with the FAA's attitude to this most serious of crimes.
Exclusive: Only one drone pilot has ever been busted for flying without a license — and he got a warning

sar104 · Nov 18, 2018

Meta4 said:
It's always amusing to see the strict fundamentalist interpretations that come up whenever this topic pops up.
Compare that with the FAA's attitude to this most serious of crimes.
Exclusive: Only one drone pilot has ever been busted for flying without a license — and he got a warning

I think the OP is asking about the letter of the law, not his chances of evading capture if he breaks it.

Meta4 · Nov 18, 2018

sar104 said:
I think the OP is asking about the letter of the law, not his chances of evading capture if he breaks it.

And the letter of the law is about flying for commercial purposes, not selling old photos.

sar104 · Nov 18, 2018

Meta4 said:
And the letter of the law is about flying for commercial purposes, not selling old photos.

Agreed - as I pointed out in #2 and #8. Which is why I don't think the failure of the FAA to prosecute legitimate cases is the issue.

BAGraphics · Nov 18, 2018

ac0j said:
LOL! I bought a flying toy with a camera on it for fun. And to explore whatever area I am in (when free of people and aircraft) I dont need extra money bad enough to peddle whatever photos I may take for more or less a pittance. I dont take having any certificate or license as a badge of honor or to demand any kind of respect from anyone.
So, to answer your query, NO I do NOT have a 107 because I have NO INTENTION of going into the Photo and video business, EVER. There are hundreds of things that I can do to generate more income than is possible for me with a flying camera if needed.

Some one as Important as you shouldn't be skirting the edges of anything, YOU are REQUIRED by Federal LAW to hold a Part 107 to continue doing what you do ( ifwith a drone). OR to have done what you claim to have done (if with a drone). You should be ashamed and reported to authorities if that is the case.

What are you talking about? “Important as you”? Nice

Your attitude in answering my question was, well a bit “do what you want, I do and no one has gotten in trouble for it so far” and so my question to you. Badge of honor? What a joke. Being legal is what my question is all about.

I am asking about selling images I took with my drone after I get my 107 that I have been taking for the past few moths. The images I have sold in the past and the business I had was for my “ground based” photography. Has been from the past 20 years and none of them are drone based. Maybe you misunderstood what I wrote and didn’t comprehend my question.

People who have purchased my images over the past 20 years have seen my drone work and are wondering when I will start selling them, I tell them I don’t have my 107 yet and so can’t sell what I produce from my drone. This is why I am asking my question, Once I get my 107, can I sell the drone images I have shot from before I my 107 was in place. Is the permission to sell retroactive?

Hope this is more clear.

Bruce

BAGraphics · Nov 18, 2018

sar104 said:
I think the OP is asking about the letter of the law, not his chances of evading capture if he breaks it.

Yep... Yu understood my question

I was asking because some of the people who have been buying my photography from my fine art business have seen my drone work and were asking if I was going to be selling any. I like to know the law, not being told “well have you ever heard of anyone getting in trouble for XXXX”

If people don’t know the answer, they should just say so.

Thanks
Bruce

BAGraphics · Nov 18, 2018

sar104 said:
No - it's not that simple. What you cannot do without a Part 107 is fly for purposes other than recreational. So, for example, you cannot fly with the purpose of taking photos/video that you intend to try to sell or use in furtherance of a business. You cannot fly to support a search and rescue operation, even unpaid, because that's not recreational. But none of that precludes later selling material acquired on a genuinely recreational flight, provided that the intent, at the time, really was recreational.

That’s what I thought. Thank you. I would hate it if I was not able to sell work from before I was legal.

I have been talking with a local police officer, who is also a drone lover about using drones for police work and he said that once he gets his dept to ok drone use and I get my lic, we will talk about “extra work”. We both agreed that this is a pipe dream but one never knows......

Good thing I have a fantastic day job and drone flying is a great hobby, as is photography. I have been in and out of the photo business for the past many years and can easily use it if I ever needed to.

Thanks again

Bruce